Guest Unknown Posted August 17, 2008 Posted August 17, 2008 Re: Why does MS force me to reactivate XP PRO? MS needs to protect themselves from people like you. "Alias" <iamalias@gmailREMOVE.com> wrote in message news:g8914v$uha$1@aioe.org... > WindPipe wrote: >> "mcullet" <mcullet@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message >> news:DD449FA6-95AD-4BBA-ADC8-0C4FC84CDF80@microsoft.com... >> >>> Game on MS ... I'm not happy and I do not appreciate being >>> inconvenienced >>> without due cause. >>> >>> Watch this space ... >>> >> >> You're Hilarious. Truly. >> >> Pick up the phone and activate, it will all be over soon after that. >> >> - WindPipe > > It's not a question of time spent or how much hassle is involved. It's the > principle that is bothersome: MS assumes you're a pirate until you prove > otherwise over and over and over and over again. Of course, the MS fanboys > like you react with a "How high?" when MS says "Jump!". > > Alias
Guest Alias Posted August 17, 2008 Posted August 17, 2008 Re: Why does MS force me to reactivate XP PRO? Unknown wrote: > The real question is: Why does it bother YOU? That's obvious; I don't like being accused of piracy when I have bought the product. I especially don't like being accused over and over and over again. As an example, once I had a problem with my NIC and ended up having to change it. I had to activate not once, not twice but five times before it would accept the fact that changing a NIC does not a pirate make. I was frustrated enough with the NIC problem that the LAST thing I needed was to have to jump through the WPA hoop FIVE times. Alias > "Alias" <iamalias@gmailREMOVE.com> wrote in message > news:g890r9$m8u$6@aioe.org... >> PA Bear [MS MVP] wrote: >>> Yeah, the button you always hit when you hijack someone else's thread to >>> grind your axe. >> Not my ax, hoss. It's Microsoft that assumes you are guilty of piracy >> until you prove otherwise. If that doesn't bother you, there's something >> wrong with you and you've obviously been brainwashed to react with a "how >> high?" when MS says "jump". >> >> Alias >>> Alias wrote: >>>> PA Bear [MS MVP] wrote: >>>>> Butt out, Alias. >>>> My, what a convincing argument! LOL! Hit a button, did I? >>>> >>>> Alias >>>>> Alias wrote: >>>>>> PA Bear [MS MVP] wrote: >>>>>>> In the time it took you to write your post, you could have called a >>>>>>> toll-free number and reactivated. >>>>>> Not the point. >>>>>> >>>>>>> Description of Microsoft Product Activation: >>>>>>> http://support.microsoft.com/kb/302806 >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> For any legal minded folk, the onus of proof shifts from presumption >>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> innocence to presumption of guilt. I have to prove innocence. MS >>>>>>>> need do >>>>>>>> nothing apparently - their work is done having caught me in a >>>>>>>> criminal >>>>>>>> act >>>>>>>> of BIOS altering without their permission or consent. >>>>>>> Have you read your WinXP EULA lately? >>>>>> You mean the one that if you don't agree with it you can't get your >>>>>> money back, that one? How many people who bought a preinstalled copy >>>>>> of >>>>>> XP on a new computer got the chance to read it before accepting it or >>>>>> is >>>>>> the acceptance assumed when they purchase the system? >>>>>> >>>>>> WPA and WGA only serve to inconvenience paying customers and do >>>>>> absolutely nothing to stop piracy. >>>>>> >>>>>> Alias >>>>>>> >>>>>>> mcullet wrote: >>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I do not endorse piracy. You use it - you pay for it. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> MS has a legitimate right to protect their commercial interests. >>>>>>>> It's >>>>>>>> one >>>>>>>> of those self evident statements that are tough to argue against. >>>>>>>> However, >>>>>>>> as with all things the devil is in the detail. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> MS Does not have the right to kick down my door at 3 am to see if I >>>>>>>> have a >>>>>>>> COA on hand. Sounds absurd? How about this? MS decides I'm a >>>>>>>> pirate >>>>>>>> (might be a pirate?) and unilaterally pulls the pin on XP PRO after >>>>>>>> 3 >>>>>>>> days >>>>>>>> UNLESS I behave like a good little sheep and do as I'm told (see >>>>>>>> Pavlov)? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> The problem with large organisations (and government) is that they >>>>>>>> need to >>>>>>>> be reminded once in a while that they are not all powerful and they >>>>>>>> do >>>>>>>> not >>>>>>>> have unqualified control (power / authority / legal rights) over >>>>>>>> what we >>>>>>>> do. >>>>>>>> Staying only with MS, the issue is one of enforcement of contractual >>>>>>>> obligations: essentially enforcement of promises. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I legally purchased an XP PRO licence and have used it strictly in >>>>>>>> accord >>>>>>>> with the licence agreement. Software changes, as we are all to >>>>>>>> familiar >>>>>>>> with observing. These occur because of an amalgam of bug fixes, >>>>>>>> security >>>>>>>> patches and evolution (feature enhancement or deprecation). The >>>>>>>> hardware >>>>>>>> environment is more likely to change as the machine ages. I'll >>>>>>>> leave it >>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>> others to determine at what point the original PC changes >>>>>>>> sufficiently to >>>>>>>> warrant paying for another licence but this issue is central to MS >>>>>>>> dilemma >>>>>>>> and needs wide debate. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> MS abuse their positon every time they unjustifiably force a user to >>>>>>>> reactivate their legally purchased software. In legal terms, they >>>>>>>> are in >>>>>>>> breach of contract because they unilaterally terminate the agreement >>>>>>>> by >>>>>>>> rendering the OS unusable. If I wanted to be an idiot I could waste >>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>> life >>>>>>>> getting MS to play the reactivation game 24 / 7. I have more >>>>>>>> interesting >>>>>>>> things to do. However, this is the absurd position MS force upon >>>>>>>> legitimate >>>>>>>> customers and themselves because they (MS) distributed flawed >>>>>>>> security >>>>>>>> controls in their operating system - XP PRO. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> The definition of flawed is to be interpretted in its natural >>>>>>>> meaning. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I changed no hardware on my PC. Not one piece of hardware was added >>>>>>>> or >>>>>>>> removed excluding inter alia, as required, attchment of USB drives / >>>>>>>> printeres. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I altered a bios setting. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> This heinous act triggered MS's software control systems which >>>>>>>> 'determined' >>>>>>>> that I had breached my contractual agreement with MS: I've been >>>>>>>> given a >>>>>>>> generous 3 days to fix the problem (re-activate) or MS will >>>>>>>> functionally >>>>>>>> challenge my lawful ability to enjoy my XP licence INCLUDING all >>>>>>>> other >>>>>>>> functions and features (games / internet / documents / commercial >>>>>>>> applications etc). This is distrubingly, ominously reminisent of >>>>>>>> Orwellian >>>>>>>> logic (courtesy of 1984): "double speak". The MS security control >>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>> triggered ergo I am a criminal until I prove otherwise. The control >>>>>>>> would >>>>>>>> not have triggered unless I was in breach of my contract with MS >>>>>>>> (logic >>>>>>>> loop). >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> For any legal minded folk, the onus of proof shifts from presumption >>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> innocence to presumption of guilt. I have to prove innocence. MS >>>>>>>> need do >>>>>>>> nothing apparently - their work is done having caught me in a >>>>>>>> criminal >>>>>>>> act >>>>>>>> of BIOS altering without their permission or consent. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sorry. The only thing wrong is with MS's flawed anti-piracy >>>>>>>> efforts. >>>>>>>> Unless I do what MS tell me (reactivate) then I am at fault. >>>>>>>> "Honest >>>>>>>> people >>>>>>>> won't object ... just the pirates." Yeah - pigs fly. I'm seriously >>>>>>>> annoyed >>>>>>>> and about to be seriously inconvenienced by a party to a software >>>>>>>> contract >>>>>>>> imposing additional costs (consideration) upon me after a legal >>>>>>>> contract >>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>> executed. I have no remedy other than take MS to court. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On the other hand, using purely lawful means, I can bring this >>>>>>>> absurdity >>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>> the attention of the media who love bashing MS and let them feed on >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>> company. Bad publicity for bad practices ... seems to be an elegant >>>>>>>> balance >>>>>>>> of karma. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> MS - I am not a pirate but a lawful and legal customer. I've done >>>>>>>> nothing >>>>>>>> wrong. You do not have any right to terminate my lawful enjoyment >>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> this >>>>>>>> software (XP PRO) and your efforts to do so are called conversion - >>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>> tort. >>>>>>>> It is actionable per se which means I do not need to prove anything >>>>>>>> other >>>>>>>> than that this has happened. MS's legal defences are limited and in >>>>>>>> context, none apply. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> So, how inconvenient would it be for me to take MS to court for >>>>>>>> trespass >>>>>>>> property and or breach of contract? To me - not much. Like I said, >>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>> need >>>>>>>> only prove MS has interfered with the lawful enjoyment of my >>>>>>>> software >>>>>>>> licence. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Why not just call MS and sort it out? Well, I've done nothing >>>>>>>> wrong. >>>>>>>> I've >>>>>>>> paid for the licence. Phone calls aren't free nor is my time or the >>>>>>>> inconvenience to me. I anticipate I may make a few adjustments to >>>>>>>> BIOS >>>>>>>> settings / hardware configuration (swapping SATA drives in / out >>>>>>>> etc) ... >>>>>>>> system performance tweaking. If i activate then I will be forced to >>>>>>>> call >>>>>>>> MS >>>>>>>> (big brother) to calm them down and get their OK to live a normal >>>>>>>> life. >>>>>>>> Good grief ... people have become too hesitant to speak out against >>>>>>>> absurd >>>>>>>> commercial practices that intrude too far into our lives. I'm not a >>>>>>>> sheep >>>>>>>> nor an evangelist ... just one annoyed customer who has finally had >>>>>>>> enough >>>>>>>> of this crap. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Game on MS ... I'm not happy and I do not appreciate being >>>>>>>> inconvenienced >>>>>>>> without due cause. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Watch this space ... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Mike >>>>>>>> Australia > >
Guest Alias Posted August 17, 2008 Posted August 17, 2008 Re: Why does MS force me to reactivate XP PRO? Unknown wrote: > MS needs to protect themselves from people like you. Another top posting MS fanboy having the typical knee-jerk reaction: don't comment on content, insult the poster. Alias > "Alias" <iamalias@gmailREMOVE.com> wrote in message > news:g8914v$uha$1@aioe.org... >> WindPipe wrote: >>> "mcullet" <mcullet@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message >>> news:DD449FA6-95AD-4BBA-ADC8-0C4FC84CDF80@microsoft.com... >>> >>>> Game on MS ... I'm not happy and I do not appreciate being >>>> inconvenienced >>>> without due cause. >>>> >>>> Watch this space ... >>>> >>> You're Hilarious. Truly. >>> >>> Pick up the phone and activate, it will all be over soon after that. >>> >>> - WindPipe >> It's not a question of time spent or how much hassle is involved. It's the >> principle that is bothersome: MS assumes you're a pirate until you prove >> otherwise over and over and over and over again. Of course, the MS fanboys >> like you react with a "How high?" when MS says "Jump!". >> >> Alias > >
Guest Unknown Posted August 17, 2008 Posted August 17, 2008 Re: Why does MS force me to reactivate XP PRO? IN LINE! "Alias" <iamalias@gmailREMOVE.com> wrote in message news:g89gh9$b0k$1@aioe.org... > Unknown wrote: >> The real question is: Why does it bother YOU? > > That's obvious; I don't like being accused of piracy when I have bought > the product. Who accused you? Is it in your mind? I especially don't like being accused over and over and > over again. How many times? Your imagination? As an example, once I had a problem with my NIC and ended up > having to change it. I had to activate not once, not twice but five times > before it would accept the fact that changing a NIC does not a pirate > make. Does reactivating really hurt your ego that much? Calm down and go with the flow. I was frustrated enough with the NIC problem that the LAST > thing I needed was to have to jump through the WPA hoop FIVE times. You must be extremely nervous. With that characteristic why do you have a computer? > > Alias >> "Alias" <iamalias@gmailREMOVE.com> wrote in message >> news:g890r9$m8u$6@aioe.org... >>> PA Bear [MS MVP] wrote: >>>> Yeah, the button you always hit when you hijack someone else's thread >>>> to grind your axe. >>> Not my ax, hoss. It's Microsoft that assumes you are guilty of piracy >>> until you prove otherwise. If that doesn't bother you, there's something >>> wrong with you and you've obviously been brainwashed to react with a >>> "how high?" when MS says "jump". >>> >>> Alias >>>> Alias wrote: >>>>> PA Bear [MS MVP] wrote: >>>>>> Butt out, Alias. >>>>> My, what a convincing argument! LOL! Hit a button, did I? >>>>> >>>>> Alias >>>>>> Alias wrote: >>>>>>> PA Bear [MS MVP] wrote: >>>>>>>> In the time it took you to write your post, you could have called a >>>>>>>> toll-free number and reactivated. >>>>>>> Not the point. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Description of Microsoft Product Activation: >>>>>>>> http://support.microsoft.com/kb/302806 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> For any legal minded folk, the onus of proof shifts from >>>>>>>>> presumption of >>>>>>>>> innocence to presumption of guilt. I have to prove innocence. MS >>>>>>>>> need do >>>>>>>>> nothing apparently - their work is done having caught me in a >>>>>>>>> criminal >>>>>>>>> act >>>>>>>>> of BIOS altering without their permission or consent. >>>>>>>> Have you read your WinXP EULA lately? >>>>>>> You mean the one that if you don't agree with it you can't get your >>>>>>> money back, that one? How many people who bought a preinstalled copy >>>>>>> of >>>>>>> XP on a new computer got the chance to read it before accepting it >>>>>>> or is >>>>>>> the acceptance assumed when they purchase the system? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> WPA and WGA only serve to inconvenience paying customers and do >>>>>>> absolutely nothing to stop piracy. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Alias >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> mcullet wrote: >>>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I do not endorse piracy. You use it - you pay for it. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> MS has a legitimate right to protect their commercial interests. >>>>>>>>> It's >>>>>>>>> one >>>>>>>>> of those self evident statements that are tough to argue against. >>>>>>>>> However, >>>>>>>>> as with all things the devil is in the detail. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> MS Does not have the right to kick down my door at 3 am to see if >>>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>> have a >>>>>>>>> COA on hand. Sounds absurd? How about this? MS decides I'm a >>>>>>>>> pirate >>>>>>>>> (might be a pirate?) and unilaterally pulls the pin on XP PRO >>>>>>>>> after 3 >>>>>>>>> days >>>>>>>>> UNLESS I behave like a good little sheep and do as I'm told (see >>>>>>>>> Pavlov)? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> The problem with large organisations (and government) is that they >>>>>>>>> need to >>>>>>>>> be reminded once in a while that they are not all powerful and >>>>>>>>> they do >>>>>>>>> not >>>>>>>>> have unqualified control (power / authority / legal rights) over >>>>>>>>> what we >>>>>>>>> do. >>>>>>>>> Staying only with MS, the issue is one of enforcement of >>>>>>>>> contractual >>>>>>>>> obligations: essentially enforcement of promises. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I legally purchased an XP PRO licence and have used it strictly in >>>>>>>>> accord >>>>>>>>> with the licence agreement. Software changes, as we are all to >>>>>>>>> familiar >>>>>>>>> with observing. These occur because of an amalgam of bug fixes, >>>>>>>>> security >>>>>>>>> patches and evolution (feature enhancement or deprecation). The >>>>>>>>> hardware >>>>>>>>> environment is more likely to change as the machine ages. I'll >>>>>>>>> leave it >>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>> others to determine at what point the original PC changes >>>>>>>>> sufficiently to >>>>>>>>> warrant paying for another licence but this issue is central to MS >>>>>>>>> dilemma >>>>>>>>> and needs wide debate. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> MS abuse their positon every time they unjustifiably force a user >>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>> reactivate their legally purchased software. In legal terms, they >>>>>>>>> are in >>>>>>>>> breach of contract because they unilaterally terminate the >>>>>>>>> agreement by >>>>>>>>> rendering the OS unusable. If I wanted to be an idiot I could >>>>>>>>> waste my >>>>>>>>> life >>>>>>>>> getting MS to play the reactivation game 24 / 7. I have more >>>>>>>>> interesting >>>>>>>>> things to do. However, this is the absurd position MS force upon >>>>>>>>> legitimate >>>>>>>>> customers and themselves because they (MS) distributed flawed >>>>>>>>> security >>>>>>>>> controls in their operating system - XP PRO. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> The definition of flawed is to be interpretted in its natural >>>>>>>>> meaning. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I changed no hardware on my PC. Not one piece of hardware was >>>>>>>>> added or >>>>>>>>> removed excluding inter alia, as required, attchment of USB drives >>>>>>>>> / >>>>>>>>> printeres. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I altered a bios setting. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> This heinous act triggered MS's software control systems which >>>>>>>>> 'determined' >>>>>>>>> that I had breached my contractual agreement with MS: I've been >>>>>>>>> given a >>>>>>>>> generous 3 days to fix the problem (re-activate) or MS will >>>>>>>>> functionally >>>>>>>>> challenge my lawful ability to enjoy my XP licence INCLUDING all >>>>>>>>> other >>>>>>>>> functions and features (games / internet / documents / commercial >>>>>>>>> applications etc). This is distrubingly, ominously reminisent of >>>>>>>>> Orwellian >>>>>>>>> logic (courtesy of 1984): "double speak". The MS security control >>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>> triggered ergo I am a criminal until I prove otherwise. The >>>>>>>>> control >>>>>>>>> would >>>>>>>>> not have triggered unless I was in breach of my contract with MS >>>>>>>>> (logic >>>>>>>>> loop). >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> For any legal minded folk, the onus of proof shifts from >>>>>>>>> presumption of >>>>>>>>> innocence to presumption of guilt. I have to prove innocence. MS >>>>>>>>> need do >>>>>>>>> nothing apparently - their work is done having caught me in a >>>>>>>>> criminal >>>>>>>>> act >>>>>>>>> of BIOS altering without their permission or consent. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Sorry. The only thing wrong is with MS's flawed anti-piracy >>>>>>>>> efforts. >>>>>>>>> Unless I do what MS tell me (reactivate) then I am at fault. >>>>>>>>> "Honest >>>>>>>>> people >>>>>>>>> won't object ... just the pirates." Yeah - pigs fly. I'm >>>>>>>>> seriously >>>>>>>>> annoyed >>>>>>>>> and about to be seriously inconvenienced by a party to a software >>>>>>>>> contract >>>>>>>>> imposing additional costs (consideration) upon me after a legal >>>>>>>>> contract >>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>> executed. I have no remedy other than take MS to court. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On the other hand, using purely lawful means, I can bring this >>>>>>>>> absurdity >>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>> the attention of the media who love bashing MS and let them feed >>>>>>>>> on the >>>>>>>>> company. Bad publicity for bad practices ... seems to be an >>>>>>>>> elegant >>>>>>>>> balance >>>>>>>>> of karma. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> MS - I am not a pirate but a lawful and legal customer. I've done >>>>>>>>> nothing >>>>>>>>> wrong. You do not have any right to terminate my lawful enjoyment >>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>> this >>>>>>>>> software (XP PRO) and your efforts to do so are called >>>>>>>>> conversion - a >>>>>>>>> tort. >>>>>>>>> It is actionable per se which means I do not need to prove >>>>>>>>> anything >>>>>>>>> other >>>>>>>>> than that this has happened. MS's legal defences are limited and >>>>>>>>> in >>>>>>>>> context, none apply. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> So, how inconvenient would it be for me to take MS to court for >>>>>>>>> trespass >>>>>>>>> property and or breach of contract? To me - not much. Like I >>>>>>>>> said, I >>>>>>>>> need >>>>>>>>> only prove MS has interfered with the lawful enjoyment of my >>>>>>>>> software >>>>>>>>> licence. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Why not just call MS and sort it out? Well, I've done nothing >>>>>>>>> wrong. >>>>>>>>> I've >>>>>>>>> paid for the licence. Phone calls aren't free nor is my time or >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> inconvenience to me. I anticipate I may make a few adjustments to >>>>>>>>> BIOS >>>>>>>>> settings / hardware configuration (swapping SATA drives in / out >>>>>>>>> etc) ... >>>>>>>>> system performance tweaking. If i activate then I will be forced >>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>> call >>>>>>>>> MS >>>>>>>>> (big brother) to calm them down and get their OK to live a normal >>>>>>>>> life. >>>>>>>>> Good grief ... people have become too hesitant to speak out >>>>>>>>> against >>>>>>>>> absurd >>>>>>>>> commercial practices that intrude too far into our lives. I'm not >>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>> sheep >>>>>>>>> nor an evangelist ... just one annoyed customer who has finally >>>>>>>>> had >>>>>>>>> enough >>>>>>>>> of this crap. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Game on MS ... I'm not happy and I do not appreciate being >>>>>>>>> inconvenienced >>>>>>>>> without due cause. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Watch this space ... >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Mike >>>>>>>>> Australia >>
Guest Unknown Posted August 17, 2008 Posted August 17, 2008 Re: Why does MS force me to reactivate XP PRO? You deserve every bit of it! Get a life! "Alias" <iamalias@gmailREMOVE.com> wrote in message news:g89gkm$b0k$2@aioe.org... > Unknown wrote: >> MS needs to protect themselves from people like you. > > Another top posting MS fanboy having the typical knee-jerk reaction: don't > comment on content, insult the poster. > > Alias >> "Alias" <iamalias@gmailREMOVE.com> wrote in message >> news:g8914v$uha$1@aioe.org... >>> WindPipe wrote: >>>> "mcullet" <mcullet@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message >>>> news:DD449FA6-95AD-4BBA-ADC8-0C4FC84CDF80@microsoft.com... >>>> >>>>> Game on MS ... I'm not happy and I do not appreciate being >>>>> inconvenienced >>>>> without due cause. >>>>> >>>>> Watch this space ... >>>>> >>>> You're Hilarious. Truly. >>>> >>>> Pick up the phone and activate, it will all be over soon after that. >>>> >>>> - WindPipe >>> It's not a question of time spent or how much hassle is involved. It's >>> the principle that is bothersome: MS assumes you're a pirate until you >>> prove otherwise over and over and over and over again. Of course, the MS >>> fanboys like you react with a "How high?" when MS says "Jump!". >>> >>> Alias >>
Guest Alias Posted August 17, 2008 Posted August 17, 2008 Re: Why does MS force me to reactivate XP PRO? Unknown wrote: > IN LINE! > "Alias" <iamalias@gmailREMOVE.com> wrote in message > news:g89gh9$b0k$1@aioe.org... >> Unknown wrote: >>> The real question is: Why does it bother YOU? >> That's obvious; I don't like being accused of piracy when I have bought >> the product. > Who accused you? Is it in your mind? > I especially don't like being accused over and over and >> over again. > How many times? Your imagination? > As an example, once I had a problem with my NIC and ended up >> having to change it. I had to activate not once, not twice but five times >> before it would accept the fact that changing a NIC does not a pirate >> make. > Does reactivating really hurt your ego that much? Calm down and go with the > flow. > I was frustrated enough with the NIC problem that the LAST >> thing I needed was to have to jump through the WPA hoop FIVE times. > You must be extremely nervous. With that characteristic why do you have a > computer? More insults, no comment on content. Ho hum. Alias > >> Alias >>> "Alias" <iamalias@gmailREMOVE.com> wrote in message >>> news:g890r9$m8u$6@aioe.org... >>>> PA Bear [MS MVP] wrote: >>>>> Yeah, the button you always hit when you hijack someone else's thread >>>>> to grind your axe. >>>> Not my ax, hoss. It's Microsoft that assumes you are guilty of piracy >>>> until you prove otherwise. If that doesn't bother you, there's something >>>> wrong with you and you've obviously been brainwashed to react with a >>>> "how high?" when MS says "jump". >>>> >>>> Alias >>>>> Alias wrote: >>>>>> PA Bear [MS MVP] wrote: >>>>>>> Butt out, Alias. >>>>>> My, what a convincing argument! LOL! Hit a button, did I? >>>>>> >>>>>> Alias >>>>>>> Alias wrote: >>>>>>>> PA Bear [MS MVP] wrote: >>>>>>>>> In the time it took you to write your post, you could have called a >>>>>>>>> toll-free number and reactivated. >>>>>>>> Not the point. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Description of Microsoft Product Activation: >>>>>>>>> http://support.microsoft.com/kb/302806 >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> For any legal minded folk, the onus of proof shifts from >>>>>>>>>> presumption of >>>>>>>>>> innocence to presumption of guilt. I have to prove innocence. MS >>>>>>>>>> need do >>>>>>>>>> nothing apparently - their work is done having caught me in a >>>>>>>>>> criminal >>>>>>>>>> act >>>>>>>>>> of BIOS altering without their permission or consent. >>>>>>>>> Have you read your WinXP EULA lately? >>>>>>>> You mean the one that if you don't agree with it you can't get your >>>>>>>> money back, that one? How many people who bought a preinstalled copy >>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> XP on a new computer got the chance to read it before accepting it >>>>>>>> or is >>>>>>>> the acceptance assumed when they purchase the system? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> WPA and WGA only serve to inconvenience paying customers and do >>>>>>>> absolutely nothing to stop piracy. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Alias >>>>>>>>> mcullet wrote: >>>>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I do not endorse piracy. You use it - you pay for it. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> MS has a legitimate right to protect their commercial interests. >>>>>>>>>> It's >>>>>>>>>> one >>>>>>>>>> of those self evident statements that are tough to argue against. >>>>>>>>>> However, >>>>>>>>>> as with all things the devil is in the detail. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> MS Does not have the right to kick down my door at 3 am to see if >>>>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>>> have a >>>>>>>>>> COA on hand. Sounds absurd? How about this? MS decides I'm a >>>>>>>>>> pirate >>>>>>>>>> (might be a pirate?) and unilaterally pulls the pin on XP PRO >>>>>>>>>> after 3 >>>>>>>>>> days >>>>>>>>>> UNLESS I behave like a good little sheep and do as I'm told (see >>>>>>>>>> Pavlov)? >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> The problem with large organisations (and government) is that they >>>>>>>>>> need to >>>>>>>>>> be reminded once in a while that they are not all powerful and >>>>>>>>>> they do >>>>>>>>>> not >>>>>>>>>> have unqualified control (power / authority / legal rights) over >>>>>>>>>> what we >>>>>>>>>> do. >>>>>>>>>> Staying only with MS, the issue is one of enforcement of >>>>>>>>>> contractual >>>>>>>>>> obligations: essentially enforcement of promises. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I legally purchased an XP PRO licence and have used it strictly in >>>>>>>>>> accord >>>>>>>>>> with the licence agreement. Software changes, as we are all to >>>>>>>>>> familiar >>>>>>>>>> with observing. These occur because of an amalgam of bug fixes, >>>>>>>>>> security >>>>>>>>>> patches and evolution (feature enhancement or deprecation). The >>>>>>>>>> hardware >>>>>>>>>> environment is more likely to change as the machine ages. I'll >>>>>>>>>> leave it >>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>> others to determine at what point the original PC changes >>>>>>>>>> sufficiently to >>>>>>>>>> warrant paying for another licence but this issue is central to MS >>>>>>>>>> dilemma >>>>>>>>>> and needs wide debate. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> MS abuse their positon every time they unjustifiably force a user >>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>> reactivate their legally purchased software. In legal terms, they >>>>>>>>>> are in >>>>>>>>>> breach of contract because they unilaterally terminate the >>>>>>>>>> agreement by >>>>>>>>>> rendering the OS unusable. If I wanted to be an idiot I could >>>>>>>>>> waste my >>>>>>>>>> life >>>>>>>>>> getting MS to play the reactivation game 24 / 7. I have more >>>>>>>>>> interesting >>>>>>>>>> things to do. However, this is the absurd position MS force upon >>>>>>>>>> legitimate >>>>>>>>>> customers and themselves because they (MS) distributed flawed >>>>>>>>>> security >>>>>>>>>> controls in their operating system - XP PRO. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> The definition of flawed is to be interpretted in its natural >>>>>>>>>> meaning. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I changed no hardware on my PC. Not one piece of hardware was >>>>>>>>>> added or >>>>>>>>>> removed excluding inter alia, as required, attchment of USB drives >>>>>>>>>> / >>>>>>>>>> printeres. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I altered a bios setting. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> This heinous act triggered MS's software control systems which >>>>>>>>>> 'determined' >>>>>>>>>> that I had breached my contractual agreement with MS: I've been >>>>>>>>>> given a >>>>>>>>>> generous 3 days to fix the problem (re-activate) or MS will >>>>>>>>>> functionally >>>>>>>>>> challenge my lawful ability to enjoy my XP licence INCLUDING all >>>>>>>>>> other >>>>>>>>>> functions and features (games / internet / documents / commercial >>>>>>>>>> applications etc). This is distrubingly, ominously reminisent of >>>>>>>>>> Orwellian >>>>>>>>>> logic (courtesy of 1984): "double speak". The MS security control >>>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>>> triggered ergo I am a criminal until I prove otherwise. The >>>>>>>>>> control >>>>>>>>>> would >>>>>>>>>> not have triggered unless I was in breach of my contract with MS >>>>>>>>>> (logic >>>>>>>>>> loop). >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> For any legal minded folk, the onus of proof shifts from >>>>>>>>>> presumption of >>>>>>>>>> innocence to presumption of guilt. I have to prove innocence. MS >>>>>>>>>> need do >>>>>>>>>> nothing apparently - their work is done having caught me in a >>>>>>>>>> criminal >>>>>>>>>> act >>>>>>>>>> of BIOS altering without their permission or consent. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Sorry. The only thing wrong is with MS's flawed anti-piracy >>>>>>>>>> efforts. >>>>>>>>>> Unless I do what MS tell me (reactivate) then I am at fault. >>>>>>>>>> "Honest >>>>>>>>>> people >>>>>>>>>> won't object ... just the pirates." Yeah - pigs fly. I'm >>>>>>>>>> seriously >>>>>>>>>> annoyed >>>>>>>>>> and about to be seriously inconvenienced by a party to a software >>>>>>>>>> contract >>>>>>>>>> imposing additional costs (consideration) upon me after a legal >>>>>>>>>> contract >>>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>>> executed. I have no remedy other than take MS to court. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, using purely lawful means, I can bring this >>>>>>>>>> absurdity >>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>> the attention of the media who love bashing MS and let them feed >>>>>>>>>> on the >>>>>>>>>> company. Bad publicity for bad practices ... seems to be an >>>>>>>>>> elegant >>>>>>>>>> balance >>>>>>>>>> of karma. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> MS - I am not a pirate but a lawful and legal customer. I've done >>>>>>>>>> nothing >>>>>>>>>> wrong. You do not have any right to terminate my lawful enjoyment >>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>> this >>>>>>>>>> software (XP PRO) and your efforts to do so are called >>>>>>>>>> conversion - a >>>>>>>>>> tort. >>>>>>>>>> It is actionable per se which means I do not need to prove >>>>>>>>>> anything >>>>>>>>>> other >>>>>>>>>> than that this has happened. MS's legal defences are limited and >>>>>>>>>> in >>>>>>>>>> context, none apply. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> So, how inconvenient would it be for me to take MS to court for >>>>>>>>>> trespass >>>>>>>>>> property and or breach of contract? To me - not much. Like I >>>>>>>>>> said, I >>>>>>>>>> need >>>>>>>>>> only prove MS has interfered with the lawful enjoyment of my >>>>>>>>>> software >>>>>>>>>> licence. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Why not just call MS and sort it out? Well, I've done nothing >>>>>>>>>> wrong. >>>>>>>>>> I've >>>>>>>>>> paid for the licence. Phone calls aren't free nor is my time or >>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> inconvenience to me. I anticipate I may make a few adjustments to >>>>>>>>>> BIOS >>>>>>>>>> settings / hardware configuration (swapping SATA drives in / out >>>>>>>>>> etc) ... >>>>>>>>>> system performance tweaking. If i activate then I will be forced >>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>> call >>>>>>>>>> MS >>>>>>>>>> (big brother) to calm them down and get their OK to live a normal >>>>>>>>>> life. >>>>>>>>>> Good grief ... people have become too hesitant to speak out >>>>>>>>>> against >>>>>>>>>> absurd >>>>>>>>>> commercial practices that intrude too far into our lives. I'm not >>>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>> sheep >>>>>>>>>> nor an evangelist ... just one annoyed customer who has finally >>>>>>>>>> had >>>>>>>>>> enough >>>>>>>>>> of this crap. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Game on MS ... I'm not happy and I do not appreciate being >>>>>>>>>> inconvenienced >>>>>>>>>> without due cause. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Watch this space ... >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Mike >>>>>>>>>> Australia >
Guest Unknown Posted August 17, 2008 Posted August 17, 2008 Re: Why does MS force me to reactivate XP PRO? Yes, and you deserve it all. "Alias" <iamalias@gmailREMOVE.com> wrote in message news:g89ht1$mhb$1@aioe.org... > Unknown wrote: >> IN LINE! >> "Alias" <iamalias@gmailREMOVE.com> wrote in message >> news:g89gh9$b0k$1@aioe.org... >>> Unknown wrote: >>>> The real question is: Why does it bother YOU? >>> That's obvious; I don't like being accused of piracy when I have bought >>> the product. >> Who accused you? Is it in your mind? >> I especially don't like being accused over and over and >>> over again. >> How many times? Your imagination? >> As an example, once I had a problem with my NIC and ended up >>> having to change it. I had to activate not once, not twice but five >>> times before it would accept the fact that changing a NIC does not a >>> pirate make. >> Does reactivating really hurt your ego that much? Calm down and go with >> the flow. >> I was frustrated enough with the NIC problem that the LAST >>> thing I needed was to have to jump through the WPA hoop FIVE times. >> You must be extremely nervous. With that characteristic why do you have a >> computer? > > More insults, no comment on content. Ho hum. > > Alias >> >>> Alias >>>> "Alias" <iamalias@gmailREMOVE.com> wrote in message >>>> news:g890r9$m8u$6@aioe.org... >>>>> PA Bear [MS MVP] wrote: >>>>>> Yeah, the button you always hit when you hijack someone else's thread >>>>>> to grind your axe. >>>>> Not my ax, hoss. It's Microsoft that assumes you are guilty of piracy >>>>> until you prove otherwise. If that doesn't bother you, there's >>>>> something wrong with you and you've obviously been brainwashed to >>>>> react with a "how high?" when MS says "jump". >>>>> >>>>> Alias >>>>>> Alias wrote: >>>>>>> PA Bear [MS MVP] wrote: >>>>>>>> Butt out, Alias. >>>>>>> My, what a convincing argument! LOL! Hit a button, did I? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Alias >>>>>>>> Alias wrote: >>>>>>>>> PA Bear [MS MVP] wrote: >>>>>>>>>> In the time it took you to write your post, you could have called >>>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>> toll-free number and reactivated. >>>>>>>>> Not the point. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Description of Microsoft Product Activation: >>>>>>>>>> http://support.microsoft.com/kb/302806 >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> For any legal minded folk, the onus of proof shifts from >>>>>>>>>>> presumption of >>>>>>>>>>> innocence to presumption of guilt. I have to prove innocence. >>>>>>>>>>> MS >>>>>>>>>>> need do >>>>>>>>>>> nothing apparently - their work is done having caught me in a >>>>>>>>>>> criminal >>>>>>>>>>> act >>>>>>>>>>> of BIOS altering without their permission or consent. >>>>>>>>>> Have you read your WinXP EULA lately? >>>>>>>>> You mean the one that if you don't agree with it you can't get >>>>>>>>> your >>>>>>>>> money back, that one? How many people who bought a preinstalled >>>>>>>>> copy of >>>>>>>>> XP on a new computer got the chance to read it before accepting it >>>>>>>>> or is >>>>>>>>> the acceptance assumed when they purchase the system? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> WPA and WGA only serve to inconvenience paying customers and do >>>>>>>>> absolutely nothing to stop piracy. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Alias >>>>>>>>>> mcullet wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I do not endorse piracy. You use it - you pay for it. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> MS has a legitimate right to protect their commercial interests. >>>>>>>>>>> It's >>>>>>>>>>> one >>>>>>>>>>> of those self evident statements that are tough to argue >>>>>>>>>>> against. >>>>>>>>>>> However, >>>>>>>>>>> as with all things the devil is in the detail. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> MS Does not have the right to kick down my door at 3 am to see >>>>>>>>>>> if I >>>>>>>>>>> have a >>>>>>>>>>> COA on hand. Sounds absurd? How about this? MS decides I'm a >>>>>>>>>>> pirate >>>>>>>>>>> (might be a pirate?) and unilaterally pulls the pin on XP PRO >>>>>>>>>>> after 3 >>>>>>>>>>> days >>>>>>>>>>> UNLESS I behave like a good little sheep and do as I'm told (see >>>>>>>>>>> Pavlov)? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> The problem with large organisations (and government) is that >>>>>>>>>>> they >>>>>>>>>>> need to >>>>>>>>>>> be reminded once in a while that they are not all powerful and >>>>>>>>>>> they do >>>>>>>>>>> not >>>>>>>>>>> have unqualified control (power / authority / legal rights) over >>>>>>>>>>> what we >>>>>>>>>>> do. >>>>>>>>>>> Staying only with MS, the issue is one of enforcement of >>>>>>>>>>> contractual >>>>>>>>>>> obligations: essentially enforcement of promises. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I legally purchased an XP PRO licence and have used it strictly >>>>>>>>>>> in >>>>>>>>>>> accord >>>>>>>>>>> with the licence agreement. Software changes, as we are all to >>>>>>>>>>> familiar >>>>>>>>>>> with observing. These occur because of an amalgam of bug fixes, >>>>>>>>>>> security >>>>>>>>>>> patches and evolution (feature enhancement or deprecation). The >>>>>>>>>>> hardware >>>>>>>>>>> environment is more likely to change as the machine ages. I'll >>>>>>>>>>> leave it >>>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>>> others to determine at what point the original PC changes >>>>>>>>>>> sufficiently to >>>>>>>>>>> warrant paying for another licence but this issue is central to >>>>>>>>>>> MS >>>>>>>>>>> dilemma >>>>>>>>>>> and needs wide debate. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> MS abuse their positon every time they unjustifiably force a >>>>>>>>>>> user to >>>>>>>>>>> reactivate their legally purchased software. In legal terms, >>>>>>>>>>> they >>>>>>>>>>> are in >>>>>>>>>>> breach of contract because they unilaterally terminate the >>>>>>>>>>> agreement by >>>>>>>>>>> rendering the OS unusable. If I wanted to be an idiot I could >>>>>>>>>>> waste my >>>>>>>>>>> life >>>>>>>>>>> getting MS to play the reactivation game 24 / 7. I have more >>>>>>>>>>> interesting >>>>>>>>>>> things to do. However, this is the absurd position MS force >>>>>>>>>>> upon >>>>>>>>>>> legitimate >>>>>>>>>>> customers and themselves because they (MS) distributed flawed >>>>>>>>>>> security >>>>>>>>>>> controls in their operating system - XP PRO. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> The definition of flawed is to be interpretted in its natural >>>>>>>>>>> meaning. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I changed no hardware on my PC. Not one piece of hardware was >>>>>>>>>>> added or >>>>>>>>>>> removed excluding inter alia, as required, attchment of USB >>>>>>>>>>> drives / >>>>>>>>>>> printeres. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I altered a bios setting. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> This heinous act triggered MS's software control systems which >>>>>>>>>>> 'determined' >>>>>>>>>>> that I had breached my contractual agreement with MS: I've been >>>>>>>>>>> given a >>>>>>>>>>> generous 3 days to fix the problem (re-activate) or MS will >>>>>>>>>>> functionally >>>>>>>>>>> challenge my lawful ability to enjoy my XP licence INCLUDING all >>>>>>>>>>> other >>>>>>>>>>> functions and features (games / internet / documents / >>>>>>>>>>> commercial >>>>>>>>>>> applications etc). This is distrubingly, ominously reminisent >>>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>>> Orwellian >>>>>>>>>>> logic (courtesy of 1984): "double speak". The MS security >>>>>>>>>>> control was >>>>>>>>>>> triggered ergo I am a criminal until I prove otherwise. The >>>>>>>>>>> control >>>>>>>>>>> would >>>>>>>>>>> not have triggered unless I was in breach of my contract with MS >>>>>>>>>>> (logic >>>>>>>>>>> loop). >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> For any legal minded folk, the onus of proof shifts from >>>>>>>>>>> presumption of >>>>>>>>>>> innocence to presumption of guilt. I have to prove innocence. >>>>>>>>>>> MS >>>>>>>>>>> need do >>>>>>>>>>> nothing apparently - their work is done having caught me in a >>>>>>>>>>> criminal >>>>>>>>>>> act >>>>>>>>>>> of BIOS altering without their permission or consent. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Sorry. The only thing wrong is with MS's flawed anti-piracy >>>>>>>>>>> efforts. >>>>>>>>>>> Unless I do what MS tell me (reactivate) then I am at fault. >>>>>>>>>>> "Honest >>>>>>>>>>> people >>>>>>>>>>> won't object ... just the pirates." Yeah - pigs fly. I'm >>>>>>>>>>> seriously >>>>>>>>>>> annoyed >>>>>>>>>>> and about to be seriously inconvenienced by a party to a >>>>>>>>>>> software >>>>>>>>>>> contract >>>>>>>>>>> imposing additional costs (consideration) upon me after a legal >>>>>>>>>>> contract >>>>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>>>> executed. I have no remedy other than take MS to court. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, using purely lawful means, I can bring this >>>>>>>>>>> absurdity >>>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>>> the attention of the media who love bashing MS and let them feed >>>>>>>>>>> on the >>>>>>>>>>> company. Bad publicity for bad practices ... seems to be an >>>>>>>>>>> elegant >>>>>>>>>>> balance >>>>>>>>>>> of karma. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> MS - I am not a pirate but a lawful and legal customer. I've >>>>>>>>>>> done >>>>>>>>>>> nothing >>>>>>>>>>> wrong. You do not have any right to terminate my lawful >>>>>>>>>>> enjoyment of >>>>>>>>>>> this >>>>>>>>>>> software (XP PRO) and your efforts to do so are called >>>>>>>>>>> conversion - a >>>>>>>>>>> tort. >>>>>>>>>>> It is actionable per se which means I do not need to prove >>>>>>>>>>> anything >>>>>>>>>>> other >>>>>>>>>>> than that this has happened. MS's legal defences are limited >>>>>>>>>>> and in >>>>>>>>>>> context, none apply. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> So, how inconvenient would it be for me to take MS to court for >>>>>>>>>>> trespass >>>>>>>>>>> property and or breach of contract? To me - not much. Like I >>>>>>>>>>> said, I >>>>>>>>>>> need >>>>>>>>>>> only prove MS has interfered with the lawful enjoyment of my >>>>>>>>>>> software >>>>>>>>>>> licence. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Why not just call MS and sort it out? Well, I've done nothing >>>>>>>>>>> wrong. >>>>>>>>>>> I've >>>>>>>>>>> paid for the licence. Phone calls aren't free nor is my time or >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> inconvenience to me. I anticipate I may make a few adjustments >>>>>>>>>>> to BIOS >>>>>>>>>>> settings / hardware configuration (swapping SATA drives in / out >>>>>>>>>>> etc) ... >>>>>>>>>>> system performance tweaking. If i activate then I will be >>>>>>>>>>> forced to >>>>>>>>>>> call >>>>>>>>>>> MS >>>>>>>>>>> (big brother) to calm them down and get their OK to live a >>>>>>>>>>> normal life. >>>>>>>>>>> Good grief ... people have become too hesitant to speak out >>>>>>>>>>> against >>>>>>>>>>> absurd >>>>>>>>>>> commercial practices that intrude too far into our lives. I'm >>>>>>>>>>> not a >>>>>>>>>>> sheep >>>>>>>>>>> nor an evangelist ... just one annoyed customer who has finally >>>>>>>>>>> had >>>>>>>>>>> enough >>>>>>>>>>> of this crap. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Game on MS ... I'm not happy and I do not appreciate being >>>>>>>>>>> inconvenienced >>>>>>>>>>> without due cause. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Watch this space ... >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Mike >>>>>>>>>>> Australia >>
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