Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to repair?

September 19, 2008

I'm having issues with the DNS server service - when set to automatic it

won't allow my DC to boot - hangs on Preparing Network Connections. If I set

it to Manual it boots up and I can login and then I start DNS manually after

login. I believe the problem started after a recent MS Update.

I'm toying with the idea of uninstalling DNS and reinstalling while it is

still a DC with Active Directory. Can I do that or no?

September 19, 2008

RE: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to repair?

The domain controller I am working on in question does not hold any of the

FSMO roles or anything like that, so I'm hoping that removing DNS from the

server would be okay...I have brought up another DC at this site with DNS

installed, so at least now I have a backup DC handy if necessary...Any

thoughts?

Also - there are no errors in the Event Log pertaining to DNS Server or

anything when it hangs on Preparing Network Connections. Once I log in and

start the service, everything is as happy as can be, replication, name

resolution, etc.

Is there a chance that maybe the network card drivers need updating? The

server is an HP DL360G5 with two, GB ethernet ports, and I have them teamed.

I have 2 other identical servers at 2 other sites (both DCs, running same OS,

everything identical to this one), and they are having no issues at all.

"Saral6978" wrote:

> I'm having issues with the DNS server service - when set to automatic it

> won't allow my DC to boot - hangs on Preparing Network Connections. If I set

> it to Manual it boots up and I can login and then I start DNS manually after

> login. I believe the problem started after a recent MS Update.

>

> I'm toying with the idea of uninstalling DNS and reinstalling while it is

> still a DC with Active Directory. Can I do that or no?

>

September 19, 2008

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to repair?

Hello Saral6978,

Is this the only DC/DNS server? Well, during the startup the server will

try to connect to the domain DNS server. Unfortunally it can happen that

the DNS server service needs a long time to start so it can not find it's

own DNS server. I think that is the reason for the long time of preparing

netwrok connections. If you have an additional DC, i would make it also DNS

server use AD integrated zones and configure both of them for preferred DNS

as itself and secondary to the other. So it can reach always the secondary

if it's own is not started.

Best regards

Meinolf Weber

Disclaimer: This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers

no rights.

** Please do NOT email, only reply to Newsgroups

** HELP us help YOU!!! http://www.blakjak.demon.co.uk/mul_crss.htm

> I'm having issues with the DNS server service - when set to automatic

> it won't allow my DC to boot - hangs on Preparing Network Connections.

> If I set it to Manual it boots up and I can login and then I start DNS

> manually after login. I believe the problem started after a recent MS

> Update.

>

> I'm toying with the idea of uninstalling DNS and reinstalling while it

> is still a DC with Active Directory. Can I do that or no?

>

September 19, 2008

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

At this particular site it was...I orignally had it configured to use itself

and a remote DNS server at my main site for it's DNS server. It was a record

48hrs that it sat at Preparing Network Connections. It had done a reboot

about 5:00am on a Saturday and Monday morning it was still sitting at the

screen. DNS had been flaking out for the past 2 weeks after some updates had

applied, for example, my DNS zone would be empty and I had to manually

restart the DNS server service for it to populate but then it would still

boot up okay...then about 2 weeks later, it just got stuck on that part of

the reboot. I figured out the issue was the DNS Server because I went into

Safe mode and changed it to Manual, then no problem.

<If you have an additional DC, i would make it also DNS server use AD

integrated zones and configure both of them for preferred DNS as itself and

secondary to the other.>

The secondary DNS server that I just brought up, I did install DNS on it as

well, and it's zone is also AD-Integrated. I installed DNS first, then added

the DC role to it so it configured the AD-Integrated zone automatically.

This backup DC is fully operational, replicating with the other 4 DCs in my

domain (at 3 different sites). I configured its DNS with itself as the

primary, the above DC having issues is the secondary, and I added one of my

remote DNS servers as a third.

And like you suggested, I had added my newly promoted DC as the secondary

DNS server to the one having the problem starting up. I have not yet

attempted a reboot yet on the server having the issue, so perhaps this will

solve it, but the problem still exists that why now all of a sudden this

server can't find itself as a DNS server during the boot process when it was

working just fine a couple of weeks ago? That's why I'm wondering if I just

remove DNS from this server and reinstall it, it might fix whatever the

problem is...

Thanks for your reply,

Sara

"Meinolf Weber" wrote:

> Hello Saral6978,

>

> Is this the only DC/DNS server? Well, during the startup the server will

> try to connect to the domain DNS server. Unfortunally it can happen that

> the DNS server service needs a long time to start so it can not find it's

> own DNS server. I think that is the reason for the long time of preparing

> network connections. If you have an additional DC, i would make it also DNS

> server use AD integrated zones and configure both of them for preferred DNS

> as itself and secondary to the other. So it can reach always the secondary

> if it's own is not started.

>

> Best regards

>

> Meinolf Weber

> Disclaimer: This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers

> no rights.

> ** Please do NOT email, only reply to Newsgroups

> ** HELP us help YOU!!! http://www.blakjak.demon.co.uk/mul_crss.htm

>

> > I'm having issues with the DNS server service - when set to automatic

> > it won't allow my DC to boot - hangs on Preparing Network Connections.

> > If I set it to Manual it boots up and I can login and then I start DNS

> > manually after login. I believe the problem started after a recent MS

> > Update.

> >

> > I'm toying with the idea of uninstalling DNS and reinstalling while it

> > is still a DC with Active Directory. Can I do that or no?

> >

>

September 20, 2008

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Hello Saral6978,

48 hours is really to long. I will crosspost to microsoft.public.windows.server.dns,

there are the DNS experts.

Best regards

Meinolf Weber

Disclaimer: This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers

no rights.

** Please do NOT email, only reply to Newsgroups

** HELP us help YOU!!! http://www.blakjak.demon.co.uk/mul_crss.htm

> <Is this the only DC/DNS server?>

>

> At this particular site it was...I orignally had it configured to use

> itself and a remote DNS server at my main site for it's DNS server.

> It was a record 48hrs that it sat at Preparing Network Connections. It

> had done a reboot about 5:00am on a Saturday and Monday morning it was

> still sitting at the screen. DNS had been flaking out for the past 2

> weeks after some updates had applied, for example, my DNS zone would

> be empty and I had to manually restart the DNS server service for it

> to populate but then it would still boot up okay...then about 2 weeks

> later, it just got stuck on that part of the reboot. I figured out

> the issue was the DNS Server because I went into Safe mode and changed

> it to Manual, then no problem.

>

> <If you have an additional DC, i would make it also DNS server use AD

> integrated zones and configure both of them for preferred DNS as

> itself and secondary to the other.>

>

> The secondary DNS server that I just brought up, I did install DNS on

> it as well, and it's zone is also AD-Integrated. I installed DNS

> first, then added the DC role to it so it configured the AD-Integrated

> zone automatically. This backup DC is fully operational, replicating

> with the other 4 DCs in my domain (at 3 different sites). I

> configured its DNS with itself as the primary, the above DC having

> issues is the secondary, and I added one of my remote DNS servers as a

> third.

>

> And like you suggested, I had added my newly promoted DC as the

> secondary DNS server to the one having the problem starting up. I

> have not yet attempted a reboot yet on the server having the issue, so

> perhaps this will solve it, but the problem still exists that why now

> all of a sudden this server can't find itself as a DNS server during

> the boot process when it was working just fine a couple of weeks ago?

> That's why I'm wondering if I just remove DNS from this server and

> reinstall it, it might fix whatever the problem is...

>

> Thanks for your reply,

>

> Sara

>

> "Meinolf Weber" wrote:

>

>> Hello Saral6978,

>>

>> Is this the only DC/DNS server? Well, during the startup the server

>> will try to connect to the domain DNS server. Unfortunally it can

>> happen that the DNS server service needs a long time to start so it

>> can not find it's own DNS server. I think that is the reason for the

>> long time of preparing network connections. If you have an additional

>> DC, i would make it also DNS server use AD integrated zones and

>> configure both of them for preferred DNS as itself and secondary to

>> the other. So it can reach always the secondary if it's own is not

>> started.

>>

>> Best regards

>>

>> Meinolf Weber

>> Disclaimer: This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and

>> confers

>> no rights.

>> ** Please do NOT email, only reply to Newsgroups

>> ** HELP us help YOU!!! http://www.blakjak.demon.co.uk/mul_crss.htm

>>> I'm having issues with the DNS server service - when set to

>>> automatic it won't allow my DC to boot - hangs on Preparing Network

>>> Connections. If I set it to Manual it boots up and I can login and

>>> then I start DNS manually after login. I believe the problem

>>> started after a recent MS Update.

>>>

>>> I'm toying with the idea of uninstalling DNS and reinstalling while

>>> it is still a DC with Active Directory. Can I do that or no?

>>>

September 20, 2008

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

"Meinolf Weber" wrote in message

news:ff16fb667ac58cae934bc873a5b@msnews.microsoft.com...

>> <Is this the only DC/DNS server?>

>>

>> At this particular site it was...I orignally had it configured to use

>> itself and a remote DNS server at my main site for it's DNS server.

>> It was a record 48hrs that it sat at Preparing Network Connections. It

>> had done a reboot about 5:00am on a Saturday and Monday morning it was

>> still sitting at the screen. DNS had been flaking out for the past 2

>> weeks after some updates had applied, for example, my DNS zone would

>> be empty and I had to manually restart the DNS server service for it

>> to populate but then it would still boot up okay...then about 2 weeks

>> later, it just got stuck on that part of the reboot. I figured out

>> the issue was the DNS Server because I went into Safe mode and changed

>> it to Manual, then no problem.

>>

>> <If you have an additional DC, i would make it also DNS server use AD

>> integrated zones and configure both of them for preferred DNS as

>> itself and secondary to the other.>

>>

>> The secondary DNS server that I just brought up, I did install DNS on

>> it as well, and it's zone is also AD-Integrated. I installed DNS

>> first, then added the DC role to it so it configured the AD-Integrated

>> zone automatically. This backup DC is fully operational, replicating

>> with the other 4 DCs in my domain (at 3 different sites). I

>> configured its DNS with itself as the primary, the above DC having

>> issues is the secondary, and I added one of my remote DNS servers as a

>> third.

>>

>> And like you suggested, I had added my newly promoted DC as the

>> secondary DNS server to the one having the problem starting up. I

>> have not yet attempted a reboot yet on the server having the issue, so

>> perhaps this will solve it, but the problem still exists that why now

>> all of a sudden this server can't find itself as a DNS server during

>> the boot process when it was working just fine a couple of weeks ago?

>> That's why I'm wondering if I just remove DNS from this server and

>> reinstall it, it might fix whatever the problem is...

>>

>> Thanks for your reply,

>>

>> Sara

>>

Sara,

What operating system and service pack level are your DCs?

Do you have AD Sites configured properly?

What errors are on any of the DCs? If any exist, please post the EventID#

and Source names.

I'm trying to get a handle on your infrastructure. Not sure what was

installed or updated, but any of the updates would not cause this issue. So

I'll give you a generalization of what to look for with configuring your DCs

in a multi-site scenario and other recommendations.

In a multi-site config with Sites configured properly, always point DNS to

itself as first, and pick another DC in another site as second.

There is no such thing as a 'secondary' zone, unless of coure you are

speaking of the position as being the 'second' DNS address in ip properties.

If you have any DC with a tru "Secondary" zone of a zone that is AD

integrated, expect huge problems. If so, it will cause duplicate zones in

the AD database and that is not easily cleaned up.

If you have ever wanted to uninstall DNS on a DC, and decided to manually

delete an AD Integrated zone first prior to uninstallation, you have just

effectively deleted the whole zone out of AD. If you want to remove the DNS

service off a DC that has an AD integrated zone, simply go into Add/Remove,

Windows Components, and uncheck the box. Never delete the zone first.

If a server cannot 'find itself' for DNS, I would suggest to change it's

first entry to another DC in another Site with an operational DNS and let it

come up. Then put itself as second. Reboot after about an hour to make sure

it still comes up. If it comes up clean, then change it to itself as the

first entry, then the other one as the second entry. The reason why it can't

find itself is because AD is not up yet for whatever reason, such as

possibly an update, or an app change and needed to do something during the

restart, etc, therefore since AD is not up yet, and the zone is Ad

integrated, then DNS can't find it in the AD database simply because AD

services have not started yet.

Make sense?

So applying what i mentioned, can you backtrack on what was done and in what

order as to what was done to better understand what may have happened?

--

Regards,

Ace

This posting is provided "AS-IS" with no warranties or guarantees and

confers no rights.

Ace Fekay, MCSE 2003 & 2000, MCSA 2003 & 2000, MCSE+I, MCT,

MVP Microsoft MVP - Directory Services

Microsoft Certified Trainer

For urgent issues, you may want to contact Microsoft PSS directly. Please

check http://support.microsoft.com for regional support phone numbers.

Enter into an artificial quantum singularity lined with fermions and

neutrino scatterings depicted by electrons smashing into protons and

neutrons like billiard balls moving at warp 9 exposing quarks, mesons and

baryons, the essentials of their existence, that are spinning off in half

scatters. You have now entered the Twilight Zone.

September 21, 2008

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Ace - thank you so much for your reply, I really appreciate it.

3 of the DCs, which includes the one I'm having issues with, are running

Windows 2003 R2, SP2, and the other 2 DCs are running Windows 2003, SP2.

I am getting one error in the DNS Server log, but I have to confirm if it's

being generated during the reboot when DNS is set to automatic, or if it's

being logged because I have DNS Server set to manual. In any case, it's

Event ID 4015: The DNS server has encountered a critical error from the

Active Directory. Check that the Active Directory is functioning properly.

The event data contains the error.

I have been looking into this error and possible causes. My AD does seem to

be functioning correctly though, as there are no other errors in my event

log, and shortly after 4015 is logged, another event says DNS has started and

there are no other errors. I'm not sure if that's when I manually turned it

on or not. I will be doing a reboot Monday and keep better track of when

these errors/alerts are happening.

AD sites and services is setup properly and replication is running

seamlessly. I do have DNS set to point to itself first on all my DCs, and

then I pick another DC in another site as second. When I meant "secondary",

I meant just the secondary DNS server, not a zone. I only have the one zone

with the one domain.

I would never have deleted the Zone from DNS - My plan was to go into

Add/Remove programs and uncheck DNS from the DC and uninstall it. So, by

what you said, I should be able to safely uninstall DNS from Windows

Components on the domain controller without hosing my current Active

Directory/AD Integrated Zone and affecting my other DCs? If I can do this,

it might be worth a shot to see if this would solve the problem.

But, before I do that, since I now have a 2nd DC at this particular site, I

will change my problem DC's 1st DNS server to the the 2nd DC of that site and

see if I can get it to start. Someone had also mentioned there are a few

Windows updates that are specifically security updates for DNS that can

affect services from starting (using UDP ports) and that you have to reserve

a port, because there is a port that DNS or AD might be using that it can't

because this port is in use. Problem is, I have no idea what ports to

attempt to reserve to see if that is truly the problem. DNS to my knowledge

only uses TCP and UDP ports 53. I'm not sure about AD though, I haven't

checked it.

Thanks, again!

Sara

"Ace Fekay [MVP Direcrtory Services]" wrote:

> "Meinolf Weber" wrote in message

> news:ff16fb667ac58cae934bc873a5b@msnews.microsoft.com...

> >> <Is this the only DC/DNS server?>

> >>

> >> At this particular site it was...I orignally had it configured to use

> >> itself and a remote DNS server at my main site for it's DNS server.

> >> It was a record 48hrs that it sat at Preparing Network Connections. It

> >> had done a reboot about 5:00am on a Saturday and Monday morning it was

> >> still sitting at the screen. DNS had been flaking out for the past 2

> >> weeks after some updates had applied, for example, my DNS zone would

> >> be empty and I had to manually restart the DNS server service for it

> >> to populate but then it would still boot up okay...then about 2 weeks

> >> later, it just got stuck on that part of the reboot. I figured out

> >> the issue was the DNS Server because I went into Safe mode and changed

> >> it to Manual, then no problem.

> >>

> >> <If you have an additional DC, i would make it also DNS server use AD

> >> integrated zones and configure both of them for preferred DNS as

> >> itself and secondary to the other.>

> >>

> >> The secondary DNS server that I just brought up, I did install DNS on

> >> it as well, and it's zone is also AD-Integrated. I installed DNS

> >> first, then added the DC role to it so it configured the AD-Integrated

> >> zone automatically. This backup DC is fully operational, replicating

> >> with the other 4 DCs in my domain (at 3 different sites). I

> >> configured its DNS with itself as the primary, the above DC having

> >> issues is the secondary, and I added one of my remote DNS servers as a

> >> third.

> >>

> >> And like you suggested, I had added my newly promoted DC as the

> >> secondary DNS server to the one having the problem starting up. I

> >> have not yet attempted a reboot yet on the server having the issue, so

> >> perhaps this will solve it, but the problem still exists that why now

> >> all of a sudden this server can't find itself as a DNS server during

> >> the boot process when it was working just fine a couple of weeks ago?

> >> That's why I'm wondering if I just remove DNS from this server and

> >> reinstall it, it might fix whatever the problem is...

> >>

> >> Thanks for your reply,

> >>

> >> Sara

> >>

>

> Sara,

>

> What operating system and service pack level are your DCs?

> Do you have AD Sites configured properly?

> What errors are on any of the DCs? If any exist, please post the EventID#

> and Source names.

>

> I'm trying to get a handle on your infrastructure. Not sure what was

> installed or updated, but any of the updates would not cause this issue. So

> I'll give you a generalization of what to look for with configuring your DCs

> in a multi-site scenario and other recommendations.

>

> In a multi-site config with Sites configured properly, always point DNS to

> itself as first, and pick another DC in another site as second.

>

> There is no such thing as a 'secondary' zone, unless of coure you are

> speaking of the position as being the 'second' DNS address in ip properties.

>

> If you have any DC with a tru "Secondary" zone of a zone that is AD

> integrated, expect huge problems. If so, it will cause duplicate zones in

> the AD database and that is not easily cleaned up.

>

> If you have ever wanted to uninstall DNS on a DC, and decided to manually

> delete an AD Integrated zone first prior to uninstallation, you have just

> effectively deleted the whole zone out of AD. If you want to remove the DNS

> service off a DC that has an AD integrated zone, simply go into Add/Remove,

> Windows Components, and uncheck the box. Never delete the zone first.

>

> If a server cannot 'find itself' for DNS, I would suggest to change it's

> first entry to another DC in another Site with an operational DNS and let it

> come up. Then put itself as second. Reboot after about an hour to make sure

> it still comes up. If it comes up clean, then change it to itself as the

> first entry, then the other one as the second entry. The reason why it can't

> find itself is because AD is not up yet for whatever reason, such as

> possibly an update, or an app change and needed to do something during the

> restart, etc, therefore since AD is not up yet, and the zone is Ad

> integrated, then DNS can't find it in the AD database simply because AD

> services have not started yet.

>

> Make sense?

>

> So applying what i mentioned, can you backtrack on what was done and in what

> order as to what was done to better understand what may have happened?

>

> --

> Regards,

> Ace

>

> This posting is provided "AS-IS" with no warranties or guarantees and

> confers no rights.

>

> Ace Fekay, MCSE 2003 & 2000, MCSA 2003 & 2000, MCSE+I, MCT,

> MVP Microsoft MVP - Directory Services

> Microsoft Certified Trainer

>

> For urgent issues, you may want to contact Microsoft PSS directly. Please

> check http://support.microsoft.com for regional support phone numbers.

>

> Enter into an artificial quantum singularity lined with fermions and

> neutrino scatterings depicted by electrons smashing into protons and

> neutrons like billiard balls moving at warp 9 exposing quarks, mesons and

> baryons, the essentials of their existence, that are spinning off in half

> scatters. You have now entered the Twilight Zone.

>

September 21, 2008

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Hello Saral6978,

For event id 4015 check out this article and the part with the (.) root zone

from Adrian Grigorof.

http://www.eventid.net/display.asp?eventid=4015&eventno=333&source=DNS&phase=1

Best regards

Meinolf Weber

Disclaimer: This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers

no rights.

** Please do NOT email, only reply to Newsgroups

** HELP us help YOU!!! http://www.blakjak.demon.co.uk/mul_crss.htm

> Ace - thank you so much for your reply, I really appreciate it.

>

> 3 of the DCs, which includes the one I'm having issues with, are

> running Windows 2003 R2, SP2, and the other 2 DCs are running Windows

> 2003, SP2.

>

> I am getting one error in the DNS Server log, but I have to confirm if

> it's being generated during the reboot when DNS is set to automatic,

> or if it's being logged because I have DNS Server set to manual. In

> any case, it's Event ID 4015: The DNS server has encountered a

> critical error from the Active Directory. Check that the Active

> Directory is functioning properly. The event data contains the error.

>

> I have been looking into this error and possible causes. My AD does

> seem to be functioning correctly though, as there are no other errors

> in my event log, and shortly after 4015 is logged, another event says

> DNS has started and there are no other errors. I'm not sure if that's

> when I manually turned it on or not. I will be doing a reboot Monday

> and keep better track of when these errors/alerts are happening.

>

> AD sites and services is setup properly and replication is running

> seamlessly. I do have DNS set to point to itself first on all my DCs,

> and then I pick another DC in another site as second. When I meant

> "secondary", I meant just the secondary DNS server, not a zone. I

> only have the one zone with the one domain.

>

> I would never have deleted the Zone from DNS - My plan was to go into

> Add/Remove programs and uncheck DNS from the DC and uninstall it. So,

> by what you said, I should be able to safely uninstall DNS from

> Windows Components on the domain controller without hosing my current

> Active Directory/AD Integrated Zone and affecting my other DCs? If I

> can do this, it might be worth a shot to see if this would solve the

> problem.

>

> But, before I do that, since I now have a 2nd DC at this particular

> site, I will change my problem DC's 1st DNS server to the the 2nd DC

> of that site and see if I can get it to start. Someone had also

> mentioned there are a few Windows updates that are specifically

> security updates for DNS that can affect services from starting (using

> UDP ports) and that you have to reserve a port, because there is a

> port that DNS or AD might be using that it can't because this port is

> in use. Problem is, I have no idea what ports to attempt to reserve

> to see if that is truly the problem. DNS to my knowledge only uses

> TCP and UDP ports 53. I'm not sure about AD though, I haven't checked

> it.

>

> Thanks, again!

>

> Sara

>

> "Ace Fekay [MVP Direcrtory Services]" wrote:

>

>> "Meinolf Weber" wrote in message

>> news:ff16fb667ac58cae934bc873a5b@msnews.microsoft.com...

>>

>>>> <Is this the only DC/DNS server?>

>>>>

>>>> At this particular site it was...I orignally had it configured to

>>>> use

>>>> itself and a remote DNS server at my main site for it's DNS server.

>>>> It was a record 48hrs that it sat at Preparing Network Connections.

>>>> It

>>>> had done a reboot about 5:00am on a Saturday and Monday morning it

>>>> was

>>>> still sitting at the screen. DNS had been flaking out for the past

>>>> 2

>>>> weeks after some updates had applied, for example, my DNS zone

>>>> would

>>>> be empty and I had to manually restart the DNS server service for

>>>> it

>>>> to populate but then it would still boot up okay...then about 2

>>>> weeks

>>>> later, it just got stuck on that part of the reboot. I figured out

>>>> the issue was the DNS Server because I went into Safe mode and

>>>> changed

>>>> it to Manual, then no problem.

>>>> <If you have an additional DC, i would make it also DNS server use

>>>> AD integrated zones and configure both of them for preferred DNS as

>>>> itself and secondary to the other.>

>>>>

>>>> The secondary DNS server that I just brought up, I did install DNS

>>>> on it as well, and it's zone is also AD-Integrated. I installed

>>>> DNS first, then added the DC role to it so it configured the

>>>> AD-Integrated zone automatically. This backup DC is fully

>>>> operational, replicating with the other 4 DCs in my domain (at 3

>>>> different sites). I configured its DNS with itself as the primary,

>>>> the above DC having issues is the secondary, and I added one of my

>>>> remote DNS servers as a third.

>>>>

>>>> And like you suggested, I had added my newly promoted DC as the

>>>> secondary DNS server to the one having the problem starting up. I

>>>> have not yet attempted a reboot yet on the server having the issue,

>>>> so perhaps this will solve it, but the problem still exists that

>>>> why now all of a sudden this server can't find itself as a DNS

>>>> server during the boot process when it was working just fine a

>>>> couple of weeks ago? That's why I'm wondering if I just remove DNS

>>>> from this server and reinstall it, it might fix whatever the

>>>> problem is...

>>>>

>>>> Thanks for your reply,

>>>>

>>>> Sara

>>>>

>> Sara,

>>

>> What operating system and service pack level are your DCs?

>> Do you have AD Sites configured properly?

>> What errors are on any of the DCs? If any exist, please post the

>> EventID#

>> and Source names.

>> I'm trying to get a handle on your infrastructure. Not sure what was

>> installed or updated, but any of the updates would not cause this

>> issue. So I'll give you a generalization of what to look for with

>> configuring your DCs in a multi-site scenario and other

>> recommendations.

>>

>> In a multi-site config with Sites configured properly, always point

>> DNS to itself as first, and pick another DC in another site as

>> second.

>>

>> There is no such thing as a 'secondary' zone, unless of coure you are

>> speaking of the position as being the 'second' DNS address in ip

>> properties.

>>

>> If you have any DC with a tru "Secondary" zone of a zone that is AD

>> integrated, expect huge problems. If so, it will cause duplicate

>> zones in the AD database and that is not easily cleaned up.

>>

>> If you have ever wanted to uninstall DNS on a DC, and decided to

>> manually delete an AD Integrated zone first prior to uninstallation,

>> you have just effectively deleted the whole zone out of AD. If you

>> want to remove the DNS service off a DC that has an AD integrated

>> zone, simply go into Add/Remove, Windows Components, and uncheck the

>> box. Never delete the zone first.

>>

>> If a server cannot 'find itself' for DNS, I would suggest to change

>> it's first entry to another DC in another Site with an operational

>> DNS and let it come up. Then put itself as second. Reboot after about

>> an hour to make sure it still comes up. If it comes up clean, then

>> change it to itself as the first entry, then the other one as the

>> second entry. The reason why it can't find itself is because AD is

>> not up yet for whatever reason, such as possibly an update, or an app

>> change and needed to do something during the restart, etc, therefore

>> since AD is not up yet, and the zone is Ad integrated, then DNS can't

>> find it in the AD database simply because AD services have not

>> started yet.

>>

>> Make sense?

>>

>> So applying what i mentioned, can you backtrack on what was done and

>> in what order as to what was done to better understand what may have

>> happened?

>>

>> --

>> Regards,

>> Ace

>> This posting is provided "AS-IS" with no warranties or guarantees and

>> confers no rights.

>>

>> Ace Fekay, MCSE 2003 & 2000, MCSA 2003 & 2000, MCSE+I, MCT,

>> MVP Microsoft MVP - Directory Services

>> Microsoft Certified Trainer

>> For urgent issues, you may want to contact Microsoft PSS directly.

>> Please check http://support.microsoft.com for regional support phone

>> numbers.

>>

>> Enter into an artificial quantum singularity lined with fermions and

>> neutrino scatterings depicted by electrons smashing into protons and

>> neutrons like billiard balls moving at warp 9 exposing quarks, mesons

>> and baryons, the essentials of their existence, that are spinning off

>> in half scatters. You have now entered the Twilight Zone.

>>

September 21, 2008

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

"Saral6978" <Saral6978@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message

news:72CEBDBC-AE50-4510-A5EA-7D6A0319F8F0@microsoft.com...

> Ace - thank you so much for your reply, I really appreciate it.

>

> 3 of the DCs, which includes the one I'm having issues with, are running

> Windows 2003 R2, SP2, and the other 2 DCs are running Windows 2003, SP2.

>

> I am getting one error in the DNS Server log, but I have to confirm if

> it's

> being generated during the reboot when DNS is set to automatic, or if it's

> being logged because I have DNS Server set to manual. In any case, it's

> Event ID 4015: The DNS server has encountered a critical error from the

> Active Directory. Check that the Active Directory is functioning properly.

> The event data contains the error.

>

> I have been looking into this error and possible causes. My AD does seem

> to

> be functioning correctly though, as there are no other errors in my event

> log, and shortly after 4015 is logged, another event says DNS has started

> and

> there are no other errors. I'm not sure if that's when I manually turned

> it

> on or not. I will be doing a reboot Monday and keep better track of when

> these errors/alerts are happening.

>

> AD sites and services is setup properly and replication is running

> seamlessly. I do have DNS set to point to itself first on all my DCs, and

> then I pick another DC in another site as second. When I meant

> "secondary",

> I meant just the secondary DNS server, not a zone. I only have the one

> zone

> with the one domain.

>

> I would never have deleted the Zone from DNS - My plan was to go into

> Add/Remove programs and uncheck DNS from the DC and uninstall it. So, by

> what you said, I should be able to safely uninstall DNS from Windows

> Components on the domain controller without hosing my current Active

> Directory/AD Integrated Zone and affecting my other DCs? If I can do

> this,

> it might be worth a shot to see if this would solve the problem.

>

> But, before I do that, since I now have a 2nd DC at this particular site,

> I

> will change my problem DC's 1st DNS server to the the 2nd DC of that site

> and

> see if I can get it to start. Someone had also mentioned there are a few

> Windows updates that are specifically security updates for DNS that can

> affect services from starting (using UDP ports) and that you have to

> reserve

> a port, because there is a port that DNS or AD might be using that it

> can't

> because this port is in use. Problem is, I have no idea what ports to

> attempt to reserve to see if that is truly the problem. DNS to my

> knowledge

> only uses TCP and UDP ports 53. I'm not sure about AD though, I haven't

> checked it.

>

> Thanks, again!

>

> Sara

Hi Sara,

Honestly I haven't heard of these problems until now. But a real important

point, is that you must keep the DNS service set to automatic at all times.

Otherwise leaving it to manual will cause issues at startup because AD can't

find itself if the first entry is pointed to itself unless the DNS service

is running. Otherwise, how is it supposed to query a non-running DNS

service?

As for uninstalling, yes, just uncheck the box. But I would leave the

service enabled and try it out.

The security update reserves 2500 UDP ephemeral ports. The ephemeral ports

are the response ports anywhere between UDP 1025 and UDP 2500. Sometimes

this can cause problems with 3rd apps installed that need these ports as

well as the IPSec service. Otherwise, if you don't have anything else

installed, it shouldn't be a problem. The following is more info on the

security update and the ports being used. But I don't think this is the

cause of the problem.

---------------------------------

The DNS patch will reserve 2500 ephemeral UDP ports. When you run a

netstat -ab, it will display the 2500 UDP ports that have been

reserved, but not necessarily in use. This is part of the memory

consumption. I've noticed the following (your mileage may vary):

dns.exe Before After

Mem usage 9758K 36,232K

Peak Mem 10,208K 36,584K

Paged Pool 71K 798K

NP Pool 17K 4,833K

Handles 238 5,217

Threads 20 20

MS08-037: Description of the security update for DNS in Windows Server 2003,

in Windows XP, and in Windows 2000 Server (client side): July 8, 2008:

http://support.microsoft.com/?id=951748

MS08-037: Vulnerabilities in DNS could allow spoofing

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx/kb/953230

How to reserve a range of ephemeral ports on a computer that is running

Windows Server 2003 or Windows 2000 Server

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/812873

You experience issues with UDP-dependent network services after you install

DNS Server service security update 953230 (MS08-037)

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx/kb/956188

Some Services May Fail to Start or May Not Work Properly After Installing

MS08-037 (951746 and 951748)

http://blogs.technet.com/sbs/archive/2008/07/17/some-services-may-fail-to-start-or-may-not-work-properly-after-installing-ms08-037-951746-and-951748.aspx

SBS Services failing after MS08-037 - KB951746 and 951748

http://msmvps.com/blogs/thenakedmvp/archive/2008/07/18/sbs-services-failing-after-ms08-037-kb951746-and-951748.aspx

--------------------------------------------

Ace

September 22, 2008

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Thank you Meinolf - I did look at this link last Friday. I did look at the

(.) root zone part, but to me, they are suggesting I change my zone to type,

and I'm not sure I am comfortable doing that when I'm not having issues with

my other DCs and their DNS server service, etc...

"Meinolf Weber" wrote:

> Hello Saral6978,

>

> For event id 4015 check out this article and the part with the (.) root zone

> from Adrian Grigorof.

> http://www.eventid.net/display.asp?eventid=4015&eventno=333&source=DNS&phase=1

>

> Best regards

>

> Meinolf Weber

> Disclaimer: This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers

> no rights.

> ** Please do NOT email, only reply to Newsgroups

> ** HELP us help YOU!!! http://www.blakjak.demon.co.uk/mul_crss.htm

>

> > Ace - thank you so much for your reply, I really appreciate it.

> >

> > 3 of the DCs, which includes the one I'm having issues with, are

> > running Windows 2003 R2, SP2, and the other 2 DCs are running Windows

> > 2003, SP2.

> >

> > I am getting one error in the DNS Server log, but I have to confirm if

> > it's being generated during the reboot when DNS is set to automatic,

> > or if it's being logged because I have DNS Server set to manual. In

> > any case, it's Event ID 4015: The DNS server has encountered a

> > critical error from the Active Directory. Check that the Active

> > Directory is functioning properly. The event data contains the error.

> >

> > I have been looking into this error and possible causes. My AD does

> > seem to be functioning correctly though, as there are no other errors

> > in my event log, and shortly after 4015 is logged, another event says

> > DNS has started and there are no other errors. I'm not sure if that's

> > when I manually turned it on or not. I will be doing a reboot Monday

> > and keep better track of when these errors/alerts are happening.

> >

> > AD sites and services is setup properly and replication is running

> > seamlessly. I do have DNS set to point to itself first on all my DCs,

> > and then I pick another DC in another site as second. When I meant

> > "secondary", I meant just the secondary DNS server, not a zone. I

> > only have the one zone with the one domain.

> >

> > I would never have deleted the Zone from DNS - My plan was to go into

> > Add/Remove programs and uncheck DNS from the DC and uninstall it. So,

> > by what you said, I should be able to safely uninstall DNS from

> > Windows Components on the domain controller without hosing my current

> > Active Directory/AD Integrated Zone and affecting my other DCs? If I

> > can do this, it might be worth a shot to see if this would solve the

> > problem.

> >

> > But, before I do that, since I now have a 2nd DC at this particular

> > site, I will change my problem DC's 1st DNS server to the the 2nd DC

> > of that site and see if I can get it to start. Someone had also

> > mentioned there are a few Windows updates that are specifically

> > security updates for DNS that can affect services from starting (using

> > UDP ports) and that you have to reserve a port, because there is a

> > port that DNS or AD might be using that it can't because this port is

> > in use. Problem is, I have no idea what ports to attempt to reserve

> > to see if that is truly the problem. DNS to my knowledge only uses

> > TCP and UDP ports 53. I'm not sure about AD though, I haven't checked

> > it.

> >

> > Thanks, again!

> >

> > Sara

> >

> > "Ace Fekay [MVP Direcrtory Services]" wrote:

> >

> >> "Meinolf Weber" wrote in message

> >> news:ff16fb667ac58cae934bc873a5b@msnews.microsoft.com...

> >>

> >>>> <Is this the only DC/DNS server?>

> >>>>

> >>>> At this particular site it was...I orignally had it configured to

> >>>> use

> >>>> itself and a remote DNS server at my main site for it's DNS server.

> >>>> It was a record 48hrs that it sat at Preparing Network Connections.

> >>>> It

> >>>> had done a reboot about 5:00am on a Saturday and Monday morning it

> >>>> was

> >>>> still sitting at the screen. DNS had been flaking out for the past

> >>>> 2

> >>>> weeks after some updates had applied, for example, my DNS zone

> >>>> would

> >>>> be empty and I had to manually restart the DNS server service for

> >>>> it

> >>>> to populate but then it would still boot up okay...then about 2

> >>>> weeks

> >>>> later, it just got stuck on that part of the reboot. I figured out

> >>>> the issue was the DNS Server because I went into Safe mode and

> >>>> changed

> >>>> it to Manual, then no problem.

> >>>> <If you have an additional DC, i would make it also DNS server use

> >>>> AD integrated zones and configure both of them for preferred DNS as

> >>>> itself and secondary to the other.>

> >>>>

> >>>> The secondary DNS server that I just brought up, I did install DNS

> >>>> on it as well, and it's zone is also AD-Integrated. I installed

> >>>> DNS first, then added the DC role to it so it configured the

> >>>> AD-Integrated zone automatically. This backup DC is fully

> >>>> operational, replicating with the other 4 DCs in my domain (at 3

> >>>> different sites). I configured its DNS with itself as the primary,

> >>>> the above DC having issues is the secondary, and I added one of my

> >>>> remote DNS servers as a third.

> >>>>

> >>>> And like you suggested, I had added my newly promoted DC as the

> >>>> secondary DNS server to the one having the problem starting up. I

> >>>> have not yet attempted a reboot yet on the server having the issue,

> >>>> so perhaps this will solve it, but the problem still exists that

> >>>> why now all of a sudden this server can't find itself as a DNS

> >>>> server during the boot process when it was working just fine a

> >>>> couple of weeks ago? That's why I'm wondering if I just remove DNS

> >>>> from this server and reinstall it, it might fix whatever the

> >>>> problem is...

> >>>>

> >>>> Thanks for your reply,

> >>>>

> >>>> Sara

> >>>>

> >> Sara,

> >>

> >> What operating system and service pack level are your DCs?

> >> Do you have AD Sites configured properly?

> >> What errors are on any of the DCs? If any exist, please post the

> >> EventID#

> >> and Source names.

> >> I'm trying to get a handle on your infrastructure. Not sure what was

> >> installed or updated, but any of the updates would not cause this

> >> issue. So I'll give you a generalization of what to look for with

> >> configuring your DCs in a multi-site scenario and other

> >> recommendations.

> >>

> >> In a multi-site config with Sites configured properly, always point

> >> DNS to itself as first, and pick another DC in another site as

> >> second.

> >>

> >> There is no such thing as a 'secondary' zone, unless of coure you are

> >> speaking of the position as being the 'second' DNS address in ip

> >> properties.

> >>

> >> If you have any DC with a tru "Secondary" zone of a zone that is AD

> >> integrated, expect huge problems. If so, it will cause duplicate

> >> zones in the AD database and that is not easily cleaned up.

> >>

> >> If you have ever wanted to uninstall DNS on a DC, and decided to

> >> manually delete an AD Integrated zone first prior to uninstallation,

> >> you have just effectively deleted the whole zone out of AD. If you

> >> want to remove the DNS service off a DC that has an AD integrated

> >> zone, simply go into Add/Remove, Windows Components, and uncheck the

> >> box. Never delete the zone first.

> >>

> >> If a server cannot 'find itself' for DNS, I would suggest to change

> >> it's first entry to another DC in another Site with an operational

> >> DNS and let it come up. Then put itself as second. Reboot after about

> >> an hour to make sure it still comes up. If it comes up clean, then

> >> change it to itself as the first entry, then the other one as the

> >> second entry. The reason why it can't find itself is because AD is

> >> not up yet for whatever reason, such as possibly an update, or an app

> >> change and needed to do something during the restart, etc, therefore

> >> since AD is not up yet, and the zone is Ad integrated, then DNS can't

> >> find it in the AD database simply because AD services have not

> >> started yet.

> >>

> >> Make sense?

> >>

> >> So applying what i mentioned, can you backtrack on what was done and

> >> in what order as to what was done to better understand what may have

> >> happened?

> >>

> >> --

> >> Regards,

> >> Ace

> >> This posting is provided "AS-IS" with no warranties or guarantees and

> >> confers no rights.

> >>

> >> Ace Fekay, MCSE 2003 & 2000, MCSA 2003 & 2000, MCSE+I, MCT,

> >> MVP Microsoft MVP - Directory Services

> >> Microsoft Certified Trainer

> >> For urgent issues, you may want to contact Microsoft PSS directly.

> >> Please check http://support.microsoft.com for regional support phone

> >> numbers.

> >>

> >> Enter into an artificial quantum singularity lined with fermions and

> >> neutrino scatterings depicted by electrons smashing into protons and

> >> neutrons like billiard balls moving at warp 9 exposing quarks, mesons

> >> and baryons, the essentials of their existence, that are spinning off

> >> in half scatters. You have now entered the Twilight Zone.

> >>

>

September 22, 2008

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Ace -

Yes, I realize that DNS should be set to automatic, believe me, I want to

switch it back. Unfortunately, the server won't boot up if it is set to

automatic. Currently, it is still set to manual, and if I happen to reboot

the server, I then log in and start DNS Server right away manually. It's not

that I have DNS stopped altogether or anything.

<<The security update reserves 2500 UDP ephemeral ports. The ephemeral ports

are the response ports anywhere between UDP 1025 and UDP 2500. Sometimes this

can cause problems with 3rd apps installed that need these ports as well as

the IPSec service.>>

I don't have much running on this DC, but I do have 3rd party tools, like a

SurfControl Agent, a SpecOpsPasswordPolicy agent running, both which

communicate with AD. I've looked at all the documentation that you noted

below about the ports last week. Thursday night I did remove 3 updates that

I suspected might be causing the issue and when I removed them my server

booted normally with DNS Server on automatic. I then applied the 3 updates

one at a time and after I installed KB945553 (which is a DNS security

update), my server got stuck again on Preparing Network Connections. I then

booted into Safe Mode, switched DNS back to manual, then booted back into the

regular OS and uninstalled only that update and switched DNS back to Auto,

but unfortunately, the server still got stuck on reboot. I removed those

other 2 updates again, and it still wouldn't boot. So, I'm not sure why it

booted okay the first time after I removed all 3 updates (only difference was

that I didn't remove them in the same order that I did the first time).

Well, in any case, I'm going to do a reboot this morning to see what happens

with using a different DNS server as the primary and of course, resetting my

service back to Automatic before the reboot.

Sara

"Ace Fekay [MVP Direcrtory Services]" wrote:

> "Saral6978" <Saral6978@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message

> news:72CEBDBC-AE50-4510-A5EA-7D6A0319F8F0@microsoft.com...

> > Ace - thank you so much for your reply, I really appreciate it.

> >

> > 3 of the DCs, which includes the one I'm having issues with, are running

> > Windows 2003 R2, SP2, and the other 2 DCs are running Windows 2003, SP2.

> >

> > I am getting one error in the DNS Server log, but I have to confirm if

> > it's

> > being generated during the reboot when DNS is set to automatic, or if it's

> > being logged because I have DNS Server set to manual. In any case, it's

> > Event ID 4015: The DNS server has encountered a critical error from the

> > Active Directory. Check that the Active Directory is functioning properly.

> > The event data contains the error.

> >

> > I have been looking into this error and possible causes. My AD does seem

> > to

> > be functioning correctly though, as there are no other errors in my event

> > log, and shortly after 4015 is logged, another event says DNS has started

> > and

> > there are no other errors. I'm not sure if that's when I manually turned

> > it

> > on or not. I will be doing a reboot Monday and keep better track of when

> > these errors/alerts are happening.

> >

> > AD sites and services is setup properly and replication is running

> > seamlessly. I do have DNS set to point to itself first on all my DCs, and

> > then I pick another DC in another site as second. When I meant

> > "secondary",

> > I meant just the secondary DNS server, not a zone. I only have the one

> > zone

> > with the one domain.

> >

> > I would never have deleted the Zone from DNS - My plan was to go into

> > Add/Remove programs and uncheck DNS from the DC and uninstall it. So, by

> > what you said, I should be able to safely uninstall DNS from Windows

> > Components on the domain controller without hosing my current Active

> > Directory/AD Integrated Zone and affecting my other DCs? If I can do

> > this,

> > it might be worth a shot to see if this would solve the problem.

> >

> > But, before I do that, since I now have a 2nd DC at this particular site,

> > I

> > will change my problem DC's 1st DNS server to the the 2nd DC of that site

> > and

> > see if I can get it to start. Someone had also mentioned there are a few

> > Windows updates that are specifically security updates for DNS that can

> > affect services from starting (using UDP ports) and that you have to

> > reserve

> > a port, because there is a port that DNS or AD might be using that it

> > can't

> > because this port is in use. Problem is, I have no idea what ports to

> > attempt to reserve to see if that is truly the problem. DNS to my

> > knowledge

> > only uses TCP and UDP ports 53. I'm not sure about AD though, I haven't

> > checked it.

> >

> > Thanks, again!

> >

> > Sara

>

> Hi Sara,

>

> Honestly I haven't heard of these problems until now. But a real important

> point, is that you must keep the DNS service set to automatic at all times.

> Otherwise leaving it to manual will cause issues at startup because AD can't

> find itself if the first entry is pointed to itself unless the DNS service

> is running. Otherwise, how is it supposed to query a non-running DNS

> service?

>

> As for uninstalling, yes, just uncheck the box. But I would leave the

> service enabled and try it out.

>

> The security update reserves 2500 UDP ephemeral ports. The ephemeral ports

> are the response ports anywhere between UDP 1025 and UDP 2500. Sometimes

> this can cause problems with 3rd apps installed that need these ports as

> well as the IPSec service. Otherwise, if you don't have anything else

> installed, it shouldn't be a problem. The following is more info on the

> security update and the ports being used. But I don't think this is the

> cause of the problem.

>

> ---------------------------------

> The DNS patch will reserve 2500 ephemeral UDP ports. When you run a

> netstat -ab, it will display the 2500 UDP ports that have been

> reserved, but not necessarily in use. This is part of the memory

> consumption. I've noticed the following (your mileage may vary):

>

> dns.exe Before After

> Mem usage 9758K 36,232K

> Peak Mem 10,208K 36,584K

> Paged Pool 71K 798K

> NP Pool 17K 4,833K

> Handles 238 5,217

> Threads 20 20

>

> MS08-037: Description of the security update for DNS in Windows Server 2003,

> in Windows XP, and in Windows 2000 Server (client side): July 8, 2008:

> http://support.microsoft.com/?id=951748

>

> MS08-037: Vulnerabilities in DNS could allow spoofing

> http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx/kb/953230

>

> How to reserve a range of ephemeral ports on a computer that is running

> Windows Server 2003 or Windows 2000 Server

> http://support.microsoft.com/kb/812873

>

> You experience issues with UDP-dependent network services after you install

> DNS Server service security update 953230 (MS08-037)

> http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx/kb/956188

>

> Some Services May Fail to Start or May Not Work Properly After Installing

> MS08-037 (951746 and 951748)

> http://blogs.technet.com/sbs/archive/2008/07/17/some-services-may-fail-to-start-or-may-not-work-properly-after-installing-ms08-037-951746-and-951748.aspx

>

> SBS Services failing after MS08-037 - KB951746 and 951748

> http://msmvps.com/blogs/thenakedmvp/archive/2008/07/18/sbs-services-failing-after-ms08-037-kb951746-and-951748.aspx

> --------------------------------------------

>

> Ace

>

September 22, 2008

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Well, this is kind of interesting...here is what I did. I installed all need

critical updates, including all the DNS security updates I hadn't yet

applied, and the ones I removed, added my other DC as the Secondary DNS

server on the NIC, changed the DNS Server service to automatic and rebooted.

My server rebooted very quickly and successfully! I then remove that

secondary DNS server and put in one from my remote site, and then rebooted

the server and it still worked!

So, I'm thinking that by installing ALL the necessary windows updates that

it might have fixed my problem...I really don't know. I know longer have the

4015 error, and no other errors pertaining to DNS or active directory.

Everything is running as it should.

I don't know what to say about this...very strange.

Thanks Ace and Meinolf for your responses to my questions! They were much

appreciated!

Sara

"Saral6978" wrote:

> Ace -

>

> Yes, I realize that DNS should be set to automatic, believe me, I want to

> switch it back. Unfortunately, the server won't boot up if it is set to

> automatic. Currently, it is still set to manual, and if I happen to reboot

> the server, I then log in and start DNS Server right away manually. It's not

> that I have DNS stopped altogether or anything.

>

> <<The security update reserves 2500 UDP ephemeral ports. The ephemeral ports

> are the response ports anywhere between UDP 1025 and UDP 2500. Sometimes this

> can cause problems with 3rd apps installed that need these ports as well as

> the IPSec service.>>

>

> I don't have much running on this DC, but I do have 3rd party tools, like a

> SurfControl Agent, a SpecOpsPasswordPolicy agent running, both which

> communicate with AD. I've looked at all the documentation that you noted

> below about the ports last week. Thursday night I did remove 3 updates that

> I suspected might be causing the issue and when I removed them my server

> booted normally with DNS Server on automatic. I then applied the 3 updates

> one at a time and after I installed KB945553 (which is a DNS security

> update), my server got stuck again on Preparing Network Connections. I then

> booted into Safe Mode, switched DNS back to manual, then booted back into the

> regular OS and uninstalled only that update and switched DNS back to Auto,

> but unfortunately, the server still got stuck on reboot. I removed those

> other 2 updates again, and it still wouldn't boot. So, I'm not sure why it

> booted okay the first time after I removed all 3 updates (only difference was

> that I didn't remove them in the same order that I did the first time).

>

> Well, in any case, I'm going to do a reboot this morning to see what happens

> with using a different DNS server as the primary and of course, resetting my

> service back to Automatic before the reboot.

>

> Sara

>

> "Ace Fekay [MVP Direcrtory Services]" wrote:

>

> > "Saral6978" <Saral6978@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message

> > news:72CEBDBC-AE50-4510-A5EA-7D6A0319F8F0@microsoft.com...

> > > Ace - thank you so much for your reply, I really appreciate it.

> > >

> > > 3 of the DCs, which includes the one I'm having issues with, are running

> > > Windows 2003 R2, SP2, and the other 2 DCs are running Windows 2003, SP2.

> > >

> > > I am getting one error in the DNS Server log, but I have to confirm if

> > > it's

> > > being generated during the reboot when DNS is set to automatic, or if it's

> > > being logged because I have DNS Server set to manual. In any case, it's

> > > Event ID 4015: The DNS server has encountered a critical error from the

> > > Active Directory. Check that the Active Directory is functioning properly.

> > > The event data contains the error.

> > >

> > > I have been looking into this error and possible causes. My AD does seem

> > > to

> > > be functioning correctly though, as there are no other errors in my event

> > > log, and shortly after 4015 is logged, another event says DNS has started

> > > and

> > > there are no other errors. I'm not sure if that's when I manually turned

> > > it

> > > on or not. I will be doing a reboot Monday and keep better track of when

> > > these errors/alerts are happening.

> > >

> > > AD sites and services is setup properly and replication is running

> > > seamlessly. I do have DNS set to point to itself first on all my DCs, and

> > > then I pick another DC in another site as second. When I meant

> > > "secondary",

> > > I meant just the secondary DNS server, not a zone. I only have the one

> > > zone

> > > with the one domain.

> > >

> > > I would never have deleted the Zone from DNS - My plan was to go into

> > > Add/Remove programs and uncheck DNS from the DC and uninstall it. So, by

> > > what you said, I should be able to safely uninstall DNS from Windows

> > > Components on the domain controller without hosing my current Active

> > > Directory/AD Integrated Zone and affecting my other DCs? If I can do

> > > this,

> > > it might be worth a shot to see if this would solve the problem.

> > >

> > > But, before I do that, since I now have a 2nd DC at this particular site,

> > > I

> > > will change my problem DC's 1st DNS server to the the 2nd DC of that site

> > > and

> > > see if I can get it to start. Someone had also mentioned there are a few

> > > Windows updates that are specifically security updates for DNS that can

> > > affect services from starting (using UDP ports) and that you have to

> > > reserve

> > > a port, because there is a port that DNS or AD might be using that it

> > > can't

> > > because this port is in use. Problem is, I have no idea what ports to

> > > attempt to reserve to see if that is truly the problem. DNS to my

> > > knowledge

> > > only uses TCP and UDP ports 53. I'm not sure about AD though, I haven't

> > > checked it.

> > >

> > > Thanks, again!

> > >

> > > Sara

> >

> > Hi Sara,

> >

> > Honestly I haven't heard of these problems until now. But a real important

> > point, is that you must keep the DNS service set to automatic at all times.

> > Otherwise leaving it to manual will cause issues at startup because AD can't

> > find itself if the first entry is pointed to itself unless the DNS service

> > is running. Otherwise, how is it supposed to query a non-running DNS

> > service?

> >

> > As for uninstalling, yes, just uncheck the box. But I would leave the

> > service enabled and try it out.

> >

> > The security update reserves 2500 UDP ephemeral ports. The ephemeral ports

> > are the response ports anywhere between UDP 1025 and UDP 2500. Sometimes

> > this can cause problems with 3rd apps installed that need these ports as

> > well as the IPSec service. Otherwise, if you don't have anything else

> > installed, it shouldn't be a problem. The following is more info on the

> > security update and the ports being used. But I don't think this is the

> > cause of the problem.

> >

> > ---------------------------------

> > The DNS patch will reserve 2500 ephemeral UDP ports. When you run a

> > netstat -ab, it will display the 2500 UDP ports that have been

> > reserved, but not necessarily in use. This is part of the memory

> > consumption. I've noticed the following (your mileage may vary):

> >

> > dns.exe Before After

> > Mem usage 9758K 36,232K

> > Peak Mem 10,208K 36,584K

> > Paged Pool 71K 798K

> > NP Pool 17K 4,833K

> > Handles 238 5,217

> > Threads 20 20

> >

> > MS08-037: Description of the security update for DNS in Windows Server 2003,

> > in Windows XP, and in Windows 2000 Server (client side): July 8, 2008:

> > http://support.microsoft.com/?id=951748

> >

> > MS08-037: Vulnerabilities in DNS could allow spoofing

> > http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx/kb/953230

> >

> > How to reserve a range of ephemeral ports on a computer that is running

> > Windows Server 2003 or Windows 2000 Server

> > http://support.microsoft.com/kb/812873

> >

> > You experience issues with UDP-dependent network services after you install

> > DNS Server service security update 953230 (MS08-037)

> > http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx/kb/956188

> >

> > Some Services May Fail to Start or May Not Work Properly After Installing

> > MS08-037 (951746 and 951748)

> > http://blogs.technet.com/sbs/archive/2008/07/17/some-services-may-fail-to-start-or-may-not-work-properly-after-installing-ms08-037-951746-and-951748.aspx

> >

> > SBS Services failing after MS08-037 - KB951746 and 951748

> > http://msmvps.com/blogs/thenakedmvp/archive/2008/07/18/sbs-services-failing-after-ms08-037-kb951746-and-951748.aspx

> > --------------------------------------------

> >

> > Ace

> >

September 22, 2008

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Hello Saral6978,

Nice to hear that you fixed it.

Best regards

Meinolf Weber

Disclaimer: This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers

no rights.

** Please do NOT email, only reply to Newsgroups

** HELP us help YOU!!! http://www.blakjak.demon.co.uk/mul_crss.htm

> Well, this is kind of interesting...here is what I did. I installed

> all need critical updates, including all the DNS security updates I

> hadn't yet applied, and the ones I removed, added my other DC as the

> Secondary DNS server on the NIC, changed the DNS Server service to

> automatic and rebooted. My server rebooted very quickly and

> successfully! I then remove that secondary DNS server and put in one

> from my remote site, and then rebooted the server and it still worked!

>

> So, I'm thinking that by installing ALL the necessary windows updates

> that it might have fixed my problem...I really don't know. I know

> longer have the 4015 error, and no other errors pertaining to DNS or

> active directory. Everything is running as it should.

>

> I don't know what to say about this...very strange.

>

> Thanks Ace and Meinolf for your responses to my questions! They were

> much appreciated!

>

> Sara

> "Saral6978" wrote:

>> Ace -

>>

>> Yes, I realize that DNS should be set to automatic, believe me, I

>> want to switch it back. Unfortunately, the server won't boot up if

>> it is set to automatic. Currently, it is still set to manual, and if

>> I happen to reboot the server, I then log in and start DNS Server

>> right away manually. It's not that I have DNS stopped altogether or

>> anything.

>>

>> <<The security update reserves 2500 UDP ephemeral ports. The

>> ephemeral ports are the response ports anywhere between UDP 1025 and

>> UDP 2500. Sometimes this can cause problems with 3rd apps installed

>> that need these ports as well as the IPSec service.>>

>>

>> I don't have much running on this DC, but I do have 3rd party tools,

>> like a SurfControl Agent, a SpecOpsPasswordPolicy agent running, both

>> which communicate with AD. I've looked at all the documentation that

>> you noted below about the ports last week. Thursday night I did

>> remove 3 updates that I suspected might be causing the issue and when

>> I removed them my server booted normally with DNS Server on

>> automatic. I then applied the 3 updates one at a time and after I

>> installed KB945553 (which is a DNS security update), my server got

>> stuck again on Preparing Network Connections. I then booted into

>> Safe Mode, switched DNS back to manual, then booted back into the

>> regular OS and uninstalled only that update and switched DNS back to

>> Auto, but unfortunately, the server still got stuck on reboot. I

>> removed those other 2 updates again, and it still wouldn't boot. So,

>> I'm not sure why it booted okay the first time after I removed all 3

>> updates (only difference was that I didn't remove them in the same

>> order that I did the first time).

>>

>> Well, in any case, I'm going to do a reboot this morning to see what

>> happens with using a different DNS server as the primary and of

>> course, resetting my service back to Automatic before the reboot.

>>

>> Sara

>>

>> "Ace Fekay [MVP Direcrtory Services]" wrote:

>>

>>> "Saral6978" <Saral6978@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message

>>> news:72CEBDBC-AE50-4510-A5EA-7D6A0319F8F0@microsoft.com...

>>>

>>>> Ace - thank you so much for your reply, I really appreciate it.

>>>>

>>>> 3 of the DCs, which includes the one I'm having issues with, are

>>>> running Windows 2003 R2, SP2, and the other 2 DCs are running

>>>> Windows 2003, SP2.

>>>>

>>>> I am getting one error in the DNS Server log, but I have to confirm

>>>> if

>>>> it's

>>>> being generated during the reboot when DNS is set to automatic, or

>>>> if it's

>>>> being logged because I have DNS Server set to manual. In any case,

>>>> it's

>>>> Event ID 4015: The DNS server has encountered a critical error

>>>> from the

>>>> Active Directory. Check that the Active Directory is functioning

>>>> properly.

>>>> The event data contains the error.

>>>> I have been looking into this error and possible causes. My AD

>>>> does seem

>>>> to

>>>> be functioning correctly though, as there are no other errors in my

>>>> event

>>>> log, and shortly after 4015 is logged, another event says DNS has

>>>> started

>>>> and

>>>> there are no other errors. I'm not sure if that's when I manually

>>>> turned

>>>> it

>>>> on or not. I will be doing a reboot Monday and keep better track

>>>> of when

>>>> these errors/alerts are happening.

>>>> AD sites and services is setup properly and replication is running

>>>> seamlessly. I do have DNS set to point to itself first on all my

>>>> DCs, and

>>>> then I pick another DC in another site as second. When I meant

>>>> "secondary",

>>>> I meant just the secondary DNS server, not a zone. I only have the

>>>> one

>>>> zone

>>>> with the one domain.

>>>> I would never have deleted the Zone from DNS - My plan was to go

>>>> into

>>>> Add/Remove programs and uncheck DNS from the DC and uninstall it.

>>>> So, by

>>>> what you said, I should be able to safely uninstall DNS from

>>>> Windows

>>>> Components on the domain controller without hosing my current

>>>> Active

>>>> Directory/AD Integrated Zone and affecting my other DCs? If I can

>>>> do

>>>> this,

>>>> it might be worth a shot to see if this would solve the problem.

>>>> But, before I do that, since I now have a 2nd DC at this particular

>>>> site,

>>>> I

>>>> will change my problem DC's 1st DNS server to the the 2nd DC of

>>>> that site

>>>> and

>>>> see if I can get it to start. Someone had also mentioned there are

>>>> a few

>>>> Windows updates that are specifically security updates for DNS that

>>>> can

>>>> affect services from starting (using UDP ports) and that you have

>>>> to

>>>> reserve

>>>> a port, because there is a port that DNS or AD might be using that

>>>> it

>>>> can't

>>>> because this port is in use. Problem is, I have no idea what ports

>>>> to

>>>> attempt to reserve to see if that is truly the problem. DNS to my

>>>> knowledge

>>>> only uses TCP and UDP ports 53. I'm not sure about AD though, I

>>>> haven't

>>>> checked it.

>>>> Thanks, again!

>>>>

>>>> Sara

>>>>

>>> Hi Sara,

>>>

>>> Honestly I haven't heard of these problems until now. But a real

>>> important point, is that you must keep the DNS service set to

>>> automatic at all times. Otherwise leaving it to manual will cause

>>> issues at startup because AD can't find itself if the first entry is

>>> pointed to itself unless the DNS service is running. Otherwise, how

>>> is it supposed to query a non-running DNS service?

>>>

>>> As for uninstalling, yes, just uncheck the box. But I would leave

>>> the service enabled and try it out.

>>>

>>> The security update reserves 2500 UDP ephemeral ports. The ephemeral

>>> ports are the response ports anywhere between UDP 1025 and UDP 2500.

>>> Sometimes this can cause problems with 3rd apps installed that need

>>> these ports as well as the IPSec service. Otherwise, if you don't

>>> have anything else installed, it shouldn't be a problem. The

>>> following is more info on the security update and the ports being

>>> used. But I don't think this is the cause of the problem.

>>>

>>> ---------------------------------

>>> The DNS patch will reserve 2500 ephemeral UDP ports. When you run a

>>> netstat -ab, it will display the 2500 UDP ports that have been

>>> reserved, but not necessarily in use. This is part of the memory

>>> consumption. I've noticed the following (your mileage may vary):

>>> dns.exe Before After

>>> Mem usage 9758K 36,232K

>>> Peak Mem 10,208K 36,584K

>>> Paged Pool 71K 798K

>>> NP Pool 17K 4,833K

>>> Handles 238 5,217

>>> Threads 20 20

>>> MS08-037: Description of the security update for DNS in Windows

>>> Server 2003, in Windows XP, and in Windows 2000 Server (client

>>> side): July 8, 2008: http://support.microsoft.com/?id=951748

>>>

>>> MS08-037: Vulnerabilities in DNS could allow spoofing

>>> http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx/kb/953230

>>>

>>> How to reserve a range of ephemeral ports on a computer that is

>>> running Windows Server 2003 or Windows 2000 Server

>>> http://support.microsoft.com/kb/812873

>>>

>>> You experience issues with UDP-dependent network services after you

>>> install DNS Server service security update 953230 (MS08-037)

>>> http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx/kb/956188

>>>

>>> Some Services May Fail to Start or May Not Work Properly After

>>> Installing

>>>

>>> MS08-037 (951746 and 951748)

>>>

>>> http://blogs.technet.com/sbs/archive/2008/07/17/some-services-may-fa

>>> il-to-start-or-may-not-work-properly-after-installing-ms08-037-95174

>>> 6-and-951748.aspx

>>>

>>> SBS Services failing after MS08-037 - KB951746 and 951748

>>>

>>> http://msmvps.com/blogs/thenakedmvp/archive/2008/07/18/sbs-services-

>>> failing-after-ms08-037-kb951746-and-951748.aspx

>>>

>>> --------------------------------------------

>>>

>>> Ace

>>>

September 22, 2008

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

"Saral6978" <Saral6978@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message

news:1316F612-CBA7-4165-AFDB-7C9B24FF54EE@microsoft.com...

> Thank you Meinolf - I did look at this link last Friday. I did look at

> the

> (.) root zone part, but to me, they are suggesting I change my zone to

> type,

> and I'm not sure I am comfortable doing that when I'm not having issues

> with

> my other DCs and their DNS server service, etc...

There is no harm with this procedure. None whatsoever. Believe me, done it a

thousand times, and I can say that because of numerous testing and as a

trainer in a classroom scenario, as well as in production environments.

Ace

September 22, 2008

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

Re: Can you remove DNS from Domain Controller and reinstall to rep

"Saral6978" <Saral6978@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message

news:0AF107B4-B142-4A5F-9B61-BDC06E44BF4C@microsoft.com...

> Well, this is kind of interesting...here is what I did. I installed all

> need

> critical updates, including all the DNS security updates I hadn't yet

> applied, and the ones I removed, added my other DC as the Secondary DNS

> server on the NIC, changed the DNS Server service to automatic and

> rebooted.

> My server rebooted very quickly and successfully! I then remove that

> secondary DNS server and put in one from my remote site, and then rebooted

> the server and it still worked!

>

> So, I'm thinking that by installing ALL the necessary windows updates that

> it might have fixed my problem...I really don't know. I know longer have

> the

> 4015 error, and no other errors pertaining to DNS or active directory.

> Everything is running as it should.

>

> I don't know what to say about this...very strange.

>

> Thanks Ace and Meinolf for your responses to my questions! They were much

> appreciated!

>

> Sara

Same here, nice to hear it's taken care of. For the security updates to

cause this would indicate one of those apps are trying to use a UDP

emepheral port in the reserved range and is causing a conflict. I'm willing

to bet that if those apps were moved off the DC (usually we recommend no

apps on a DC and let a DC be a DC), that it will work. There are known

issues with 3rd party apps that do not recognize the port reservation still

picks a random port in that range causing a conflict.

For the time being if you want to leave the 3rd party apps on it, that is

fine. If you ever do move them off, be sure to install those updates.

Ace

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