Vista or Bust? Moving to a New Machine

[Guest wtw]

I'm reconstructing my present 5 year old machine after a c-drive failure.

I'm considering going to Vista rather than building a new machine with XP on

it. I have a few concerns about this. I've been told that if I go Vista with

a store bought machine, it is unlikely flushing the drive and installing XP

will work. The machine I'm looking at as a replacement is an HP quad core

with 6G of memory. I'm pretty sure that's a 64-bit machine. Should I be

concerned about some of my older programs that were running a 5 year old

ASUS MB? Office 97 and some non-MS apps.

[Guest Malke]

Re: Vista or Bust? Moving to a New Machine

 

wtw wrote:

> I'm reconstructing my present 5 year old machine after a c-drive failure.

> I'm considering going to Vista rather than building a new machine with XP

> on it. I have a few concerns about this. I've been told that if I go Vista

> with a store bought machine, it is unlikely flushing the drive and

> installing XP will work. The machine I'm looking at as a replacement is an

> HP quad core

> with 6G of memory. I'm pretty sure that's a 64-bit machine. Should I be

> concerned about some of my older programs that were running a 5 year old

> ASUS MB? Office 97 and some non-MS apps.

 

Office 97 is not compatible with Vista. As for other applications, you need

to go to each program's website and see. In some cases, older programs will

run fine on Vista. In many cases, they won't. There is no "one size fits

all" rule so you need to do your homework *first*. Ditto for any hardware

peripherals - printers, scanners, webcams, etc.

 

Also note that if you want to use all 6GB of RAM, you will need to run a

64-bit operating system. XP has a 64-bit flavor as does Vista. Make sure

that 64-bit drivers are available from the OEM for whatever operating

system you want to use.

 

Personally, I think purchasing a new computer is the way to go. You need to

decide what operating system you want and that will help you decide what to

buy. Below is my standard "how to replace Vista w/XP" information which I

hope helps you.

 

A. On an OEM (HP, Sony, etc.) computer:

 

1. Go to the OEM's website and look for XP drivers for your specific model

computer. If there are no XP drivers, then you can't install XP. End of

story. If there are drivers, download them and store on a CD-R or USB

thumbdrive; you'll need them after you install XP.

 

2. Check with the OEM - either from their tech support website or by calling

them - to see if you will void your warranty if you do this. If you will

void the warranty, you make the decision.

 

3. If the OEM does support XP on the machine, call them and see if you can

have downgrade rights and have them send you an XP restore disk. This will

be far the easiest and best way of getting XP on the machine. Note: Dell

will sell you XP preinstalled on some models "designed for Vista" from the

business side of the store. HP probably will, too.

 

4. If XP is supported on the machine but the OEM doesn't have an XP restore

disk for you, understand that you'll need to purchase a retail copy of XP

from your favorite online or brick/mortar store.

 

5. Also understand that you will need to do a clean install of XP so if you

have any data you want, back it up first.

 

6. If none of the above is applicable to you because you can't run XP on

that machine (see Item #1 above), return the computer and purchase one

running XP instead.

 

B. On a generic/home-built computer (from non-OEM company) - You will need

drivers for all your hardware. See the second link below for more details:

 

http://michaelstevenstech.com/cleanxpinstall.html - Clean Install How-To

http://www.elephantboycomputers.com/page2.html#Reinstalling_Windows - What

you will need on-hand

 

Malke

--

MS-MVP

Elephant Boy Computers - Don't Panic!

FAQ - http://www.elephantboycomputers.com/#FAQ

[Guest wtw]

Re: Vista or Bust? Moving to a New Machine

 

Thanks.

While I was checking out new computers in the store yesterday, I decided to

play with Vista. I discovered some demo video that went through, at least,

file operations. Does it or others like it exist on the web?

 

"Malke" <malke@invalid.invalid> wrote in message

news:%23kvuVBJJJHA.4568@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...

> wtw wrote:

>

>> I'm reconstructing my present 5 year old machine after a c-drive failure.

>> I'm considering going to Vista rather than building a new machine with XP

>> on it. I have a few concerns about this. I've been told that if I go

>> Vista

>> with a store bought machine, it is unlikely flushing the drive and

>> installing XP will work. The machine I'm looking at as a replacement is

>> an

>> HP quad core

>> with 6G of memory. I'm pretty sure that's a 64-bit machine. Should I be

>> concerned about some of my older programs that were running a 5 year old

>> ASUS MB? Office 97 and some non-MS apps.

>

> Office 97 is not compatible with Vista. As for other applications, you

> need

> to go to each program's website and see. In some cases, older programs

> will

> run fine on Vista. In many cases, they won't. There is no "one size fits

> all" rule so you need to do your homework *first*. Ditto for any hardware

> peripherals - printers, scanners, webcams, etc.

>

> Also note that if you want to use all 6GB of RAM, you will need to run a

> 64-bit operating system. XP has a 64-bit flavor as does Vista. Make sure

> that 64-bit drivers are available from the OEM for whatever operating

> system you want to use.

>

> Personally, I think purchasing a new computer is the way to go. You need

> to

> decide what operating system you want and that will help you decide what

> to

> buy. Below is my standard "how to replace Vista w/XP" information which I

> hope helps you.

>

> A. On an OEM (HP, Sony, etc.) computer:

>

> 1. Go to the OEM's website and look for XP drivers for your specific model

> computer. If there are no XP drivers, then you can't install XP. End of

> story. If there are drivers, download them and store on a CD-R or USB

> thumbdrive; you'll need them after you install XP.

>

> 2. Check with the OEM - either from their tech support website or by

> calling

> them - to see if you will void your warranty if you do this. If you will

> void the warranty, you make the decision.

>

> 3. If the OEM does support XP on the machine, call them and see if you can

> have downgrade rights and have them send you an XP restore disk. This will

> be far the easiest and best way of getting XP on the machine. Note: Dell

> will sell you XP preinstalled on some models "designed for Vista" from the

> business side of the store. HP probably will, too.

>

> 4. If XP is supported on the machine but the OEM doesn't have an XP

> restore

> disk for you, understand that you'll need to purchase a retail copy of XP

> from your favorite online or brick/mortar store.

>

> 5. Also understand that you will need to do a clean install of XP so if

> you

> have any data you want, back it up first.

>

> 6. If none of the above is applicable to you because you can't run XP on

> that machine (see Item #1 above), return the computer and purchase one

> running XP instead.

>

> B. On a generic/home-built computer (from non-OEM company) - You will need

> drivers for all your hardware. See the second link below for more details:

>

> http://michaelstevenstech.com/cleanxpinstall.html - Clean Install How-To

> http://www.elephantboycomputers.com/page2.html#Reinstalling_Windows - What

> you will need on-hand

>

> Malke

> --

> MS-MVP

> Elephant Boy Computers - Don't Panic!

> FAQ - http://www.elephantboycomputers.com/#FAQ

>

[Guest Bob I]

Re: Vista or Bust? Moving to a New Machine

 

Small correction about Office 97. It's "not supported", as opposed to

"not compatible". My wife is running Office 97 without any particular

issues on her Vista Home Premium Dell.

 

Malke wrote:

> wtw wrote:

>

>

>>I'm reconstructing my present 5 year old machine after a c-drive failure.

>>I'm considering going to Vista rather than building a new machine with XP

>>on it. I have a few concerns about this. I've been told that if I go Vista

>>with a store bought machine, it is unlikely flushing the drive and

>>installing XP will work. The machine I'm looking at as a replacement is an

>>HP quad core

>>with 6G of memory. I'm pretty sure that's a 64-bit machine. Should I be

>>concerned about some of my older programs that were running a 5 year old

>>ASUS MB? Office 97 and some non-MS apps.

>

>

> Office 97 is not compatible with Vista. As for other applications, you need

> to go to each program's website and see. In some cases, older programs will

> run fine on Vista. In many cases, they won't. There is no "one size fits

> all" rule so you need to do your homework *first*. Ditto for any hardware

> peripherals - printers, scanners, webcams, etc.

>

> Also note that if you want to use all 6GB of RAM, you will need to run a

> 64-bit operating system. XP has a 64-bit flavor as does Vista. Make sure

> that 64-bit drivers are available from the OEM for whatever operating

> system you want to use.

>

> Personally, I think purchasing a new computer is the way to go. You need to

> decide what operating system you want and that will help you decide what to

> buy. Below is my standard "how to replace Vista w/XP" information which I

> hope helps you.

>

> A. On an OEM (HP, Sony, etc.) computer:

>

> 1. Go to the OEM's website and look for XP drivers for your specific model

> computer. If there are no XP drivers, then you can't install XP. End of

> story. If there are drivers, download them and store on a CD-R or USB

> thumbdrive; you'll need them after you install XP.

>

> 2. Check with the OEM - either from their tech support website or by calling

> them - to see if you will void your warranty if you do this. If you will

> void the warranty, you make the decision.

>

> 3. If the OEM does support XP on the machine, call them and see if you can

> have downgrade rights and have them send you an XP restore disk. This will

> be far the easiest and best way of getting XP on the machine. Note: Dell

> will sell you XP preinstalled on some models "designed for Vista" from the

> business side of the store. HP probably will, too.

>

> 4. If XP is supported on the machine but the OEM doesn't have an XP restore

> disk for you, understand that you'll need to purchase a retail copy of XP

> from your favorite online or brick/mortar store.

>

> 5. Also understand that you will need to do a clean install of XP so if you

> have any data you want, back it up first.

>

> 6. If none of the above is applicable to you because you can't run XP on

> that machine (see Item #1 above), return the computer and purchase one

> running XP instead.

>

> B. On a generic/home-built computer (from non-OEM company) - You will need

> drivers for all your hardware. See the second link below for more details:

>

> http://michaelstevenstech.com/cleanxpinstall.html - Clean Install How-To

> http://www.elephantboycomputers.com/page2.html#Reinstalling_Windows - What

> you will need on-hand

>

> Malke

[Guest Ken Blake, MVP]

Re: Vista or Bust? Moving to a New Machine

 

On Thu, 2 Oct 2008 05:10:18 -0700, "wtw" <invalid@sbcglobal.net>

wrote:

> I'm reconstructing my present 5 year old machine after a c-drive failure.

> I'm considering going to Vista rather than building a new machine with XP on

> it. I have a few concerns about this. I've been told that if I go Vista with

> a store bought machine, it is unlikely flushing the drive and installing XP

> will work.

 

 

Why not? It has nothing to do with being store-bought, but only with

whether the hardware is adequate and whether needed drivers exist for

all your hardware. Many five year old machines do not have adequate

hardware; for example, I wouldn't run Vista without at least 2GB of

RAM.

 

The driver problem is much more likely lf it's a laptop,

 

> The machine I'm looking at as a replacement is an HP quad core

> with 6G of memory. I'm pretty sure that's a 64-bit machine.

 

 

With 6GB, I hope so. All 32-bit client versions of Windows (not just

Vista/XP) have a 4GB address space. That's the theoretical upper limit

beyond which you can not go.

 

But you can't use the entire 4GB of address space. Even though you

have a 4GB address space, you can only use *around* 3.1GB of RAM.

That's because some of that space is used by hardware and is not

available to the operating system and applications. The amount you can

use varies, depending on what hardware you have installed, but can

range from as little as 2GB to as much as 3.5GB. It's usually around

3.1GB.

 

Note that the hardware is using the address *space*, not the actual

RAM itself. The rest of the RAM goes unused because there is no

address space to map it too.

 

So note that you will need a 64-bit version of Vista to take advantage

of the 6GB.

 

 

> Should I be

> concerned about some of my older programs that were running a 5 year old

> ASUS MB? Office 97 and some non-MS apps.

 

 

The fact that it's a 5 year old ASUS MB is largely irrelevant. Most

programs, even non-MS, that ran under XP will also run under Vista.

However Microsoft Office 97 will not. But you should check each

program on its manufacturer's web site.

 

--

Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP - Windows Desktop Experience

Please Reply to the Newsgroup

[Guest wtw]

Re: Vista or Bust? Moving to a New Machine

 

That's a relief. I think I may have the pro version. However, it may be just

time to go with the student version. I've gotten Office versions very

inexpensively over the years, but in fact have not used some the facilities

like sql. I think the student version has PP, but maybe not. I use primarily

Excel, Word and PP. I think I might even get a good discount on it through

the local community college. I take something like "adult ed" classes that

get me discounts.

 

"Bob I" <birelan@yahoo.com> wrote in message

news:eViFzlJJJHA.5004@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...

> Small correction about Office 97. It's "not supported", as opposed to "not

> compatible". My wife is running Office 97 without any particular issues on

> her Vista Home Premium Dell.

>

> Malke wrote:

>

>> wtw wrote:

>>

>>

>>>I'm reconstructing my present 5 year old machine after a c-drive failure.

>>>I'm considering going to Vista rather than building a new machine with XP

>>>on it. I have a few concerns about this. I've been told that if I go

>>>Vista

>>>with a store bought machine, it is unlikely flushing the drive and

>>>installing XP will work. The machine I'm looking at as a replacement is

>>>an

>>>HP quad core

>>>with 6G of memory. I'm pretty sure that's a 64-bit machine. Should I be

>>>concerned about some of my older programs that were running a 5 year old

>>>ASUS MB? Office 97 and some non-MS apps.

>>

>>

>> Office 97 is not compatible with Vista. As for other applications, you

>> need

>> to go to each program's website and see. In some cases, older programs

>> will

>> run fine on Vista. In many cases, they won't. There is no "one size fits

>> all" rule so you need to do your homework *first*. Ditto for any hardware

>> peripherals - printers, scanners, webcams, etc.

>>

>> Also note that if you want to use all 6GB of RAM, you will need to run a

>> 64-bit operating system. XP has a 64-bit flavor as does Vista. Make sure

>> that 64-bit drivers are available from the OEM for whatever operating

>> system you want to use.

>>

>> Personally, I think purchasing a new computer is the way to go. You need

>> to

>> decide what operating system you want and that will help you decide what

>> to

>> buy. Below is my standard "how to replace Vista w/XP" information which I

>> hope helps you.

>>

>> A. On an OEM (HP, Sony, etc.) computer:

>>

>> 1. Go to the OEM's website and look for XP drivers for your specific

>> model

>> computer. If there are no XP drivers, then you can't install XP. End of

>> story. If there are drivers, download them and store on a CD-R or USB

>> thumbdrive; you'll need them after you install XP.

>>

>> 2. Check with the OEM - either from their tech support website or by

>> calling

>> them - to see if you will void your warranty if you do this. If you will

>> void the warranty, you make the decision.

>>

>> 3. If the OEM does support XP on the machine, call them and see if you

>> can

>> have downgrade rights and have them send you an XP restore disk. This

>> will

>> be far the easiest and best way of getting XP on the machine. Note: Dell

>> will sell you XP preinstalled on some models "designed for Vista" from

>> the

>> business side of the store. HP probably will, too.

>>

>> 4. If XP is supported on the machine but the OEM doesn't have an XP

>> restore

>> disk for you, understand that you'll need to purchase a retail copy of XP

>> from your favorite online or brick/mortar store.

>>

>> 5. Also understand that you will need to do a clean install of XP so if

>> you

>> have any data you want, back it up first.

>>

>> 6. If none of the above is applicable to you because you can't run XP on

>> that machine (see Item #1 above), return the computer and purchase one

>> running XP instead.

>>

>> B. On a generic/home-built computer (from non-OEM company) - You will

>> need

>> drivers for all your hardware. See the second link below for more

>> details:

>>

>> http://michaelstevenstech.com/cleanxpinstall.html - Clean Install How-To

>> http://www.elephantboycomputers.com/page2.html#Reinstalling_Windows -

>> What

>> you will need on-hand

>>

>> Malke

>

[Guest Malke]

Re: Vista or Bust? Moving to a New Machine

 

Bob I wrote:

> Small correction about Office 97. It's "not supported", as opposed to

> "not compatible". My wife is running Office 97 without any particular

> issues on her Vista Home Premium Dell.

 

Thank you.

 

Malke

--

MS-MVP

Elephant Boy Computers - Don't Panic!

FAQ - http://www.elephantboycomputers.com/#FAQ

[Guest wtw]

Re: Vista or Bust? Moving to a New Machine

 

I hope the HP people provide a 64-bit Vista, but it's worth looking into.

I'm told that if I start with Vista and don't like it, which probably won't

happen, wiping the drive clean and installing XP will lead to trouble. My

wife, who is big on Linux, did this on a HP Vista , but has experienced no

trouble for over a year.

 

"Ken Blake, MVP" <kblake@this.is.an.invalid.domain> wrote in message

news:c5m9e41j2atc2e4tqt9k4q3379l5oq8s65@4ax.com...

> On Thu, 2 Oct 2008 05:10:18 -0700, "wtw" <invalid@sbcglobal.net>

> wrote:

>

>> I'm reconstructing my present 5 year old machine after a c-drive failure.

>> I'm considering going to Vista rather than building a new machine with XP

>> on

>> it. I have a few concerns about this. I've been told that if I go Vista

>> with

>> a store bought machine, it is unlikely flushing the drive and installing

>> XP

>> will work.

>

>

> Why not? It has nothing to do with being store-bought, but only with

> whether the hardware is adequate and whether needed drivers exist for

> all your hardware. Many five year old machines do not have adequate

> hardware; for example, I wouldn't run Vista without at least 2GB of

> RAM.

>

> The driver problem is much more likely lf it's a laptop,

>

>

>> The machine I'm looking at as a replacement is an HP quad core

>> with 6G of memory. I'm pretty sure that's a 64-bit machine.

>

>

> With 6GB, I hope so. All 32-bit client versions of Windows (not just

> Vista/XP) have a 4GB address space. That's the theoretical upper limit

> beyond which you can not go.

>

> But you can't use the entire 4GB of address space. Even though you

> have a 4GB address space, you can only use *around* 3.1GB of RAM.

> That's because some of that space is used by hardware and is not

> available to the operating system and applications. The amount you can

> use varies, depending on what hardware you have installed, but can

> range from as little as 2GB to as much as 3.5GB. It's usually around

> 3.1GB.

>

> Note that the hardware is using the address *space*, not the actual

> RAM itself. The rest of the RAM goes unused because there is no

> address space to map it too.

>

> So note that you will need a 64-bit version of Vista to take advantage

> of the 6GB.

>

>

>

>> Should I be

>> concerned about some of my older programs that were running a 5 year old

>> ASUS MB? Office 97 and some non-MS apps.

>

>

> The fact that it's a 5 year old ASUS MB is largely irrelevant. Most

> programs, even non-MS, that ran under XP will also run under Vista.

> However Microsoft Office 97 will not. But you should check each

> program on its manufacturer's web site.

>

> --

> Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP - Windows Desktop Experience

> Please Reply to the Newsgroup

[Guest Ken Blake, MVP]

Re: Vista or Bust? Moving to a New Machine

 

On Thu, 02 Oct 2008 08:09:30 -0700, Malke <malke@invalid.invalid>

wrote:

> Bob I wrote:

>

> > Small correction about Office 97. It's "not supported", as opposed to

> > "not compatible". My wife is running Office 97 without any particular

> > issues on her Vista Home Premium Dell.

>

> Thank you.

 

 

 

Thank you from me too, Bob. I thought the same thing as Malke

apparently did.

 

 

--

Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP - Windows Desktop Experience

Please Reply to the Newsgroup

[Guest Bob I]

Re: Vista or Bust? Moving to a New Machine

 

 

 

Malke wrote:

> Bob I wrote:

>

>

>>Small correction about Office 97. It's "not supported", as opposed to

>>"not compatible". My wife is running Office 97 without any particular

>>issues on her Vista Home Premium Dell.

>

>

> Thank you.

>

> Malke

 

You're welcome.

[Guest Bob I]

Re: Vista or Bust? Moving to a New Machine

 

 

 

Ken Blake, MVP wrote:

> On Thu, 02 Oct 2008 08:09:30 -0700, Malke <malke@invalid.invalid>

> wrote:

>

>

>>Bob I wrote:

>>

>>

>>>Small correction about Office 97. It's "not supported", as opposed to

>>>"not compatible". My wife is running Office 97 without any particular

>>>issues on her Vista Home Premium Dell.

>>

>>Thank you.

>

>

>

>

> Thank you from me too, Bob. I thought the same thing as Malke

> apparently did.

>

>

 

You're welcome.

[Guest Patrick Keenan]

Re: Vista or Bust? Moving to a New Machine

 

 

"wtw" <invalid@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message

news:QS2Fk.2037$as4.634@nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...

> I'm reconstructing my present 5 year old machine after a c-drive failure.

> I'm considering going to Vista rather than building a new machine with XP

> on it. I have a few concerns about this. I've been told that if I go Vista

> with a store bought machine, it is unlikely flushing the drive and

> installing XP will work. The machine I'm looking at as a replacement is an

> HP quad core with 6G of memory. I'm pretty sure that's a 64-bit machine.

> Should I be concerned about some of my older programs that were running a

> 5 year old ASUS MB? Office 97 and some non-MS apps.

 

There is no point in installing more than 3.5 gig RAM on a non-64 bit

system; the system will not let you use more than just less than that. So

if that system has 6 gig RAM, yes, it's going to be running a 64-bit OS.

 

The bigger problem you are facing is that your hardware may be inadequate or

incompatible for Vista. You must check first.

 

HTH

-pk

[Guest Larry]

Re: Vista or Bust? Moving to a New Machine

 

On Thu, 2 Oct 2008 17:49:50 -0400, "Patrick Keenan" <test@dev.null>

wrote:

>

>"wtw" <invalid@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message

>news:QS2Fk.2037$as4.634@nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...

>> I'm reconstructing my present 5 year old machine after a c-drive failure.

>> I'm considering going to Vista rather than building a new machine with XP

>> on it. I have a few concerns about this. I've been told that if I go Vista

>> with a store bought machine, it is unlikely flushing the drive and

>> installing XP will work. The machine I'm looking at as a replacement is an

>> HP quad core with 6G of memory. I'm pretty sure that's a 64-bit machine.

>> Should I be concerned about some of my older programs that were running a

>> 5 year old ASUS MB? Office 97 and some non-MS apps.

>

>There is no point in installing more than 3.5 gig RAM on a non-64 bit

>system; the system will not let you use more than just less than that. So

>if that system has 6 gig RAM, yes, it's going to be running a 64-bit OS.

>

>The bigger problem you are facing is that your hardware may be inadequate or

>incompatible for Vista. You must check first.

>

>HTH

>-pk

 

There are some software issues as well. Since you only mention Office

97 I won't go into an exhaustive list of what they might be. Check

the vendor's website to inform your final decision. Most driver

issues have been resolved, but as Pat pointed out, you might want to

run Microsoft's compatibility wizzard.

 

Once you have done your homework ... you are really going to like

Vista! Yes, I have kept my old XP Pro machine, but I also have a

Vista Ultimate machine. It rocks!