Think I'm about to get ripped off?

[PEV]

Dont relly know where to start here! I run XP Home edition. Got home from holiday put plugs back into wall socket and my PC would'nt boot up when I tried to turn it on woth start button. Checked that the power lead was secure and noticed a litle green flashing light and a faint ticking noise just where power lead goes into back of the tower. This proved there was power and not something stupid like fuse blown at mains plug.

I rang my local PC repair shop who told me to disconnect power immediatly as the light and ticking was probably 'the mother board dying' I was then told to take the tower to the shop as it might be a ten minute job to check and fix. Took it to the shop and he put it on test, told me it was the start button faulty which is a common fault on HP Pavillion and a power pack would be the answer. This was fitted and my machine was placed on test and indeed using his gear my desk top was brought up on monitor and all my desk top icons such as 'my docs' gave me access to my files etc and everything else that worked without internet connection required.

So far so good £40 and my PC is back to life but the following things were said and I'd like all your opinions as to whether he was trying to push me into paying more and more money (although I already am pretty sure of the answer!

 

When machine was on test and making the sort of noises it has always made when booting up or downloading he says 'do you hear that? its the sound of a sick or dying mother board! you could have a few weeks or maybe months.

I asked the life of a motherboard? (having owned the machine from boxed to now for 5 years) he said '3-5 years usually

He said best to back up but as you have so much on there will be a big job I have some machine here that's ten times faster £250 I think it was)

 

When he was testing he said do you use Outlok or OE I said OE but on some big AV updates it sets to Outlook which is no problem as I just go to OE from start menue click on it and when asked manually set default to OE

He says 'hmm maybe there's a virus! what AV do you use and when I said AVG Free he said oh no oh my God! I said well I do know there may be better free AVs but its never let me down.

He said NO free AV is any good I worked for Norton and Mcfee and do you think any AV thats free is any good? His parting words were 'I saved you this time but come back soon to get things fixed properly'

 

My opinion of this guy is he knows what he is doing with fault finding but is trying to get me to pay for his pension.

Your expert (and non expert) opinions please.

Ray

[BeeCeeBee]

After reading that I really only can see 2 points that are subject to comment since he apparently solved your initial problem with a hardware fix.

 

1. Are you sure he said a possibly dying Motherboard or could he have said Hard Drive. Other than certain "Beeps" I really don't know of any sound that is made by a potentially dying motherboard. Hard drives often give you warnings by making ticking or grinding sounds. To be honest though, I am not a hardware expert so maybe there is a MOBO sound like he said?????

 

2. He is half right about AVG, in my opinion (which seems to be shared by many others ) its reputation has been suspect for many years. On the other hand I would never use either McAfee or Norton either as both are intrusive and resource hogs. I use Microsoft Security Essential for a while as well as Avast. Both are free and seemed to do the job.

[KenB]

Hi

 

Your machine is up and running again for £40 - which I suppose is reasonable........you don't get much for that these days.

 

If he did say "motherboard" then I am unsure to what he was referring as there is no moving part on a motherboard that can make a mechanical sound.

Capacitors can "whistle" - and this is a possibility.

 

What he says about free AVs is untrue.

I know Starbuck and etavares constantly recommend free AVs.

 

I have to agree with BeeCeeBee - AVG is not as good as it once was ....but it is still OK and if you are happy with it there is no reason to change.

 

I also use MS Essentials and I know Starbuck does too.

 

If you want to swap over there is an AVG removal tool

It is not advisable to have 2 AVs on your system at one time.

[ukbobboy]

Are You Being Ripped Off?

 

Hi Pev

 

There is nothing wrong with having a healthy suspicion about what is being pushed onto you, there are far too many wide-boys around to trust anyone's advice on face value.

 

OK, that said, motherboards do not click they beep when something has gone wrong, the number of beeps at start up represents the thing that has gone wrong.

 

When you hear clicking it is more than likely to be the hard disk going wrong, i.e. the read/write head beating against the spindle, check out the following URL:

 

 

Now, the best thing to do is back up your hard drive before it fails, at this point it would be cheaper to buy an external HD and do the backup yourself (some externals come with their own backup software) but it depends on how much your data is worth to you before you take this guy up on his offer.

 

About 10 - 15 years ago when my second PC failed, a repair guy offered to recover my lost HD data for £300.00, I turned him down because it just was not worth it.

 

Hope this helps.

 

 

UK Bob

[Synapse]

told me it was the start button faulty which is a common fault on HP Pavillion and a power pack would be the answer.

 

I don't quite get the link between a faulty start button and replacing the power supply, it could just simply have been a faulty power supply. If yours is the HP with a square power button, they do get stuck when pressed in, maybe he fixed that too.

 

To be fair, we can't tell what happens to your PC when it starts up, and working on them everyday your repair man may be tuned in to hearing and identifying odd noises, dry fan bearings and the like. Sometimes old systems play up when they are cold, and given 5 minutes running are just fine, he may have noticed something, but I don't think it is your board failing.

 

His backing up advice is always going to be good advice.

 

Best AV program? Well there is a question bound to end up with debate, but I'd go with Avira or the already mentioned MS Essentials.

[PEV]

Thanks for the replies and advice guys.

 

Thinking about it he said mother board may be about to fail when I spoke on phone to him and explained a green light flashing with an accompanying quiet ticking when it would'nt start from the square start button.

The green light and ticking was on back of the tower right where the power supply inputs. Now the machine is running there is no green light or ticking.

When I was with him in his repair facility I'm now pretty sure he said 'sounds like your hard drive sick is on way out'

 

Can you comment on suggestion that hard drives only last on average of 3-5 years.

Any suggestions on price/model of external hard drive and I presume this would hold important stuff from the inernal hard drive and external is just a copy which would only be used if existing hard drive fails?

Any further assistance with these subjects is much appreciated.

Thanks

Ray

[GRANDAD]

Talking about backing up your hard drive then if you have an external hard drive i found a free prog called AUSLOGICS BITREPLICA that allows you to choose which sections you wish to back up. You can then transfere these back and forward between units, you can also back up only items which have changed since your last back up. Its worth a look at and its FREE. As a small point if you dont have an external hard drive you could back up to DVD discs albeit only at 4.7gb per disc but you could split your sections up.

As has been said by others better back up now than loose your files. A pack of 25 dvd discs at approx £5 would save you 117.5GB ish.--time taking but cheap.

Good luck.

[KenB]

It makes sense if he said the hard drive was clicking.

This is quite common and does indicate that a drive is about to fail.

(see the link in post #4)

 

A couple of members have advised that you back-up important data - this is always good advice.

 

If you can hear a clicking sound - and it is coming from your HDD then a replacement will no doubt be needed.

If you haven't got recovery disks or a full installation disk for your Operating System then this is going to be an additional cost.

HDDs can die at any time - even within the first few months of use. There are no guarantees but 5 years is about right before they pack up.

Anything longer than that is a bonus. ( it depends on how much use they get )

 

The tech was probably being as honest as he could be.

 

Your choices:

 

1. backup what is on the drive and wait for it to fail. ( if indeed it is the HDD that is "ticking" )

Then buy a new HDD > install OS > continue where you left off.

A new HDD plus Operating System will cost about £160 ( off the top of my head :) )

 

2. Ask tech for the specs on the machine for £250 and how long the guarantee period is.

Post details here for comments.

 

3. For a bit more than the £250 you can have a new one. The specs will probably not be as good as the used machine - but it will be new.

[Plastic Nev]

Hi, taking all the above advice and putting it into a nutshell, I in my own personal opinion would be to recommend you obtain an external hard drive, the size of which should ideally be the same or higher in capacity than the internal drive, or at the very least twice the size of the data stored on the internal drive, including the operating system.

Once acquired I recommend creating a full system image, the program Grandad mentioned is an example of the sort of thing to download and use, though myself I use Macrium Reflect, which also has a free version available, and the same can be said about Easeus Todo.

 

A full system image is actually the best backup, as this contains the operating system, all partitions if any, all installed programs, as well as all data such as music, video, photo's ETC.

 

Once the existing hard drive packs up, buy and install a new drive, then using the image and a rescue disk (Created as part of making the image) you install the image onto the new drive, and the whole computer is then back up and running just as it was at the time the image was made.

 

If needing help with using an imaging program, KenB or myself can as far as Macrium Reflect is concerned, as we use it on all our machines.

 

Nev.

[PEV]

Hi Nev, Ken B Granddad and any other input is welcome!

Checking the ‘My Computer’ facility on my HP Pavilion it says the total size of the hard disc drive is 69.2 GB and I have 47.3 GB free space. Does this make sense?

If I go out and buy an external hard drive would somewhere like Maplins be the place to buy it?

Or should I shop around for an on line purchase – money is quite tight for me what would I expect to pay and can you give details of the spec required for the external hard drive please. Do you have any suggestions?

I feel that I need to back up having been told that 5 years is a good life for a hard drive and once I check over any further info/advice from you guys I think I’m going for the external hard drive option and then looking at getting a full system image.

My next move would be to either try to do the whole thing myself using help offered by you (Nev and KenB) …..A very daunting thought even with your expert help!

OR I could ask the technician to do it but he never even mentioned a full system image but just said backing up was a big expensive job as I have so much on the drive (yet it has 47 GB out of 69 GB free space. Does this make sense?) …He seemed more interested in selling me a new system!

Look forward to your comments

Thanks

Ray

[GRANDAD]

As money is tight to us all then on line MAY be an option-expect to pay about £25-£40 for an external drive of up to 250gb. Im sure Ken B and Nev would assist you with info on backing up your data. A friend of mine had their system backed up at PC World and it cost £99, total data was only 4.4gb, nice rip off.

Good luck.

[Plastic Nev]

Hi Ray, Maplin are a tad expensive, but if you have a local store, go have a look to give yourself an idea on prices, oh and also don't be surprised that you won't find a drive of less that 250GB or at least not easily, unless it is some old stock they have.

 

Once you have checked that though, look round on the net, Amazon, New Egg, E Buyer, or similar you should find a similar drive for at least 20% cheaper or more.

 

Considering the size of the internal drive, then a 250GB drive is more than adequate. Technically specification wise, 5000RPM or higher for spindle speed is OK, though a slower speed will still work, just take a little longer to create the image backup.

 

Make of drive is perhaps more important though so go for a well known make such as Seagate, Western Digital, I have a Buffalo and found nothing wrong with that. I will warn that prices are still a little higher than they were last year due to most major manufacturers in I think it was Indonesia lost out to major flooding and they are still recovering from that.

So expect a smaller drive to be around the £45-00 to £50-00 mark, however have a look round first and then come back to us for a recommendation after that.

 

Once you have an external drive, then we can discus how to achieve the image backup on it, and don't worry, it is quite easy to do, just a little time consuming is all. (which explains why PC World or other dealers charge so much, it is the time you pay for.)

 

Nev.

[GRANDAD]

Apologies to PLASTIC NEV – I should choose my words more carefully and have said –The cost looked a tad expensive at £99 for the amount of work saved. Yes a business is in business to make money and time is money. That’s why this is a very good forum as it not only gives information but can save you a substantial amount of cash.

Have a good day regards.

[PEV]

Thanks for your rapid replies again Grandad and Nev.

I went to PC World and asked for price of an external HD and was shown their smallest which was 500GB and £56I believe.

However a an advisor who seemed very knowledgeable mentioned 'Cloud backup' where the data off your hard drive is stored on a remote server so if your hard drive dies you still have the data available remotely to put back on your new hard drive or machine.

As none of you guys has mentioned this I am a bit worried about pitfalls as it would seem to be such an easy option for me and all for about £30 a year or £39 including Norton 360 (this is on offer and would normally be double that price).

I then went to Maplins and was told Cloud Storage did work but Maplins dont offer that service but when theadviser heard that I only had around 27GB of stuff on my PC Hard drive he suggested I could comfotably back up using a 32GB USB device which they sell for about £20?

What do you think?

Ray

[PEV]

Sorry the price of the external hard disc from PC World was £56 NOT £561!

Ray

[GRANDAD]

I dont know a lot about the CLOUD system but what ive been told is you can upload for one year only then pay again for future years.You can download fron it for as long as you like but are unable to update after the year without paying again. Think i would stick with an external hard drive at least its a one off payment and its yours for life. I would also stay if possible with a 250gb external hard drive as you have a lot more scope however you could look at a well known bid site and get a 60-80gb plus external hard drive for your £20 or just plus of that.[]There is an 80gb external hard drive for £24.99 with free pp.]

If things are very tight you could lump your docs pics vids ect into 4.5gb lots and save on 7 discs at approx £5, not the best but cheap.

[PEV]

Grandad - feels a bit facetious calling you that as I'm going on 63 myself!

I don't understand your last paragraph, what is a 4.5gb lots do you mean 4 times 5gb disc lots?

Also you don't mention the 32gb USB option to back up the 23gb in use on my hard drive. Do you have an opinion on that?

Other watchers your input is much appreciated please.

Thanks

Ray

[KenB]

Hi Ray - this thread has moved on since my last post :)

 

Re Cloud:

Personally I would object to paying £30 / year - especially if money is tight.

Also - if you think about it ...........if your drive image is stored on Cloud and you system goes down ......

how do you get at the image from Cloud if you cannot boot up your computer?

 

32 GB USB Memory Stick

This wouldn't be my choice - for one reason ...........they are so small it could easily get mislaid - especially as it will not be in use very often.

 

Also - with a 500GB external you can partition it and keep your Drive Image backups on one / Photos on another / etc etc

Compared to Cloud - this will pay for itself in 2 years

 

Just a quick Google brought up this:

click here

 

click here

[GRANDAD]

Hi PEV, yip im past my sell by date and can beet your 63 but lets not dwell on that so Grandads not a problem. This computer keeps my mind active but thats not to say i get it write every time.

I agree with KenB's comments i would still go for an external hard drive its a far better option in the long term. The link looks accepable with a 160gb drive for £36,ish and it should last for yrs. A little more cost would double the drive size.

With regards to the discs then yes a DVD disc is 4.7gb so to cover your HDD space used it would only take approx five discs at minimal cost and would initially ensure that you have a back up of your files as of now, just in case. I have three external hard drives going up to 1TB but still from time to time back up on a disc so i have an extra back up at a very low cost.

On some PC's and or laptops you have the option to back up your operating system on disc so check this out also.

Have a nice day and lets hope you can get your problem sorted soon. Regards.

[PEV]

Hello again Ken and anyone else who cares to advise

Its been suggested cloud could only back up my files/photos etc but not my programmes such as Microsoft Office,OE IE7 etc is this correct? The total of my Hard disc in use is only around 23gb with 47gb free space.

 

The same question applies to a 32gb memory stick can it store everything off my hard disc or it restricted to files and the like?.

I don't have any problem with possible loss of memory stick as I am only user of my PC and memory stick would live in one place which is in draw next to the PC. Money is not so tight that I cant afford £30 a year and memeory stick would appeal if I could get everything on it and not just files.

 

Bottom line is that when hard drive fails or anything else terminal happens I will be able to access all important data to start again with it on a new hard drive, PC or whatever. I m not too bothered about how slick backing up is but just that I don't lose everything and the process of backing up is as simple as possiblefor me.

Of course I know when eventually the drive dies etc its gonna cost serious money but there's no way round that is there?- it's like when your domestic heating boiler goes, you just have to pay out of savings!

So everyone just to re cap

My questions are

 

1. Can or cannot Cloud back up everything or at least everything important. For example PC World Cloud offer up to 500gb storage and my total HP Pavilion hard drive capacity is only 69.3gb

 

2. Can everything be backed up on memory stick(s)?

Thanks

Ray

[KenB]

Hi Ray

 

Can or cannot Cloud back up everything or at least everything important.

Cloud can store all of your files, data, photos etc.

It cannot back-up installed software.

Nev suggested making an image of your drive.

This would backup everything that is on the drive - it literally takes a snap-shot of the drive at the time and date that you create the image.

 

I have already pointed out that Cloud would be no use to store the image of your machine.

 

Can everything be backed up on memory stick(s)?

You could back up everything to a memory stick - BUT .........if you create an image of your drive it is going to virtually fill a 32GB memory stick.

I like to have 2 or 3 images stored - just in case.

You wouldn't be able to do this - you would have to delete the saved image before adding the up-dated one.

 

I have already pointed out that an external hard drive would be my choice.

For a few extra ££s you get so much more space.

I have already explained about partitions etc.

 

My advice - go for the external hard drive.

[GRANDAD]

Hi PEV,

1, I think that cloudwould be able to back up your files but as has been commented on just how would you extract your files should your system go down? Cloud may be ok should you have a clean operating system.

2, If your internal hard drive does go down then you should be able to purchase a new slightly larger one for about £25-£40, not an arm and a leg, albeit you would have to fit it and reinstall your programs.

3, I personally would not spend £20 on a 32 GB memory stick as all of this may be used up with your files and OS/PROGRAMMS. If you have a good look on eBay you will find a 2.5” USB external hard drive for between £25-£35,[these are pocket size] which would be at least four times the capacity of a 32gb stick, to me much better that a memory stick or cloud.

No doubt other members will have different ideas but the above works well for me.

Have you looked to see if you PC has the capability of backing up your OS or do you have a setup disc to re use?

As a small point then should you lose Microsoft office you could download OPEN OFFICE which is free and compatable with Microsoft—you can also just re download IE ect most ofwhich are free.

Regards.

Edited July 9, 2012 by GRANDAD

[PEV]

Hi Again Ken and anyone wanting to join in please do.

I have taken the advice and purchased an external hard drive its a CORE 120GB Hard drive which I'm told would be more than adequate as my HP Pavillion PC drive has only a 69 GB capacity and only 27 GB are in use.

I know it's been reccomended to make a complete mirror image of my PC operating system files programmes etc but have been told by a guy who has helped me adequatly before I found FrePC help that the main thing is to copy my files as the rest could be easily replaced should my PC h/drive crash and burn or PC get stolen etc.What do you say?

I don't have a problem 'mirroring' in pricipal its just I'm told it would take so long and I am very worried at cocking things up unless I stick to the most simple option. - again your thoughts please Ken.

Ray

[KenB]

Hi Ray

 

There is no reason why you cannot do both.

 

You can partition the drive ( easily ) into 2 partitions. ( more if you wish )

You could use a 60GB partition to store images of your drive and the other partition for backups of photos / files etc.

 

The benefit of having an image of your drive is that it will enable you to restore the Operating System and the drive itself to exactly where it was on the day that you created the image.

 

It is ideal if you don't have an installation disk.

 

Creating an image does take time ( possibly a couple of hours in total ) - but if you don't have an installation disk it is worth it.

[Plastic Nev]

Hi, and just to add, providing the image creation is set up correctly, the time taken from that point is all automatic until it has finished.

 

So the ideal time is when you plan doing something else for a couple of hours. Initial setting up, once you have learned (which is easy) how to do it, only takes a few minutes to set up, then basically click "GO" and walk away to fix the shelf in the kitchen your wife always wanted, or similar.

 

Nev.