blackscreen on startup windows 7

[kaos]

hi guys!

 

im at my witts end!

 

computer specs:

gigabyte GA-p31-es3g motherboard

pentium dual core cpu E5200 @ 2.5ghz

500gb hitachi internal hdd

2tb seagate external hdd

4gb (2x2gb) ddr2 1066 ram

nvidia 440gt gpu

windows 7 proffesional os

 

for just over 1 week i have been getting blackscreen just before the desktop appears. i see the post screen and windows is starting then just at the point where my desktop would appear....nothing but black with a white cursor which i can move around. keyboard and mouse are working but i cannot use the keyboard at all. (no ctrl alt del) no keys do anything.

 

this means i have to press the reset button on the front of my machine which brings me to the system restore screen.

i tried all system restore and image restore points. i ran chkdsk, and memory diagnostics test with no problems detected.

 

i have been reading through pc help forums all week at any chance i have had to resolve the problem, and also tried everything i have come across but cannot pinpoint it.

 

so two nights ago i went ahead and installed win 7 pro (sorry i initially had win 7 ultimate when the problem started).

i thought everything was sorted as i did a clean install. (all personal files are backed up to an external hdd)

windows had 107 updates to install so i let it install them and reboot.

on its reboot i get a message along the lines of 'windows cannot configure updates reverting changes'

it reverts its changes and blackscreens again. mouse cursor but no use of keyboard again, although the numlock light is on.

i go through system restore at least 3 more times before she fires up.

sometimes when i reach the blackscreen and wait up to a minute my desktop will apear as normal. most of the time it wont.

 

earlier today i went into win update and unchecked all 107 updates so they wont auto install. then rebooted my computer.

this is what happened;

blackscreen,

pressed reset button,

start windows normally,

blackscreen,

reset button again,

ran system restore,

error message saying: system restore cannot repair this computer automatically. sending information to microsoft can help create solutions.

problem event name: startuprepairoffline

problem signature 01 6.1.7600.16385

problem signature 02 6.1.7600.16385

problem signature 03 unknown

problem signature 04 1

problem signature 05 autofailover

problem signature 06 1

problem signature 07 bad driver

 

so i go back to system restore screen and hit 'scan for affected programs and drivers' which brings back none detected.

 

i try to system restore,

wait 40 minutes,

system restore did not complete successfully. your computers system files and settings were not changed.

 

details:

an unspecified error occured during system restore. (0x800700b7)

 

i chose not to system restore again and hit restart.

 

computer decides to start up normally then says system restore completed successfully!?

 

i am very confused. i have never come across a problem i couldnt find the answer to hence this is my first post on a pc help forum.

i am inclined to think its a hardware problem given everything i have tried above. the pc is about 4 years old and ive had it since new. is it failing? is it too old at 4 years?

 

i dont dare shut it down now simply because i know i will be waiting an hour for it to system restore next time i want to use it.

 

appologies for the long post and ranting but please help!

 

thankyou in advance

 

kaos

[Plastic Nev]

Hi and welcome to Extreme Tech Support - Free PC Help.

I tend to agree it may be a hardware problem causing this, and two or three possibilities, RAM memory or the hard drive itself or I have heard of an external drive being faulty and preventing boot up as well.

So first thing to check is shut down and remove the external hard drive and try again, if OK it must be the external hard drive.

If no change, leave the external disconnected for now, and again power off and remove one of those two sticks of RAM, if no change, replace and remove the other stick of RAM.

 

Let us know what you find after that please.

 

Nev.

[kaos]

hi nev and thankyou for your prompt reply.

 

i tried each step you said and heres my findings:

 

1. shutdown and unplug ext hdd - blackscreen with no mouse or keyboard.

 

2. shutdown and reconnect ext hdd. remove RAM from slot 1 - blackscreen with mouse cursor and keyboard (num lock light)

 

3. shutdown and replace RAM in slot 1, remove RAM from slot 2 - BOOTED UP!

 

4. restart again to confirm dodgy RAM - blackscreen with no mouse or keyboard :(

 

5. shutdown and swap RAM around from original slots - blackscreen with no mouse or keyboard

 

6. restart - booted up? ngen.exe application error on startup (0xc0000142) if that means anything to you?

 

im thinking this boot up/ not booting up sequence is is a bit sporadic. i see no pattern to it. if it wants to boot up it will it seems. very strange any other ideas?

 

also on its last boot up i noticed a white line flicker onto my windows is starting screen. havent noticed that before but i believe its to do with gpu? the graphics card (nvidia 440 gt) is less than a year old. i upgraded it from the nvidia 9500gt. computer was working fine with 440 in for about 6 months before now so not sure if its in any way relevent to this blackscreen problem but i did notice the white flickering line.

 

thanks for your help so far. anything else i could try or have my results helped you at all?

 

thanks nev

[kaos]

seems i misread your instructions slightly so i had another go:

 

shutdown -> unplug ext hdd -> remove ram from slot 1 = blackscreen but with a loading cursor which then changed to a normal cursor for about 20 seconds before loading again and booting up.

 

shutdown -> blackscreen -> no loading at all -> left it for 2 minutes then restarted.

 

shutdown -> no changes -> blackscreen

 

shutdown -> replace slot 1 ram and remove slot 2 ram (ext hdd still unplugged) -> blackscreen

 

shutdown -> replace ram -> blackscreen

 

shutdown -> remove and reconnect internal hdd sata cable, check gpu corrctly seated -> restart -> blackscreen

 

restart -> blackscreen

 

tried removing both dvd writers individually (ide) but no different.

 

ran startup repair -> could not repair automatically

 

system restore to first restore point (just after win 7 pro installed) -> said did not complete system restore (0x8000ffff)

 

ran memory diagnostics tool -> no problems detected

 

restarted then booted up (slowly. loading followed by nothing on blackscreen then booted up)

 

when booted up it said it HAD restored my system. now im back to square one. :(

[Plastic Nev]

Hi, that is still all random isn't it, suggesting a possibly sticking at start up hard drive.

However, I have looked up that ngen.exe error and found it is part of the Microsoft .NET Framework if genuine. Have a look here about it=

 

http://www.file.net/process/ngen.exe.html

 

I feel that may be a red herring though and if I am right about the main hard drive sticking, once it does start to spin, if slow there may well be read errors.

 

I see from your first post you tried a chkdsk and it found no problems, but have you tried running the system file checker, SFC Scannow?

 

Nev.

[kaos]

hi nev,

 

yes i have ran sfc scannow but i can try again. i have just turned on the comupter today and had an even worse problem which i havent seen yet.

i dont think it was passing the post screen as i didnt hear a beep. it turned itself off and back on 3 times. i had no monitor as it couldnt detect a signal.

all of a sudden on the fourth attempt it booted up.

 

do you suggest changing the hard drive? im sure i can get my hands on another to try. although would i be able to just remove the present one as it has the whole system on it. obviously id have to install windows onto the new one. would it work like that?

 

this is going slightly off topic but i have looked into upgrading the RAM. however, i think my mobo is maxed out already with the current ram. im really not sure as i have never upgraded ram before and cant really make sense of the information i have found about it :/.

 

thankyou for your help so far. each thing you have suggested i havent thought of. keep up the good work im sure we can crack it!

 

 

ok ran sfc /scannow again (start -> run -> cdm -> run as admin)

 

result was : windows resource protection did not find any integrity violations.

Edited January 13, 2013 by kaos

[kaos]

i have got hold of a hitachi 1tb internal hardrive. i have put it in next to the system hdd and plugged sata cable into port 1 (main on sata 0)

if you would like me to try to eliminate the hdd problem by installing windows onto it go ahead and give me some instructions. i have never had to do this so dont know the procedure.

i dont mind re-installing windows and or formatting c drive as all my personal files are safe.

 

awaiting instructions and thanks.........

[Plastic Nev]

Hi, OK we can try and see if we can transfer the entire set up onto the new drive. You say it is a 1TB, which is fine as it is twice the size of the original, once we get the complete system transferred onto it the existing partitions can either be expanded, or the unused other 500GB can be made into a different partition, however we will discuss that later.

 

First the RAM question, is it a 32 bit system you installed or 64 bit?

If 32 bit then 4GB is the maximum anyway, if 64 bit it then depends on the motherboard. A good way to find out is to go to the crucial website and get it to run a scan to tell you the maximum you can install, with recommendations as to the type of RAM as well. It is best to use internet explorer as the scanner will work directly, any other browser, you will have to download and install the scanner.

http://www.crucial.com/systemscanner/

 

Now for the transfer of your system to the new drive. Once you have got it to boot and as long as it stays running after that, you need to download one of the free imaging programs, there are several such as "EasUS To Do", which I don't know that well, or there is "Macrium Reflect", this I use as a periodic back up myself.

You will need your external drive connected with at least the same size available in free space as the amount of data you already have on the computer, and preferably the full 500GB size of the computers internal drive.

 

Next is to download the Macrium Reflect software and here I will point you to KenB's own forum as he wrote a full description and gave the link for the free version of Macrium reflect.

 

http://s13.zetaboards.com/kenspchelp/topic/6963042/1/#new

 

And also the second half of how to use it to rescue or in your case install to a fresh new drive.

 

http://s13.zetaboards.com/kenspchelp/topic/6963042/1/#new

 

You will see in the second half he mentions the rescue disk, ideally that should be created straight after creating the image onto your external hard drive. I will also add that I found the Linux disk to not work with my system and external hard drive, for some reason it couldn't find or recognise my external drive. So I will recommend you download and create the Windows PE disk, even though it can take up to two hours to download and burn the disk, it is well worth doing as that disk will work with all and any hard drive.

 

once you have created the image, and made the disk, connect your new drive into place and remove the old drive or at least disconnect all cables to it.

Next is to go to the BIOS of your system and make sure it is set to boot from the CD/DVD drive, put the rescue disk in the drive, make sure the external hard drive is connected, then tell the computer to boot up normally, follow the instructions as per the link from there.

 

Read everything through in those links and anything you are not sure about please ask before you start, it may be too late to ask once you have started the process.

 

Myself or KenB will be able to answer you so no problems there and I will ask Ken to keep an eye on this thread as tomorrow I am at work all day.

 

Nev.

[kaos]

the os is 64 bit.

 

did the crucial scan and it could only reccomend the ram setup i have now which is 2x2gb. although there are a couple slightly different ones. e.g. DDR2 PC2-5300, DDR2 PC2-6400, DDR2 PC2-8500. it is recommending the 5300. not sure what those numbers mean or what i have installed at the moment. its not terribly important anyway.

 

i have put the new hdd in and it said that it is failing or has a fault. so i used seagate disc wizard to format it (not quick format) to NTFS but havent partitioned it. do you think this hdd will be ok? im a little worried about the failure error. i bought the hdd about 1 year ago and used it for storage before i got myself a bigger external one. i seem to remember something about a fault with it thats maybe why i took it out and put it away.

it seems to be working fine at the moment though after the format. i have transfered 110gb of files onto it without problems and as yet no errors.

 

i have a few hours tommorrow before heading to work in the afternoon so if i recieve further instructions by then ill get it done. also want to monitor it for errors before moving the whole system onto it.

actually you know what. there really isnt much of a system to transfer. after that last restore i did yesterday i havent installed any programs etc for fear of having to do it again. its basically a clean install.

 

would it be possible to remove the 500gig, with system files on, and swap it with the 1 TB then do a fresh install or would that get messy? will it matter which sata port it is plugged into i.e sata 0 sata1 etc?

 

are you pretty much convinced this blackscreen problem is a faulty harddrive now then?

[kaos]

windows is detecting hard disk failure with the 1TB :(

[kaos]

i have ordered a brand new Seagate Barracuda 1TB 7200 SATA 6Gbps 64MB Cache HDD.

i think i will change the hdd now regardless for security in the future.so how will i do this? can i simply swap it for the current one then reinstall windows or is it more complicated than that?

also is it better to partition it? if so what sized and how many partitions would you recommend?

 

can the failed 1tb hard disk be saved or is it destined for the bin?

 

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[KenB]

Hi kaos,

 

Nev asked me to take a look here so that you are not kept waiting too long :)

 

windows is detecting hard disk failure with the 1TB

What is the error message you are getting?

 

can the failed 1tb hard disk be saved or is it destined for the bin?

I would be inclined to run Check-Disk on this drive.

This will check the condition of the disk and attempt to fix any errors.

 

The drive manufacturer may also have scanning software that will tell you if the drive is dead / dying.

 

To run check-disk you need the drive attached to a machine either as an external drive or as an addition to the Primary Drive inside the case.

The drive must be recognised and given a drive letter ( you will need this )

 

Start > type in .....cmd......right click on cmd.exe that appears top left. > Run as Administrator

At the prompt type in .....chkdsk E: /f .......[i have used E: - you would use the drive letter allocated to the 1TB drive ]

There is a space before and after E:

 

Check the drive first - with chkdsk

 

Let us know what the make and model number of the drive is so that we can see if the manufacturer has diagnostic software available.

 

==================

 

i have ordered a brand new Seagate Barracuda 1TB 7200 SATA

 

would it be possible to remove the 500gig, with system files on, and swap it with the 1 TB then do a fresh install

It would ( using Macrium Reflect that Nev suggested or Recovery Disks or the full installation disk if you have one )

 

i think i will change the hdd now regardless for security in the future

Good thinking.

 

how will i do this?

The method varies depending how you intend to put an OS onto the drive. If using Recovery Disks .....

 

Take the old 500GB drive out completely.

Put in the new 1TB - Use SATA 0 .........but it wouldn't matter as you have taken the other drive out.

We can give more information when you let us know which method you are using.

 

The method is a bit different if you are using an image.

Are you going to use Recovery Disks or Image the drive ?

 

Just a note ....

Doing this you will have 2 bootable drives.

So in the future - if the 1TB develops problems - you can pop the 500GB back in and boot up again.

 

Regarding Partitions:

This is a personal thing.

I would certainly have 2 or 3.

One could be exclusively for photos / videos and the other for music say..... using the primary partition for the system files.

[kaos]

hi kenb and thankyou for your input. it is much appreciated.

 

ok i ran the dskchk and these are the results:

 

C:\Windows\system32>chkdsk H: /f

The type of the file system is NTFS.

CHKDSK is verifying files (stage 1 of 3)...

256 file records processed.

File verification completed.

0 large file records processed.

0 bad file records processed.

0 EA records processed.

0 reparse records processed.

CHKDSK is verifying indexes (stage 2 of 3)...

274 index entries processed.

Index verification completed.

0 unindexed files scanned.

0 unindexed files recovered.

CHKDSK is verifying security descriptors (stage 3 of 3)...

256 file SDs/SIDs processed.

Security descriptor verification completed.

9 data files processed.

Windows has checked the file system and found no problems.

976759807 KB total disk space.

21568 KB in 5 files.

8 KB in 11 indexes.

0 KB in bad sectors.

96015 KB in use by the system.

65536 KB occupied by the log file.

976642216 KB available on disk.

4096 bytes in each allocation unit.

244189951 total allocation units on disk.

244160554 allocation units available on disk.

C:\Windows\system32>

 

the make and model of the drive is:

Hitachi HDS721010CLA332 ATA 1TB

 

im not sure of the exact error message but i will post here if i get it again. (dont think there was an error code)

 

with regards to installing the os. i have an original windows 7 proffesional disc with product key.

 

i didnt think it could just be swapped that easily that is great! i thought it all somehow got configured into the motherboard etc and would only work in that setup so thats good.

 

thanks alot for your help kenb. i will check back in at 3am :)

[KenB]

Hi chkdsk looks OK

 

To install Win 7 make sure that the CDROM is first in the boot order in the BIOS ( easy to do )

 

Switch in and it will be either DEL or F2 key ( normally ).

You will see something like ....Press DEL to enter Setup in the bottom left of screen.

You have a very short time to hit the right key.

 

Alternatively tap DEL after switching on ( about once per second )

If this fails .....F2

Keep an eye open for the prompt about entering Setup to confirm you have the correct key.

 

Once in the BIOS move around with the arrow keys.

 

Look for Boot Sequence / Boot Options or similar ( lots of different BIOS options )

 

If you need to move the CDROM up the order click on it and it is usually the up-arrow or + key

( It will say on screen )

 

Once you have it as the first boot device Save and Exit ( usually F10 ......again it will say on screen )

 

 

==========

 

Regarding Partitions:

If you find it confusing during installation just use one big partition.

 

It is easy to alter afterwards to 2 or 3 partitions from within Windows.

[Plastic Nev]

Thanks Ken for popping in with that advice. All good idea's.

 

Nev.

[kaos]

Hi ken/nev and thanks again,

 

What action should be taken to restore the 'failing' hdd now as the chkdsk we did looked ok? Would it be a good idea to look for the manufacturers own software to run a check on it too?

 

Also when i remove the 500gig should i perform the same routine with that one?after all its not definatley the cause of this blackscreening is it?

 

Could the windows ultimate boot cd help with the problem as i have it on a usb.

 

Im amazed at the dedication you guys have had in sharing this headache with me! Thankyou again

[KenB]

Would it be a good idea to look for the manufacturers own software to run a check on it too?

Yes - it would at least confirm that the drive is OK.

Hitachi have their own software ...WinDFT ( Drive Fitness Test )

click here

 

Also when i remove the 500gig should i perform the same routine with that one?

It will not do any harm - you can use WinDFT on it too even if the drive is not Hitachi.

 

Im amazed at the dedication you guys have had in sharing this headache with me!

We actually enjoy it :)

 

Let us know the results of running DFT.

[kaos]

downloadd winDFT and ran a surface long test.

 

readerrorcheck = Pass

 

surface test = Fail

 

im guessing its knackard :/

 

new hdd came today but i gotta go to work soon so will do a fresh install in the morning then report back.

 

kaos

[KenB]

WinDFT would have been a more intensive test than chkdsk.

 

I wouldn't trust the drive :(

[Plastic Nev]

I am still convinced the original drive is sticking at first power up and not spinning up to speed or is doing so too slowly, hence the normal start of the BIOS, but then the black screen. The Bios has found a drive or you would get the message "No Bootable volume" It just can't read it if the disk is running too slowly, or hasn't got up to normal speed.

 

A way to find out perhaps would be to dismount it from the case, leave it connected or reconnect the electrical cables, and hold it in your hand as you boot the computer, if it spins up you will feel very slight vibration as the disk spins up, no vibration and it obviously hasn't done, a slight tap on its case with a small screwdriver handle at that point and see if it spins up then.

 

Nev.

[kaos]

ok ill definatley give it a go nev and hopefully this is the end of the problem as this thread is getting real long haha.

 

ill take kenb's advice and not trust the other harddrive either. nice shiny new one to go in now and hopefully sort it. :D

[kaos]

So.... Held the hdd in my hand as it booted up. It didnt stop spinning but it did speed up/slowdown which is probably normal but also it felt 'knotty'.

If youve ever spun a worn bearing around u will know what i mean. Only way i can describe it :/.

When i put the new hdd in it wasnt 'knotty' at all. Silky smooth infact!

 

Anyway the new one is in now with a fresh windows install. Ive rebooted about 3 times while installing programs and can see a significant improvement. No hesition before desktop appears at all. Even when it did boot up with the old hdd there was a slight blackscreen pause.

As i say i havent had chance to test it more yet but i have a feeling its sorted.

 

I think this thread can be closed now if you see fit. Id like to thankyou both very much for your time and expert advice. I will add a donation to the forum in due course!

 

Now for my next thread ;)

[kaos]

ugh!

 

windoes wanted to install 110 updates!

so i let it.....

it installed them and rebooted to which it said failure to configure reverting changes then BLACKSCREEN! :(

had to press reset button then it ran chkdsk on c: itself eporting no errors.

it restarted and said failure to config reverting changes again.

i booted it up in safe mode and system restored to just before the updates installed and it booted up as normal.

 

so now i have the problem of figuring out which update is ruining my day..

 

any advice on how to go about this?

 

can i install one by one to find out?

 

im going to have to disable auto updates for now. please help!

[RandyL]

can i install one by one to find out?

Yes you can.

 

Go to Control Panel.

Change view by: to icons

Click Windows Update

Click Check for updates.

Click on Important updates or Optional updates.

Select from the list.

[RandyL]

You could also try the Windows Update Trouble shooter found here.

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/949358#method1