[Solved] Dual Operating Systems

[grandadfatboy]

Hi everyone,

before I ask my question I would just like to say what a great site this is. My previous questions have been answered in detail and very quickly, so thank you for that. It amazes me at times as to how very little I know about the workings of my pc. May I now ask for your assistance once again please.

 

I have just purchased a new pc and I'm yet to install Windows 7 onto it. I believe I'm correct in saying (I'm sure the more knowledgeable will correct me if I'm wrong) that when using a dual operating systems, the oldest version of the your operating system needs to be installed first. I have already purchased Windows 7 Pro 64 bit for this machine. However, I did not appreciate just how much XP software that I have and still need to use. Which has led me to consider dual operating systems.

 

My questions are:

1. If I wish to install Windows XP and Windows 7 do I need to create a partition to install Window XP first and then create another partition onto which to install Windows 7?

 

2. Is it possible to install XP after installing Windows 7?

 

3. I ran XP 32 bit on my old pc and given the fact I have already have Windows 7 Pro 64 bit for the new pc, do I need to buy XP 64 bit or can I use XP 32 bit if I did decide dual system was the correct option for me?

 

4. Will the drivers and software included for the hardware included with my new pc (spec below) install/work in the Windows XP environment?

 

My system:

Case:Vantage Blue Gaming Case

Motherboard:Gigabyte 78LMT

CPU: AMDPiledriver FX 6300 4.1 Six Core 14mb Cache

Hard Drive:2tb Sata Hard Drive

Memory: 8gbDDR3 1600 Memory

OpticalDrive: 24x Dual Layer Sata DVD Writer

GraphicsCard: ATI Radeon 6670 2gb DDR3 with HDMI Hyper Memory Upto 3.8gb

 

I hope I have given you the information you need to help me.

 

Many thanks.

Ian

[KenB]

I would just like to say what a great site this is.

Thanks - much appreciated :)

It is down to the great team we have here ......not to mention the great members too.

 

do I need to create a partition to install Window XP first and then create another partition onto which to install Windows 7?

If you are installing 2 Operating Systems on one hard drive they will need their own partitions.

 

Is it possible to install XP after installing Windows 7?

It is - yes

I have linked to a tutorial that talks you through both options

click here

 

do I need to buy XP 64 bit or can I use XP 32 bit if I did decide dual system....

You can dual boot a 32 bit OS and a 64 bit OS

 

Will the drivers and software included for the hardware included with my new pc (spec below) install/work in the Windows XP environment?

You will need to install SP3 with your XP OS if it is not already there.

Your video card suggests it is compatible with XP.

It will not, however, be able to make use of DirectX 11 - XP utilises DirectX 9 at best.

 

 

You may find this free software useful

 

http://neosmart.net/EasyBCD/

 

Give it a go.

If it doesn't work out and you want to remove the XP partition this is easily done via Win7.

[grandadfatboy]

Hi Ken,

Thanks for the quick reply. Where you logged in ready and waiting knowing that I was going to ask this question? I'm sorry to say having read all the tutorials you provided links to, I know I'm going to have to read them again to make sure I've absorbed the information properly. I sincerely wish I had taken a serious interest in how a pc works some years ago and then maybe I wouldn't be struggling so much with it now.

 

Going to throw a googly into the mix know. My old pc, as previously stated, runs XP and it has been having the odd booting and crashing problems for a while know. Is there a reason why I can't remove the drive from this pc and install the drive into a spare bay in the new pc and run XP from there? That would leave me with only the deleting system restore problem and installing the drivers for the hardware in the new pc. If I then install Windows 7 will Windows 7 "see" the XP drive and the unformatted new hard drive as two separate drives?

 

ATB

Ian

[KenB]

Hi Ian

 

Is there a reason why I can't remove the drive from this pc and install the drive into a spare bay in the new pc and run XP from there?

It is not quite as easy as that - would that it was :)

 

If you just transfer the hard drive with XP on into a new pc you will find that it will not boot up as the drivers etc used by XP will be different from the ones needed for the new environment.

 

With XP there is a way around this .......... if you have the XP installation disk.

You can put the drive into the new system then run a Repair Install of the OS.

 

I can explain or provide a link if needed.

[Plastic Nev]

Hi, as an alternative to running a dual boot system.

From the full thread as I am reading it, your main concern regarding running XP is due to maybe many originally XP based programs and software with the worry that some may not work with Windows 7.

 

Quite a common idea that in reality isn't that much of a problem. Many programs built for XP do run well on Windows 7. I have quite a large number installed on my Windows 7 machine that originally were on my older XP machine, some, where the license permits it, are on both.

 

However, for the odd and rare case where an XP program will not run, an upgrade to Windows 7 Professional, if not already starting from that, is the first move, the upgrade is not too expensive and a lot cheaper than finding and buying a legitimate copy of XP and the maybe required extra hard drive may be.

 

Once upgraded if the upgrade is required, Microsft provide a virtual XP environment, which once that is installed, all XP and earlier based programs will run within it. The virtual environment is a free download.

More information and further links for the download from here on this Microsoft site:-

 

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows7/install-and-use-windows-xp-mode-in-windows-7

 

Nev.

[Armageddon]

I dual boot and triple boot my desktops on of them has 2 drives both with there own operating systems , the other one has a partitioned hard drive with 3 operating systems for me to choose from at boot

[grandadfatboy]

Hi and thanks for the replies gents.

 

After considering the suggestions above, I finally decided that I would load the Windows XP Virtual Environment in Windows 7. To that end I have installed Windows 7 Pro 64 bit and could not believe how easy it was.:) I installed the drivers and software that came with the machine very easily too. :) So far so good.

 

Satisfied that I had got things "right," I connected to the internet and installed AVG Anti-Virus and Microsoft Security Essentials, before updating windows. Having decided to go down the virtual XP route, it took me an absolute age to find and turn on Hardware Assisted Virtualization in the bios. Having never opened the bios settings before I was quite nosey, but changed nothing else but the virtualization setting for fear of disaster. :)

 

Once done I downloaded and installed the XP environment for Windows 7. Sadly this is where I'm having a problem. I successfully downloaded and installed Window XP mode and Windows Virtual PC. It is when setting up Windows XP Mode for the first time, that the problems began. When it reaches the end of first Set Up I receive the message "Setup was unsuccessful, please try again" and despite going through the process several times I continue to get the message. On one occasion during this set up process the PC crashed and on reboot the message "Windows has just recovered from a serious (something that I can't remember, sorry) tell Microsoft about this problem" which I did.

 

Two other "hiccups" were, I could not get the drivers and software for a wireless USB lan card to install properly. After many attempts I gave up and un-installed it via Add and Remove programmes. The other thing was the first (oldest) restore point is shown as when I installed AVG. For some reason I was expecting to be able to restore to the point before I installed the hardware drivers. Forgive me if I have this wrong, but does Virtual XP for Windows 7 still delete restore point settings in Windows 7 or is that just when installing XP and Windows 7 on seperate partitions.

 

My apologies for this being so long winded, but I have tried to include everything I have done and what happened during install. I don't think I've forgotten anything, however, I have been receiving regular visits from Senile Dementia and on occasions he brings his brother Alzheimer with him too, which really makes my days interesting.

 

I would appreciate your help guys and gals.

 

ATB

Ian

 

My system:

Case:Vantage Blue Gaming Case

Motherboard:Gigabyte 78LMT

CPU: AMDPiledriver FX 6300 4.1 Six Core 14mb Cache

Hard Drive:2tb Sata Hard Drive

Memory: 8gbDDR3 1600 Memory

OpticalDrive: 24x Dual Layer Sata DVD Writer

GraphicsCard: ATI Radeon 6670 2gb DDR3 with HDMI Hyper Memory Upto 3.8gb

Windows 7 Pro 64 bit

[KenB]

Hi Ian

 

installed AVG Anti-Virus and Microsoft Security Essentials,

This isn't a good idea.

They will clash and possibly affect the running of your machine.

I suggest that you remove AVG and keep Essentials.

 

With regards to Windows XP Virtual Environment in Windows 7 I will let one of the others answer this as my experience of this is very limited.

[Plastic Nev]

Hi, first off, the possible clash between AVG and Microsoft Security Essentials as Ken suggested above may in itself be the problem.

 

However, once you have removed AVG, or MSSE.

Did you first run the Hardware Assisted Virtualization detection tool before installing the Windows XP mode and Windows Virtual PC?

 

If you did run the tool you should have seen this message

 

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y282/plasticpig/HAVtool_zps5be3a6bb.jpg

 

If you saw any other messages, please let us know what they were.

 

However first please remove one of those antivirus programs and see if indeed that cures your problem before going any further.

 

Nev.

[grandadfatboy]

Thank for quick replies, as usual.

 

Firstly I have removed AVG and left MSE in place as you suggested. After a restart, I ran first set up once more, with exactly the same results. The status bar slowly fills from left to right and when it gets to the end the same message "Set Up was unsuccessful please try again."

 

Secondly I did run the tool and received the message "my pc was able to run Hardware Assisted Virtualization, but it was not switched on" and it gave a links to the bios settings, which I explored and found the information on how to enable this feature. I performed that task and was allowed to continue to the next step and the download area for Window XP Mode and Windows Virtual PC. I then downloaded and installed these in the order each was listed, with the results I have described above.

 

I do not recall any other messages other than those I have already included. Sorry if this is not very helpful.

 

Thanks again.

Ian

[Plastic Nev]

Hi Ian, that is a strange issue, it should all work as far as I know. However, although my machine is OK to install, I have not yet found the need to do so.

 

Unfortunately I am unable to help further until I try it myself, which I will look into it further tomorrow. I have run out of time tonight as I have spent most of this evening sorting pensions out as I retire in two weeks time.

 

Hopefully there may be another member with answers for you before I can get back to you later.

 

Just to add, though it may not be relevant as the system is supposed to check if your copy of Windows 7 Pro is genuine, and I would have thought this would be part of it, which is the important, have you fully activated that Windows 7 Pro yet?

 

It just may be refusing to work if it isn't activated and registered.

 

Nev.

[grandadfatboy]

Thank you taking the time to respond. I do appreciate it.

 

I would like to wish you a long and happy retirement. If my friend is anything to go by, you will be so active doing the things you want to do, rather than what you need to do, that you will wonder how you managed to make the time to go to work.

 

I have registered and activated Windows and when I began the download of the XP virtual environment from Microsoft I had to run and install a programme to authenticate my copy of windows, which I assume was fine or I would not have been able to proceed with the download.

 

Thanks again for your help.

Ian

[Plastic Nev]

Hi Ian, just a quick word to let you know I haven't forgotten you, I am still looking into it. However it seems there is little information regarding this problem.

 

I assume you checked and installed the 64 bit versions as you said you installed Windows 7 Pro 64 bit, so I think that one can be ruled out if you did.

 

In the mean time, and leave the virtual mode and XP mode till I know a bit more, have you tried installing any programs yet, those that will run on Windows 7 and any of the XP or earlier programs yet?

 

Any problems with any of them?

 

Nev.

[grandadfatboy]

Hi Nev,

I have not yet loaded any software onto the pc as I thought the less I do, the easier this problem will be to solve. However, I have time tomorrow to install some programmes and will try one or two that I have checked on the compatibility list for Windows 7. One of those programmes is Adobe Photoshop Elements 5, which some say installs on Windows 7 and some say they can't get it to run, so I can test that one for myself. I think my best bet will be with Pinnacle Studio 10. Although my wife did find a book worm game she used to play and the disc is dated 2005 and stated it is compatible with 98/Me/2000/XP, so another candidate there. So fingers crossed I will have some kind of news to be able to report tomorrow evening or on Friday.

 

Thanks for the assistance.

Ian

[Plastic Nev]

Hi Ian, last night I tried to download the XP mode, for some strange reason the download stopped at around two thirds of it and then had to cancel.

I will try again later, but this makes me wonder if you got the full download or if in fact you might have a corrupted download.

 

It might be worth while removing or uninstalling what you have and try another download.

 

I must admit I have never seen a download stop dead, they have always completed in the past.

 

Nev.

[grandadfatboy]

Hi Nev,

Well that makes me feel a little better knowing I'm not the only one experiencing problems with it. I think I will uninstall and try another download as you suggest. I will let you know how that goes.

 

Thanks again Nev

Ian

[Plastic Nev]

Hi, I will leave it till weekend now as evenings here the connection sometimes slows to a crawl, but I will try to download and install it as I do have one program that would be nice to have running again, but just won't install on W7.

I will let you know once I have it done and what results I get.

 

Nev.

[grandadfatboy]

Hi Nev, I hope this information is of assistance to you.

 

 

I uninstalled XPVirtual Environment as you suggested. However, downloading again fromMicrosoft's site is being very problematic. I am currently on my 4thattempt to download it. On the first attempt the pc restarted itselfwith the message "Windows is recovering from an unexpectedshutdown." There was the option "windows can check onlinefor a solution," which I allowed, but did not lead to any on screen message.

 

 

On attempts 2&3 the computer restarted with a blue screen with lines of text from top to bottom, of which I managed to read "if this problems persists contact the administrator. The pc then fired up in to Windows home screen. As I am typing this thepc has crashed yet again. This time the message was "windows wasnot closed properly would you like to Start Windows Normally, Startin Safe Mode etc."

 

For you information the version of Windows 7 Pro 64 bit that I purchased included service pack 3 and I have allowed Windows update to install all the updates available to date, with the exception of IE10 and Bing. I will try one more time in the morning and if I have no joy I will leave for a few days.

 

Thanks Nev.

Ian

[Plastic Nev]

Hi Ian.

It might just be a good thing that you haven't as yet done much with the computer.

 

It may just be a glitch, or perhaps some other fault which if the blue screens and crashes continue, it may be best to reformat the hard drive and re-install Windows 7.

The messing with the XP mode and subsequent uninstall, just might have done something to damage the operating system. As you suggest, leave things and run as normal for a few days, in the meantime I will see what I can find and also if I can eventually download and install the XP mode.

 

we are both into new ground here, yet if problems are common, why isn't there much to find on the web about it?

 

Nev.

[grandadfatboy]

Hi Nev, Thanks for theadvice.

 

 

Sadly the pc stillcontinues to crash so it's looking like I will have to reformat andreinstall Windows. Before doing so I would like your advice on thethe following options please.

 

 

1. As I have a copy ofXP (new) available to use, do insert XP first, make a partition forit and install to that partition and when complete insert Windows 7make a separate partition for Windows 7 and install to that?

 

 

2. Do I insert XP firstand make partitions for both XP and Windows 7 before installing XPonto the first partition and Windows 7 onto second?

 

 

3. Will XP be able to"see" Windows 7 and vice versa and will I be able to transfer files between the two?

 

 

4. Depending upon whatI decide to do with my old pc, I could use the hard drive from it(SATA) in the new machine and install XP onto that. Would it be bestto remove the power cable from the other hard drive, thus making thelarger drive "invisible," whilst I install XP?

 

 

Sorry it's a lot ofquestions and scenarios, but I have never undertaken anything likethis before and it has peaked my curiosity. I could not believe how simple it was to install Windows7, just as Ken had stated it was earlier in the thread. Of course, ifyou have other option(s) I would like to hear them, after all this isa learning curve me, one I'm enjoying if I'm honest.

 

 

All the best.

Ian

[Plastic Nev]

Hi Ian, the Windows XP mode seems a big let down, I can't get it to fully download either and have decided to leave it alone for now.

 

As for dual booting from the same drive with the two operating systems is a good idea, do you already have a partition making software as it will be needed if you follow this guide I am going to link to, as you will need to install XP first if you have a new unused copy. XP does not have any partition management tools so a third party one will be required. The article mentions GParted but there are others such as EaseUS Partition Master which is a free one.

 

http://www.techspot.com/guides/143-dual-boot-windows7/

 

It is a bit long winded, and a little old now but everything still applies.

 

Next is the idea of using two drives, again it can be done providing the motherboard has a spare SATA port. You can get a SATA power doubler if only one SATA power lead is available from the power supply, however you cannot split or double the SATA data leads, so you do need a spare SATA data port on the motherboard.

Otherwise you will be like me, two drives and having to change leads over if wanting to run the other drive. (Why hasn't someone made a data change over switch for that purpose, any one know?)

 

Install one operating system to one drive with the other disconnected, then disconnect that and connect the other drive and install the second operating system on that.

 

Once installed on both, they can both be connected, it is then a matter of accessing the BIOS and telling the BIOS to boot from whichever drive you wish.

 

Nev.

[Armageddon]

I run windows 7 and 8 off two different sized drives when I installed this I fitted the 2nd drive and when I came to select the drive to load windows onto I selected the second drive and installed there windows then installs windows boot loader which enables me to select which operating system to boot from attached is a picture of the boot loader the windows 7 one looks different but you will get the idea.

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]1035.vB5-legacyid=1951[/ATTACH]

 

Dave

[grandadfatboy]

Thanks for the replies guys. My apologies for the tardy reply, but it's been a manic week here this week.

 

Been a little bit clever:p, well I think I have. Got a used 250gb sata hdd off the bay of flea for less than £15. I also purchased a sata to usb hard drive enclosure, less than £10 and they arrived Friday. The job of backing up all the files on my old pc begins after posting this. I'm then thinking of installing the drive from my old pc into my new one, reformatting it and installing XP and Windows 7 onto equal sized partitions and using the larger drive for storing all my files.

 

 

My question are:

 

 

1. Will both operating systems be able to see the larger drive when both are installed?

 

 

2. Will both operating systems be able to save to and retrieve files from the larger drive?

 

 

3. Will XP be able to open and amend compatible files initially created in Windows 7 and vice versa. e.g. photographs, video, music, documents etc?

 

 

4. Will I still need to take action to prevent XP deleting Windows 7's restore points?

 

 

Many thanks for your assistance.

 

 

Ian

[Plastic Nev]

Hi Ian, I think I can answer at least the first three with a yes to all, the fourth, I will leave to someone else as it isn't something I know of, having not done it myself.

 

Nev.

[grandadfatboy]

Hi Nev, once again thanks for the quick reply.

 

Thought I would pop back on here whilst back up is in progress. This may sound a silly question, but I seem to recall from the distant past that hdd have "jumpers" so whilst I was peeking inside my new pc to see if there was a spare pci slot for my firewire card, which there is, I noticed that the hard drive has a two rows of four very tiny pins. There is a grey plastic hat for want of a better word covering pins 4 & 8 (last pin of four top right and last pin of four bottom right) I'm assuming this is a "jumper." Will this jumper need to be reset if I install the operating systems onto a different drive?

 

Thanks again.

Ian