Is this PSU Problem?!

[MKSK]

Hi, I am new to this forum. My problem is My PC works fine when I am playing 3D HD Games or converting some video files or using any normal software but when I shut it down and start it after some couple of hours may be 6 to 9 hours it doesn't boot . Then I try to Start it again and it boots and hangs while windows is loading. After trying to start it 4 to 5 times it finally gets started and then again it works fine. This cycle is repeated everyday. I have also re-installed my windows so that I can be sure that it is not a software problem but the problem still exist. I have also tested RAM with windows memory diagnostic tools in windows 7 and it was successful. Also tested Hard Drive and it worked fine. So, Now I think it's PSU's fault but I am not sure. Also I have not overclocked anything. Please Help. My PCs Specs: Intel Pentium dual core E5700, Kingston 2x2GB DDR3 RAM, Seagate 500GB hard disk, ASUS P5G41CM-LX Motherboard, Sapphire HD 6450 2GB DDR3 Graphic card, Xtech 550W PSU.

[Plastic Nev]

Hi and welcome to Extreme Tech Support - Free PC Help.

The problem you describe sounds a lot like a sticky hard drive where it is taking too long to spin up to speed. Once up and running it will then be OK as you are finding.

 

If it is this problem, it is of course hard to diagnose as all diagnostics can only check the drive once it is spinning at the right speed.

 

I suggest first to back everything up onto an external drive if possible in case the drive fails totally.

 

Then have a read of this useful article regarding various hard drive diagnostic tools, I suggest using the Seatools linked to in that article.

 

http://pcsupport.about.com/od/toolsofthetrade/tp/tophddiag.htm

 

If any fault is found on the hard drive then the next thing would be to get a new hard drive as replacement as a just in case, and to use one of the many imaging software's to clone the existing drive contents onto the new drive.

 

Let us know how you get on first with the checks, we can help further if anything or even nothing is found to be wrong.

 

Nev.

[KenB]

Hi and welcome from me too :)

 

If the HDD diagnostics comes up with no problems I suspect, as you do, that it is a PSU problem.

 

I have seen these conditions before and the cause turned out to be a problem PSU.

The thing with PSUs is that often they do not die ..... but function below voltage on one of the rails or the voltage fluctuates.

 

The easiest way to test a PSU is to swap it for a known good one.

The replacement does not need to be the same wattage ( for testing ) and if the wattage is greater than the present one this is fine.

 

Let us know how you get on.

[MKSK]

Tested hardisk with Seatools

 

Thanks to both of you for replying. I have tested my hard disk with "Seatools for windows " and ran all the tests except the 'long' ones.All the tests were successful. I would like to mention one more strange thing that happened just few minutes from now. I intentionally turned off my PC and then turned it on again. It didn't boot. I switched it off again and waited for some seconds and then again turned it on. It booted and the bios showed an error "overclocking failed or overvoltage failed". Even though I have not overclocked anything it shows this error .Does that conclude that it is the fault of my PSU? PLEASE DO REPLY.

[KenB]

Does that conclude that it is the fault of my PSU?

Not necessarily.

Was your Date and Time correct on the PC?

The reason I ask is that the error you indicate could be related to the CMOS battery.

 

Try removing the CMOS battery ( coin sized disk battery on the motherboard ) leave it out for 1 minute and replace.

The + should be on top.

 

If the Time and Date don't hold correct then this battery needs replacing.

 

So .............

PSU may need replacing.

CMOS battery needs looking at - and the very least remove it for 1 minute ( this will reset the BIOS to defaults )

[MKSK]

Yes, my date and time were correct. I also checked by removing the CMOS BATTERY . After replacing it the bios asked to setup the time. After saving the time the battery works fine but the problem still exist.

[KenB]

If the CMOS battery is OK it could well be linked with the PSU.

As already explained, the PSU could be giving a low voltage on one of the the 5v / 3.3v / 12v rails.

 

I would try a different PSU ( it does not have to be 550Watts as you have in at the moment to test )

Can you borrow one or take one out of another system ?

If you have a friendly local tech - they may lend you one to test your system.

[MKSK]

Yes I can borrow from one of my friend but that will take time. Till then can you tell me what are the stable voltage ranges for 5v, 3.3v and 12v. I'll check the voltage ranges from the BIOS or from the ASUS PC Probe software and also let you know whether changing the PSU has solved my problem. Thanks again.

[KenB]

Hi,

 

using software for PSU voltages is not really accurate enough - it will give you an idea but not definite.

 

Testing a PSU:

click here

 

The voltages need to be quite close to the expected ones - say within +/- 5%

So on the 5v side ......... 4.75v would be OK( just) but 4.5v is low.

 

12v .............. 11.5 v would be low.

[MKSK]

O.K. Thanks for the link. May be if I get the multi meter or voltmeter from my friends I'll try that too. Right now I have just reported these voltages from the BIOS- 3.3v is 3.312, 5v is 5.222 and 12v is 12.302. Let me know if this gives you any idea.

[KenB]

Those voltages, if correct, would be fine.

It is odd though, that all are higher.

Usually with old PSUs the voltages would tend to be lower.

 

There is no substitute for a physical test or better still - swapping the PSU :)

[MKSK]

I have swaped my PSU with an i-ball 250 watt PSU( it was the only PSU available for testing). When I started the PC it booted properly. It was working fine until I restarted it. The BIOS booted but after that there was a black screen with a blinking cursor on the top. When I restarted the PC the bios didn't boot. I didn't find any changes after changing the PSU. May be because the PSU is of low wattage of 250 or maybe there is a fault in some other component . I am confused here. Please help.

[KenB]

When I started the PC it booted properly. It was working fine until I restarted it.

Which implies that the original PSU was at fault.

 

May be because the PSU is of low wattage of 250

Usually it will boot up ( as you found earlier ) - even with 250 Watts.

 

Take out the RAM / Video Card / Sound Card

If you have on-board video use this.

 

Switch on.

You should get something on screen.

( You will also get POST beeps )

 

If no on-board video you will have to leave the video card in.

 

Let me know the results.

[MKSK]

I did as you asked and removed the RAM. I didn't remove the graphic card as it is not easy for me to put it back but in the BIOS I selected the onboard graphics and used it. After starting the PC I didn't see anything on the screen but the PC kept beeping until I switched it off.

[KenB]

but the PC kept beeping until I switched it off.

This is the BIOS getting as far as the Power On Self Test ( POST ) and failing to pass the test procedure.

( obviously - as there was no RAM )

 

I didn't see anything on the screen

This could be related to the on-board video ......

 

There is obviously some power getting to the motherboard as the POST generated a fail beep code.

 

Which Video Card do you have in?

 

Try switching back to that > put the RAM back in > try booting up.

 

It could be, depending on the video card, that the 250Watts is not enough.

[MKSK]

I have Sapphire HD 6450 2GB DDR3 graphic card. I have switched to this graphic card now. After placing the ram the system has booted and windows has loaded successfully. Though the windows has loaded successfully I don't think my pc is stable. while I was trying to launch one of the software the software launched but it gave an error "Access violation at address 0041E69B in moduls. read of address 00000100."

[KenB]

Access violation at address 0041E69B

This is often related to Direct X. Try deleting it and re-installing.

 

If that doesn't fix the error - it could be related to a driver.

 

Sapphire HD 6450 2GB

This card requires 400Watts minimum - it may be why you are having intermittent problems with the 250 Watt PSU. ( although it SHOULD boot up )

[MKSK]

So should I buy a new PSU? If yes then can you help me in selecting a good one ?

[KenB]

So should I buy a new PSU?

This is difficult to say and be 100% sure.

 

Your machine will not boot at all using you old 550Watt PSU.

It does boot from the 250 Watt PSU - but not all the time.

 

The problems you are having point to the PSU - there is an outside chance that it could also be the motherboard ...... but I doubt it.

If the motherboard has a problem it tends to be consistent. What you are getting is inconsistent behaviour. ( usually PSU )

 

If it were me I would try a new PSU.

 

Good makes include:

OCZ / Thermaltake / Seasonic / Corsair / Antec

 

You need a minimum of 400 Watts ............ I suggest looking at 500 - 550 Watt PSUs

 

Use Google and post a couple that fit your price range.

 

There are no guarantees - but I am fairly confident that a new PSU is in order.

[MKSK]

I would like to mention one more thing which I didn't notice that day when I was reporting the voltages of my old PSU from the BIOS. I also used ASUS PC Probe software to monitor the voltages. It showed an alert message which I didn't notice because the PC automatically got restarted. Today my PC started successfully using 250W PSU and I was just going through some settings in ASUS PC Probe software and I found this ALERT MESSAGE - "[09/13/2013 at 08:04 pm] +5V Voltage Abnormal, 0.00 V" & "[09/13/2013 at 08:04 pm] +5V Voltage become normal, 5.20 V". May be this should make it pretty sure that the problem is with PSU. What do you think?

[KenB]

[09/13/2013 at 08:04 pm] +5V Voltage Abnormal, 0.00 V" & "[09/13/2013 at 08:04 pm]

I am not too sure about this reading.

One second it is showing 0v and at the same time ( 08-04 pm ) it is back to 5.2 v

If there was a minute between the times I would be happier to say that this is conclusive.

The problem is we are relying on software and as explained earlier - you cannot rely on software to record voltages accurately.

 

There is another option:

Take the 550 Watt PSU to a local computer tech ( a small one or two man business is often better ) and ask him to check it over.

He will be able to test it under load.

I suggest that you ask how much he will charge before you pass the PSU over.

( if it fails I would still ask for the PSU back )

 

There is a PSU tester that you can buy:

click here

 

This will test the 3 voltages ( not under load ) and give you an LED readout that will be reasonably accurate.

( look for reviews if you intend buying something like this )

 

I THINK it is your PSU that is the problem - but in problems like this it is impossible to be 100% sure.

The only way to be totally sure is to try another PSU that is powerful enough to cope with the requirements of your system.

[MKSK]

Is it necessary that if the fault is in the PSU then it's temperature should be high? I asked this because I have used my PSU again in my PC. It booted properly but restarted while loading windows. I tried starting it again and windiws loaded successfully. Then I played Batman Arkham city for 4 hours without any problem. After that I checked the temp of the PSU by touching it and it was OK (not very high). I also did a stress test using Everest software for one hour. Again the PSU worked fine without any problem. I thought under full load the PSU will die but it worked like a magic. If there was a problem in some other component I don't think the PC would have lasted more than 30 minutes. The next day when I started the PC it hanged while playing a casual game for 15 minutes. After a hard reset it refused to boot. After trying severel times it finally started and worked fine for the whole day. I am sure its the fault of the PSU. Though it is trying to stay alive but that won't work for longer. I am going to buy a new PSU and will let you know how it works. Thanks

[KenB]

What you describe is typical behaviour of a problematic PSU.

They will often perform normally once booted up ...... unless under load.

They will also give problems if the system has been shut down.

 

I hope I have diagnosed your problem correctly - the new PSU will soon let you know :)