Newbie / Muppet

[andyg]

Hi, Newbie here and Newbie at fixing PC's!

 

Not sure if this is the correct forum to place this thread??

 

I need help with my wife's PC.

It is running really slow at just about everything.

I have tried updating certain things like doubling the size of the hard drive from 250 to 500gb, doubled up on the ram to 2gb and also installed an external hard drive (500gb) just to keep her photo's on.

I know none of this is massive but she only uses the PC for internet browsing, shopping and eBay!

It's a fairly old PC but as she only uses it for browsing I thought it would just be a case of increasing memory etc - wrong!!

Would have been cheaper to buy a new PC but now I've started I may as well finish but I'm at a loss as to what I need as I'm not an expert in this field personally.

I am told locally that what I need now is a new bigger motherboard bundle and new op system.

Operating system is a must as she has XP so that will have to go and be replaced with windows 7. Before you start, she hates change so there is no way she will accept Windows 8 as it's too different to XP. I may just get away with 7.

 

Now, I have been recommended to purchase either:

Catalyst Dual Core AMD FM2 3.6GHz 4GB Gaming Motherboard and Processor Bundle | Maplin

or

 

Anodise Dual Core AMD FM2 3.0 GHz 4 GB Motherboard and Processor Bundle | Maplin

 

but this looks ok too??:

 

AMD Bulldozer FX-4130 Quad Core 3.80GHz - Asus M5A78L-M USB3 HDMI Motherboard - 8GB DDR3 Memory Bundle: Amazon.co.uk: Computers & Accessories

 

I have no idea if I do need this or which one to buy or if I need one so big?? I was trying to do this on a budget but that has gone out of the window!!

 

My wife's current PC's components are:

 

Jeantech 305W Power Supply (PUFP-305P-JEA)

Seagate Barracuda HD 500GB

External Toshiba HD 500GB

Winfast K8s-755M motherboard, with n-Vidia GeForce FX5200 and 2x Kingston KVR 400x64c3a/1G

Sony DVR R/RW + CDR/RW Drive (ND-355OA

CNM Internal Card Reader

 

Hope this sounds understandable? and someone is able to help with advice.

 

Cheers

[KenB]

Hi Andy and welcome to ExTS

 

I need help with my wife's PC.

We can help you with this as a separate issue if you want - read on.

 

You have bought a new hard drive - I assume that you re-installed XP on this or did you clone the old hard drive onto it ?

If you installed XP fresh then it shouldn't be running slow.....unless this was some time back ?

 

==============

 

Your question relating to the Motherboard Bundles .........

 

If you buy the first one say ... the specs say DDR3 RAM.

Your old RAM is DDR and is not compatible. ( It will not be compatible with any new Motherboard )

You would need new RAM

 

Your PSU ( JeanTech ) is not a brand I would recommend and it is old - so would need replacing with one that is ( say ) 500 Watts ...depending on the Video Card you decide on.

 

You would need a new case.

 

With a new case you would not want the old monitor ( uneless you have a wide-screen one at the moment ) so more expense.

 

The Motherboard that I looked at ( first one ) does have on-board graphics so you could avoid buying a Video Card if you wanted to.

If you wanted to play games at some point the on-board video would not be good enough.

 

Basically there is nothing on your old system that is re-usable so you would need to build completely from scratch.

The Hard Drive could be used. The new Motherboards will be SATA ...is the Hard Drive SATA or IDE ?

 

I would suggest a 64 bit operating system - so that you can add more that 4GB RAM if you want to.

32 bit systems only utilise up to 4GB ( about 3.5GB actually )

 

So you have a number of choices

 

1. Stay with XP and let us see if we can improve things on that PC

 

2. Build a complete system from scratch

 

3. Buy a new PC ( It may be a better option ....and you get 12 months warranty )

 

4 Option 2 / 3 and repair XP as a backup.

 

Let us know where you want to go to from here. :)

[andyg]

Hello Ken, thanks for the reply.

Getting more & more expensive! :(

I installed the new HD last year along with the new DDR Ram. The reason for this was the old hard drive was really clunking away and about to fail. I replaced it with a new Seagate one, more than double the size of the old and also doubled up on the memory to 2GB.

I re-installed XP as I didn't realise its support was finishing.

 

Also, when I say 'I', I got someone local to do it as I didn't have the time back then so I don't know if he cloned the machine or not.

 

The PC is I guess fairly old and is someone elses self build that my wife bought (eBay I'm guessing) along with a nice wide screen monitor. The op when it arrived was Linux but my wife had never seen that before so I installed XP there and then.

It has never been fast but used to be much much better.

 

I am willing to have a go (only if it means I learn something) but no idea where to start (I'm fairly old too) :(.

[KenB]

the old hard drive was really clunking away

Yes - a clicking drive is a failing drive.

 

I re-installed XP as I didn't realise its support was finishing.

Yes - support finished earlier this year. Microsoft Security Essentials ( Anti-virus ) does not supply updates any more either.

All of the other AVs have extended support for at least 2 years.

 

I don't know if he cloned the machine or not.

If it came back exactly the same - with all of your saved documents / installed programs etc it would have been a clone from the original drive ( assuming it was still able to run Windows )

If you gave him your installation disk - it may well have been a complete re-install.

The reason I asked is - if it was a clone then you get EVERYTHING that was on the original hard drive ...including file problems / malware and viruses etc.

 

It has never been fast but used to be much much better.

XP runs well with 1GB RAM ...2GB is more than enough so it may well be malware / RAM module / ?? causing it to be slow.

 

I am willing to have a go

Is this have a go at sorting the XP machine or a complete build ?

[ If you compare prices it is not much cheaper to build your own than to buy new ]

 

but no idea where to start (I'm fairly old too)

I retired ( early ) 3 years ago and some of the other guys here are similar ages so you are in good company :)

 

So - XP fix / New Build / New machine ?

 

We can start with the XP machine if you like ....

Just because MS have withdrawn support and there are no updates it doesn't mean that XP has to be binned.

If you have an up-to-date AV and Firewall plus Malwarebytes on your system [ and don't use "dodgy" sites ] you should be OK ....at least for a couple of years.

 

It is up to you :)

[Plastic Nev]

Hi, to add to Kens already good advice,

If you think carefully about this and the budget you already may be looking at, a new Windows 7 computer may turn out to be the cheapest option rather than trying to upgrade what you have.

It will turn out to be nearly a full new build anyway which will possibly cost more than a completely new computer.

 

However we can help to improve the XP machine as it stands as there are many reasons for why it has slowed down, it can be malware and virus which our security guys can help with removing.

However there are many other things in the software and general operating area's, minor things like doing a full defragment of the drive, a full disc clean up and get rid of all the temporary files, a good sort out of what starts up and is running in the background that doesn't need to be, and a good look at what programs are installed, do you really need them?

 

A sort out of all the above can make quite a difference to a computers performance and we can help with all of that where needed.

 

Nev.

[andyg]

Thanks to you both, I'm happy to stick with XP for now and your mention of malware and viruses may be correct.

Just before the HD upgrade, my wife clicked on an email from a friend that was not so friendly - this was meant to have been removed but you never know - well, I don't!!

 

I have an external HD on which to put the photos my wife wishes to keep (many!) but everything else can go.

 

If XP is re-installed, will this wipe the PC clean for a fresh start?? I also have an up to date McAfee account which I must admit does let me down now and again.

 

Do I need a bigger PSU - to 500 or 600W??

[KenB]

Do I need a bigger PSU - to 500 or 600W??

No - I only mentioned that if you were considering a new build.

 

If XP is re-installed, will this wipe the PC clean for a fresh start??

Yes it will - it will also remove everything that is stored or has been installed ( photos / files / programs etc )

 

Try this before you go down the re-install route:

Download Malwarebytes from here:

click here

 

Install > Update ( important ) > Run it.

Let MBAM deal with anything it finds - you may need to OK this.

 

MBAM will produce a log in Notepad.

Copy this and paste it into your next replay.

If there is anything there that needs further attention I will pass you on to one of our security experts :)

 

If you do not have a backup copy of the photos etc it may be a good idea to copy them to the external drive.

[Starbuck]

Hi Andy,

 

I've split the last couple of posts from this thread and started a new one here:

http://extremetechsupport.com/threads/16290-Win-XP-very-slow#.U5chfKdNxwE

 

It'll be easier to concentrate on the reports we need, but still leave the original topic open.

Please reply to the new thread to post the reports.

 

Thanks.

[KenB]

Hi Andy - Complete the work with Starbuck first - then come back here and we can continue if necessary :)

[andyg]

Hello Ken,

 

Starbuck has said to pop back here for help in re-installing XP.

I have an external HD to download photos etc, dont really need anything else other than my wife's documents and possibly, favourites from her explorer.

If you feel the components already installed are up to the job (PSU, Ram, etc), could you please give me a step by step guide so that I dont mess it up.

 

Cheers

[KenB]

Hi Andy

 

I have just popped in .....will be back on line later.

I will answer this then.

 

If you reply to this I will get a reminder :)

[andyg]

Thanks Ken

[Plastic Nev]

Hi Andy, just to save Ken asking this question, I will.

You said much earlier on that when the computer was first bought, it had Linux on it which you got rid of and you then installed XP. Did you do that with a retail Microsoft XP disk, and if so, do you still have that disk?

If you have, it shouldn't be a problem to reinstall.

 

Nev.

[andyg]

Yes, with a (I assume) genuine disc I purchased.

[Plastic Nev]

That's great Andy, I will leave Ken to run through the install with you rather than two of us getting involved and cause confusion.

 

Nev.

[andyg]

Thanks Nev.

Brilliant forum, unbelievable assistance, Thank you.

[KenB]

Hi Andy

 

Brilliant forum, unbelievable assistance

The guys here are the best - we have been together for years !

 

re your re-install.

 

Please make sure that you have copied everything from My Documents / Photos etc onto the external Toshiba drive.

Once you reinstall you will lose everything.

 

If your wife has an email facility on this pc she may want to save the addresses there too.

If this is Outlook Express it should be possible to export the file to the external hard drive.

 

Please confirm that you are ready to go and are happy to wipe the drive.

 

Also - the disk that you have ....does it say on it anything related to SP1 /SP2 or SP3 ?

XP should have SP3 installed and if it doesn't have this on the disk we will need to update it later.

 

Let me know if you have any questions.

 

( out all day tomorrow ...Saturday ...so will be slow to respond )

Nev may jump in to assist :)

 

===========

 

In preparation:

 

XP is poor when it comes to drivers for hardware.

Is this a branded PC ( hewlett packard / Dell etc ) if so ....we will need the make and model number.

 

Also:

Start > Run > type in ......devmgmt.msc ... ENTER

make a note of exactly what it says next to ...

1. Network Adapters

2. Sound / Video

3. Display Adapters

 

We should be able to get these drivers from the manufacturers site - but often there are 2 or 3 alternatives.

 

Also:

The internal hard drive ....is this IDE ( broad grey data cable attached ) ?

[Plastic Nev]

Hi,

A couple more questions, firstly have a look at the XP disk you have, does it say it is just Windows XP, or does it say Windows XP SP1, or SP2 or SP3, If SP3 we might get away with not requiring this further stuff below.

 

Having looked up the Seagate drives as yours is a 500GB drive, I find that it is most likely to be a SATA type drive, which has slim cables for both power and data rather than the broad ribbon that the earlier IDE drives had.

I need to ask also does the machine have a floppy disk drive or not? or is there just the DVD drive?

If I am right about the hard drive being a SATA, there are some difficulties in installing XP which includes installing correct drivers for the motherboard and hard drive, if a floppy drive is present it does make life a little easier.

 

If you can let us know about that, and also as much as possible information about the motherboard will be a big help in finding the right drivers for it.

 

If there is not a floppy drive, rather than explain things and type a lot of information that is already there in this rather long, but very explanatory description, have a look and a good read of this.

 

http://jcalcote.wordpress.com/2008/01/05/installing-windows-xp-on-a-sata-drive/

 

You will of course need to keep the original installation before re-installing Windows XP, or better, another computer as the original XP disk needs to be copied and then the required drivers added onto another disk.

 

The article or blog, is a lot long winded and at first seems to be difficult, however, once you have read through a few times, you get to realise that although there is a bit more to do than just slipping the XP disk in, it isn't all that complicated to actually do.

Also have a look through some of the replies, the author does give extra help for some who didn't quite understand his first article.

 

Nev.

[andyg]

Hi, Sorry for not returning to this forum but I have had some issues with my eyes and have spent all weekend visiting hospitals and having drops in my eyes rendering them useless for a while!

 

In answer to Nev's questions, maybe I can fill in the blanks for you??

 

The windows XP disc does say SP2 (Home Edition).

The Seagate HD is, I'm led to believe a SATA type (red ribbon).

There is NO floppy drive.

There is a Sony DVR R/W + CDR/RW installed.

There is also a CNM Internal Card Reader.

 

I do have various discs which may help?

The XP SP2 Disc

A WinFast K7S Utility CD - containing: Chipset Drivers, Device Drivers, Super Utilities. also contains: Adobe Reader 6.0, DirectX 9.0b & Norton Internet Security 2004!!!

There is also a disc marked 'Seagate Tools' but I cannot see anything on it??

 

The PC appears to have been cloned because I asked the guy to stick all of my wife's pics, docs and favourites onto the new external drive but that drive was clear when I checked it recently.

I have now hopefully added (correctly??) the wife's pic, docs and favourites onto the external HD but please ask if I need to add anything else of importance.

Hope this is of some use??

 

Cheers.

[Plastic Nev]

Hi Andy, I am not too sure if the service pack 2 actually has the SATA drivers pre loaded, I know SP3 does, so best to wait till Ken gets back to us as he may know for sure one way or the other. If it doesn't have the drivers for a SATA hard drive, I am afraid we will have to go the long way round to get XP to install. The drivers disks you have will of course be required and those will be installed after we have the operating system up and running. Try to avoid it installing the Norton, for one it is a one we don't recommend, and secondly it is way out of date anyway.

The Adobe reader and the Direct X are also out of date so be better to download them in their up to date form if needed.

Just hang on, maybe tomorrow now for Ken to have a look.

 

Nev.

[andyg]

No worries, I am led to believe the XP disc I have is the one used on this PC. The previous HD was a SATA too I believe?

It is not a 'HP', Dell' or other named tower but a home build from somewhere many years ago.

[Plastic Nev]

OK Andy, one important thing before going further is the XP Product key. this may be either still stuck on the Windows XP CD case, or a label stuck somewhere on the computers case. The usual layout of the key is five sets of five letters and numbers in this sort of format ***xx ***xx ***xx ***xx ***xx

If the label and product key can't be found, There are some free programs that can dig it out of the registry. This must be done before we re-install XP as that key will be required to activate XP once it is installed.

Let us know if you do have it, if not we will have to install a key finder program that can dig it out of the registry for us.

 

Nev.

[andyg]

Yes, have the key!

[KenB]

Hi Andy

 

From what I have read - there were no new drivers added to SP3.

 

If your motherboard has SATA integrated into the chipset then there will be no problem.

( some of the newer boards did )

 

If it doesn't, and we need to install SATA drivers separately.

 

If all else fails it is possible to have the BIOS treat the SATA drive as IDE.

It would be a little slower - but you probably wouldn't notice.

 

please ask if I need to add anything else of importance.

Have you got email addresses saved ?

 

Before we go any further - can you check in the BIOS that the CDROM drive is the first in the Boot Order.

To do this:

Switch on > constantly alternate between tapping the DEL and F2 keys about once per second.

One of these will let you access the BIOS - this is the easiest way to find out.

 

Failing that - on screen as it boot up it will say something like ....." Press --- to enter Setup"

 

Once in the BIOS move around with the arrow keys.

You are looking for Boot Order / Boot Sequence or similar.

If the CDROM is first in the order ( at the top ) then there is nothing to do.

 

If it isn't then it needs to be moved up.

Use the arrow keys to highlight it - it will say on screen how to move it. ( usually + / - key )

If you do move it then you need to Save and Exit .....Usually F10

Again it will say on screen.

 

Let us know that you have got this far :)

[andyg]

Sorry for the delay,

 

Ok, have checked and Boot Order already was:

1st, CDROM

2nd, HD

3rd, LS 120