Guest mike Posted July 28, 2007 Posted July 28, 2007 Hi, Since we have a lot of family pictures on our pc I don't want to loose them if my disk crashes. My idea is to add another disk and then use some open source software to backup my original disk. I have Windows Xp on my computer. All hints are appreciated. cheers, //mikael
Guest Pegasus \(MVP\) Posted July 28, 2007 Posted July 28, 2007 Re: Backup solution "mike" <mikaelpetterson@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:1185620512.822268.217190@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com... > Hi, > > Since we have a lot of family pictures on our pc I don't want to loose > them if my disk crashes. My idea is to add another disk and then use > some open source software to backup my original disk. I have Windows > Xp on my computer. > > All hints are appreciated. > > cheers, > > //mikael > Get yourself a 2.5" laptop disk and an external USB case. This would enable you to copy all your important documents to that disk, preferably once every week or so. You could use a batch file to automate the process - post again if you need any further assistance. Remember to keep the USB disk in a different place at all times except while backing up files.
Guest RalfG Posted July 28, 2007 Posted July 28, 2007 Re: Backup solution Burn the photos to CD or DVD. A second harddrive or even an external harddrive would be just as prone to catastrophic failure as the main drive. Some types of hardware failure in the computer could take out both harddrives at the same time. External drives can fail on their own, as happened to me recently with an external drive that was less than 2 years old. Luckily it was only the electronics in the external enclosure that failed and the data on the drive itself was still intact, but the possibility of having lost everything in an instant was there. "mike" <mikaelpetterson@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:1185620512.822268.217190@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com... > Hi, > > Since we have a lot of family pictures on our pc I don't want to loose > them if my disk crashes. My idea is to add another disk and then use > some open source software to backup my original disk. I have Windows > Xp on my computer. > > All hints are appreciated. > > cheers, > > //mikael >
Guest Pegasus \(MVP\) Posted July 28, 2007 Posted July 28, 2007 Re: Backup solution After working for many years with hard disks (internal and external) and with CDs and DVDs, I find that the long-term reliability of burnt CDs and DVDs leaves a lot to be desired. On numerous occasions have I seen such CDs and DVDs becoming partly or wholly unreadable after a few years, regardless of which burner they were created on. Initially each an every one of them was readable but they deteriorated over time while stored in their sleeves in air-conditioned offices. "RalfG" <itsnotme@bin-wieder-da.de> wrote in message news:O96Q7iQ0HHA.6072@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... > Burn the photos to CD or DVD. > > A second harddrive or even an external harddrive would be just as prone to > catastrophic failure as the main drive. Some types of hardware failure in > the computer could take out both harddrives at the same time. External > drives can fail on their own, as happened to me recently with an external > drive that was less than 2 years old. Luckily it was only the electronics > in the external enclosure that failed and the data on the drive itself was > still intact, but the possibility of having lost everything in an instant > was there. > > > "mike" <mikaelpetterson@hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:1185620512.822268.217190@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com... >> Hi, >> >> Since we have a lot of family pictures on our pc I don't want to loose >> them if my disk crashes. My idea is to add another disk and then use >> some open source software to backup my original disk. I have Windows >> Xp on my computer. >> >> All hints are appreciated. >> >> cheers, >> >> //mikael >> > >
Guest RalfG Posted July 28, 2007 Posted July 28, 2007 Re: Backup solution There isn't a perfect solution. Negatives and prints also have a limited lifespan. It is pretty much a given that all harddrives will fail though, it is only a matter of when. I have some that still worked after 20 years, others that have failed within the first year. In the early days even some pressed CDs degraded prematurely because the aluminum layer wasn't sealed at the edge of the discs and the aluminum oxidized. Technology constantly changes however. The anticipated lifespan of CDR media these days is 75 years, with some manufacturers (eg TDK, others) offering 100 year archival lifespan warranties. Cheap DVDs may degrade after 20-30 years or you can buy some instead that have a rated life span of 100 years. For the few pennies each that it costs for DVD media it's no big deal to make redundant copies of important data. Who knows what the alternative storage medium will be 20 years from now. "Pegasus (MVP)" <I.can@fly.com> wrote in message news:O$sd56Q0HHA.4004@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... > After working for many years with hard disks (internal and > external) and with CDs and DVDs, I find that the long-term > reliability of burnt CDs and DVDs leaves a lot to be desired. > On numerous occasions have I seen such CDs and DVDs > becoming partly or wholly unreadable after a few years, > regardless of which burner they were created on. Initially > each an every one of them was readable but they deteriorated > over time while stored in their sleeves in air-conditioned offices. > > > "RalfG" <itsnotme@bin-wieder-da.de> wrote in message > news:O96Q7iQ0HHA.6072@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... >> Burn the photos to CD or DVD. >> >> A second harddrive or even an external harddrive would be just as prone >> to catastrophic failure as the main drive. Some types of hardware failure >> in the computer could take out both harddrives at the same time. External >> drives can fail on their own, as happened to me recently with an external >> drive that was less than 2 years old. Luckily it was only the electronics >> in the external enclosure that failed and the data on the drive itself >> was still intact, but the possibility of having lost everything in an >> instant was there. >> >> >> "mike" <mikaelpetterson@hotmail.com> wrote in message >> news:1185620512.822268.217190@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com... >>> Hi, >>> >>> Since we have a lot of family pictures on our pc I don't want to loose >>> them if my disk crashes. My idea is to add another disk and then use >>> some open source software to backup my original disk. I have Windows >>> Xp on my computer. >>> >>> All hints are appreciated. >>> >>> cheers, >>> >>> //mikael >>> >> >> > >
Guest db ´¯`·.. > Posted July 28, 2007 Posted July 28, 2007 Re: Backup solution also, as a backup and convenience you can upload them to websites where you have unlimited space and easy access to them where ever there is an internet connection - example: http://www.worldgroups.com/grppage.wsif?t=site/general/benefits/benefits -- db ·´¯`·.¸. , . .·´¯`·..><)))º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸><)))º>¸. ><)))º>·´¯`·.¸. , . .·´¯`·.. ><)))º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸><)))º> .. "mike" <mikaelpetterson@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:1185620512.822268.217190@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com... > Hi, > > Since we have a lot of family pictures on our pc I don't want to loose > them if my disk crashes. My idea is to add another disk and then use > some open source software to backup my original disk. I have Windows > Xp on my computer. > > All hints are appreciated. > > cheers, > > //mikael >
Guest (PeteCresswell) Posted July 28, 2007 Posted July 28, 2007 Re: Backup solution Per mike: >My idea is to add another disk and then use >some open source software to backup my original disk. I have Windows >Xp on my computer. > >All hints are appreciated. Multiple external hard drives.... at least 3, preferably 4-5... and rotate them to that one is always somewhere else. I want at least one tb immediately unavailable in hopes that it'll dawn on me that a given card has gone bad and is frying drives as I connect them before I retrieve that particular drive. Also distinguish between simple file copies and a backup database. The problem with simple file copies is that individual files can become corrupted/deleted and you'll never know until you try to open a problem file. You can still copy corrupted files into a backup DB... and they'll still be corrupted... but the odds are better for preserving files with a DB. Less convenient... but safer. -- PeteCresswell
Guest Merlin Posted July 28, 2007 Posted July 28, 2007 Re: Backup solution "mike" <mikaelpetterson@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:1185620512.822268.217190@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com... > Hi, > > Since we have a lot of family pictures on our pc I don't want to loose > them if my disk crashes. My idea is to add another disk and then use > some open source software to backup my original disk. I have Windows > Xp on my computer. > > All hints are appreciated. > > cheers, > > //mikael > My advice is to back up to at least 2 external devices. Do not rely on just one back up.
Guest Tonyo UK Posted July 28, 2007 Posted July 28, 2007 Re: Backup solution The same thing happened to me recently. The trouble was that I could find no way to access the files on the external hard drive. Fortunately, everything was still on my C: drive, so nothing was lost. But I would appreciaate it if you could explain to me in simple language how you managed to deal with the problem and get to your files. "RalfG" wrote: > Burn the photos to CD or DVD. > > A second harddrive or even an external harddrive would be just as prone to > catastrophic failure as the main drive. Some types of hardware failure in > the computer could take out both harddrives at the same time. External > drives can fail on their own, as happened to me recently with an external > drive that was less than 2 years old. Luckily it was only the electronics in > the external enclosure that failed and the data on the drive itself was > still intact, but the possibility of having lost everything in an instant > was there. > > > "mike" <mikaelpetterson@hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:1185620512.822268.217190@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com... > > Hi, > > > > Since we have a lot of family pictures on our pc I don't want to loose > > them if my disk crashes. My idea is to add another disk and then use > > some open source software to backup my original disk. I have Windows > > Xp on my computer. > > > > All hints are appreciated. > > > > cheers, > > > > //mikael > > > > >
Guest Pegasus \(MVP\) Posted July 28, 2007 Posted July 28, 2007 Re: Backup solution Sometimes you can access files stored on a marginal CD by trying different CD drives. At other times you can't. "Tonyo UK" <TonyoUK@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message news:D22E26B6-689C-4D1D-BA1F-66B9DE67EDF3@microsoft.com... > The same thing happened to me recently. The trouble was that I could find > no > way to access the files on the external hard drive. Fortunately, > everything > was still on my C: drive, so nothing was lost. But I would appreciaate it > if > you could explain to me in simple language how you managed to deal with > the > problem and get to your files. > > "RalfG" wrote: > >> Burn the photos to CD or DVD. >> >> A second harddrive or even an external harddrive would be just as prone >> to >> catastrophic failure as the main drive. Some types of hardware failure in >> the computer could take out both harddrives at the same time. External >> drives can fail on their own, as happened to me recently with an external >> drive that was less than 2 years old. Luckily it was only the electronics >> in >> the external enclosure that failed and the data on the drive itself was >> still intact, but the possibility of having lost everything in an instant >> was there. >> >> >> "mike" <mikaelpetterson@hotmail.com> wrote in message >> news:1185620512.822268.217190@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com... >> > Hi, >> > >> > Since we have a lot of family pictures on our pc I don't want to loose >> > them if my disk crashes. My idea is to add another disk and then use >> > some open source software to backup my original disk. I have Windows >> > Xp on my computer. >> > >> > All hints are appreciated. >> > >> > cheers, >> > >> > //mikael >> > >> >> >>
Guest surface9 Posted July 28, 2007 Posted July 28, 2007 Re: Backup solution When I worked in the mainframe world, we used tapes for our backups. Immediately after creating the tapes, we would read them to make sure they were good (the few failures were discarded as trash), and the verified tapes never failed that I recall. Multi-million dollar installations relied on this technology to hold true and, in a few cases, it saved the day (after a storm or natural calamity). Are there any affordable tape drives and good solid tape diskettes that can be viewed by XP as "removable storage"? I don't know but I think I'll google that and see what is available these days.
Guest HeyBub Posted July 28, 2007 Posted July 28, 2007 Re: Backup solution surface9 wrote: > When I worked in the mainframe world, we used tapes for our backups. > Immediately after creating the tapes, we would read them to make sure > they were good (the few failures were discarded as trash), and the > verified tapes never failed that I recall. Multi-million dollar > installations relied on this technology to hold true and, in a few > cases, it saved the day (after a storm or natural calamity). > > Are there any affordable tape drives and good solid tape diskettes > that can be viewed by XP as "removable storage"? I don't know but I > think I'll google that and see what is available these days. I worked for a company that had over 250,000 tapes archived, some were irreplaceable at any price (say seismic data from Viet Nam or the Red Sea). These tape were stored in a climate-controlled warehouse and a crew of 16 spent their days rewinding tapes to re-tension them and copying tapes at the five-year intervals. As for using tapes for long-term storage, nah. The tapes I'm talking about, 2400-ft reels, could hold maybe 30 megabytes. Maybe they've gotten better, but I don't think tape could even approach the packing density of disks.
Guest Ken Blake, MVP Posted July 28, 2007 Posted July 28, 2007 Re: Backup solution On Sat, 28 Jul 2007 04:01:52 -0700, mike <mikaelpetterson@hotmail.com> wrote: > Hi, > > Since we have a lot of family pictures on our pc I don't want to loose > them if my disk crashes. My idea is to add another disk and then use > some open source software to backup my original disk. I have Windows > Xp on my computer. I strongly urge you *not* to do as you suggest. A second internal drive is better than no backup at all, but just barely. Read my standard message on backup below for more info on this: First of all, almost everyone should be backing up regularly. It is always possible that a hard drive crash, user error, nearby lightning strike, virus attack, even theft of the computer, can cause the loss of everything on your drive. As has often been said, it's not a matter of whether you will have such a problem, but when. Essentially you should back up what you can't afford to lose--what you can't readily recreate. What that is depends on how you use your computer and what you use it for. It takes time and effort to backup, but it also takes time and effort to recreate lost data. If you back up daily, you should never have to recreate more than one day's worth of last data. If weekly, there's potentially a lot more to recreate. You should assess how much pain and trouble you would have if you lost x days of data, and then choose a backup frequency that doesn't involve more pain and trouble than that you would have if you had to recreate what was lost. Some things (photographs, for instance) can never be recreated, and more frequent backup may be wanted for them. At one extreme is the professional user who would likely go out of business if his data was lost. He probably needs to back up at least daily. At the other extreme is the kid who doesn't use his computer except to play games. He probably needs no backup at all, since worst case he can easily reinstall his games. Most of us fall somewhere between those extremes, but nobody can tell you where you fall; you need to determine that for yourself. Should you back up Windows? Should you back up your applications? Most people will tell you no, since you can always reinstall these easily from the original media. But I don't think the answer is so clear-cut. Many people have substantial time and effort invested in customizing Windows and configuring their apps to work the way they want to. Putting all of that back the way it was can be a difficult, time-consuming effort. Whether you should backup up Windows and apps depends, once again, on you. How to backup? What software to use? There are many choices, including the Windows-supplied backup program. Which choice is best for you depends at least in part on the answers to some of the questions above. Finally what backup media should you choose, and how should it be stored? There are many choices, including CDs, tape, zip drives, and second hard drives. I don't recommend backup to a second non-removable hard drive because it leaves you susceptible to simultaneous loss of the original and backup to many of the most common dangers: severe power glitches, nearby lightning strikes, virus attacks, even theft of the computer. In my view, secure backup needs to be on removable media, and not kept in the computer. For really secure backup (needed, for example, if the life of your business depends on your data) you should have multiple generations of backup, and at least one of those generations should be stored off-site. My computer isn't used for business, but my personal backup scheme uses two identical removable hard drives,I alternate between the two, and use Acronis True Image to make a complete copy of the primary drive. I also use a pair of 1GB thumb drives for making more frequent backups of my most critical data (like financial information). For that I just drag and drop. -- Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP Windows - Shell/User Please Reply to the Newsgroup
Guest RalfG Posted July 28, 2007 Posted July 28, 2007 Re: Backup solution Nothing high tech about it, I just took the drive out of its enclosure. I put the drive into a different external enclosure and it ran like normal. I actually found the tip online as numerous people had exactly the same thing happen to their Maxtor OneTouch drives. Some put the salvaged harddrive into their PC as a slave to recover the data after removing it from the dead external case. I already had a smaller drive in an aftermarket AcomData enclosure so I just swapped the small drive out and put the larger Maxtor in. "Tonyo UK" <TonyoUK@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message news:D22E26B6-689C-4D1D-BA1F-66B9DE67EDF3@microsoft.com... > The same thing happened to me recently. The trouble was that I could find > no > way to access the files on the external hard drive. Fortunately, > everything > was still on my C: drive, so nothing was lost. But I would appreciaate it > if > you could explain to me in simple language how you managed to deal with > the > problem and get to your files. > > "RalfG" wrote: > >> Burn the photos to CD or DVD. >> >> A second harddrive or even an external harddrive would be just as prone >> to >> catastrophic failure as the main drive. Some types of hardware failure in >> the computer could take out both harddrives at the same time. External >> drives can fail on their own, as happened to me recently with an external >> drive that was less than 2 years old. Luckily it was only the electronics >> in >> the external enclosure that failed and the data on the drive itself was >> still intact, but the possibility of having lost everything in an instant >> was there. >> >> >> "mike" <mikaelpetterson@hotmail.com> wrote in message >> news:1185620512.822268.217190@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com... >> > Hi, >> > >> > Since we have a lot of family pictures on our pc I don't want to loose >> > them if my disk crashes. My idea is to add another disk and then use >> > some open source software to backup my original disk. I have Windows >> > Xp on my computer. >> > >> > All hints are appreciated. >> > >> > cheers, >> > >> > //mikael >> > >> >> >>
Guest Pegasus \(MVP\) Posted July 28, 2007 Posted July 28, 2007 Re: Backup solution "surface9" <davsf@neto.com> wrote in message news:1185634205.992167.275080@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com... > When I worked in the mainframe world, we used tapes for our backups. > Immediately after creating the tapes, we would read them to make sure > they were good (the few failures were discarded as trash), and the > verified tapes never failed that I recall. Multi-million dollar > installations relied on this technology to hold true and, in a few > cases, it saved the day (after a storm or natural calamity). > > Are there any affordable tape drives and good solid tape diskettes > that can be viewed by XP as "removable storage"? I don't know but I > think I'll google that and see what is available these days. > Current PC-based backup tapes are notorious for being a) Slow to back up b) Prone to fail when backing up c) Very slow to restore d) Not dependable when restoring. While I was never involved in the maintenance of mainframe- based backup tapes, HeyBub's report sounds a lot more factual than yours. Our IBM mainframe disks used to fail frequently and reason says that the tapes were worse than the disks because reading them involved physical contact between the tape and the reading head. Another point to consider: Tapes are sequential. When the beginning of a tape is unreadable then the whole tape is unreadable. When a disk cluster is unreadable then the rest of the disk remains readable in most cases.
Guest HeyBub Posted July 29, 2007 Posted July 29, 2007 Re: Backup solution Ken Blake, MVP wrote: > > First of all, almost everyone should be backing up regularly. It is > always possible that a hard drive crash, user error, nearby lightning > strike, virus attack, even theft of the computer, can cause the loss > of everything on your drive. As has often been said, it's not a matter > of whether you will have such a problem, but when. > Don't forget fire, flood, and earthquake. You mentioned theft; one of our customers got burglarized three times in ten days! Every time the goblins took the computer and everything on the desk. Then there's the non-trivial possibility of outright malice by a trusted relative, friend, or employee. We had another customer whose backup diskette was gnawed to death by a puppy. One part of the backup scheme is to get the backups as far from the source as possible. You can email yourself at Gmail and include attachements (up to 2+Gigs of storage space) for free. Two backups are better than one - that's why skydivers have two parachutes.
Guest Phisherman Posted July 29, 2007 Posted July 29, 2007 Re: Backup solution On Sat, 28 Jul 2007 04:01:52 -0700, mike <mikaelpetterson@hotmail.com> wrote: >Hi, > >Since we have a lot of family pictures on our pc I don't want to loose >them if my disk crashes. My idea is to add another disk and then use >some open source software to backup my original disk. I have Windows >Xp on my computer. > >All hints are appreciated. > >cheers, > >//mikael Adding another drive or backing up to another computer will work, but it is best to burn a DVD, less expensive too.
Guest Phisherman Posted July 29, 2007 Posted July 29, 2007 Re: Backup solution On Sat, 28 Jul 2007 13:59:16 +0200, "Pegasus \(MVP\)" <I.can@fly.com> wrote: >After working for many years with hard disks (internal and >external) and with CDs and DVDs, I find that the long-term >reliability of burnt CDs and DVDs leaves a lot to be desired. >On numerous occasions have I seen such CDs and DVDs >becoming partly or wholly unreadable after a few years, >regardless of which burner they were created on. Initially >each an every one of them was readable but they deteriorated >over time while stored in their sleeves in air-conditioned offices. > Really?! I've burned hundreds of disks over the years and have not come across any that were not readable. There are quality differences in brands. I make a copy of the most important disks and store one copy off-site.
Guest Gary S. Terhune Posted July 29, 2007 Posted July 29, 2007 Re: Backup solution Performing full backups to DVD is ridiculous in any real-world situation. An external HD is the cheapest (cheaper than DVDs, for sure) and best way to go. Get two and rotate them, with one stored off site. However, for important files like the ones OP mentioned, creating one or two sets of CDs or DVDs to keep them safe is a good idea. Make two sets that are never used, stored in different locations. Make another one or more sets to pass around and use daily, etc. -- Gary S. Terhune MS-MVP Shell/User http://www.grystmill.com "Phisherman" <noone@nobody.com> wrote in message news:g5toa3p1jjq8okb8fmf8d4bcs5qqkfeu9l@4ax.com... > On Sat, 28 Jul 2007 04:01:52 -0700, mike <mikaelpetterson@hotmail.com> > wrote: > >>Hi, >> >>Since we have a lot of family pictures on our pc I don't want to loose >>them if my disk crashes. My idea is to add another disk and then use >>some open source software to backup my original disk. I have Windows >>Xp on my computer. >> >>All hints are appreciated. >> >>cheers, >> >>//mikael > > Adding another drive or backing up to another computer will work, but > it is best to burn a DVD, less expensive too.
Guest Ken Blake, MVP Posted July 29, 2007 Posted July 29, 2007 Re: Backup solution On Sat, 28 Jul 2007 19:55:14 -0500, "HeyBub" <heybub@gmail.com> wrote: > Ken Blake, MVP wrote: > > > > First of all, almost everyone should be backing up regularly. It is > > always possible that a hard drive crash, user error, nearby lightning > > strike, virus attack, even theft of the computer, can cause the loss > > of everything on your drive. As has often been said, it's not a matter > > of whether you will have such a problem, but when. > > > > Don't forget fire, flood, and earthquake. OK, but I tried to mention some fairly common *examples* of things that could happen, not make an exhaustive list. If you want a longer list, add tornados, airplanes crashing into your house, large meteorites falling on it, etc. > You mentioned theft; one of our > customers got burglarized three times in ten days! Every time the goblins > took the computer and everything on the desk. > > Then there's the non-trivial possibility of outright malice by a trusted > relative, friend, or employee. That, of course, depends at least in part on where your computer is located, and who has physical access to it. For some people it's clearly much more of an issue that for others. > We had another customer whose backup diskette > was gnawed to death by a puppy. Again, I don't think an exhaustive list is necessary. A few common examples successfully make the point. > One part of the backup scheme is to get the backups as far from the source > as possible. You can email yourself at Gmail and include attachements (up to > 2+Gigs of storage space) for free. > > Two backups are better than one - that's why skydivers have two parachutes. > -- Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP Windows - Shell/User Please Reply to the Newsgroup
Guest Paul Randall Posted July 29, 2007 Posted July 29, 2007 Re: Backup solution "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote in message news:OFn0Tjf0HHA.5764@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... > Performing full backups to DVD is ridiculous in any real-world situation. > An external HD is the cheapest (cheaper than DVDs, for sure) and best way > to go. Get two and rotate them, with one stored off site. > > However, for important files like the ones OP mentioned, creating one or > two sets of CDs or DVDs to keep them safe is a good idea. Make two sets > that are never used, stored in different locations. Make another one or > more sets to pass around and use daily, etc. And include on the drive a program called DVDSig.exe and the list of MD5 checksums it produces. That allows quick and easy verification of the integrity of all files on the disk. -Paul Randall
Guest M.I.5¾ Posted July 30, 2007 Posted July 30, 2007 Re: Backup solution "RalfG" <itsnotme@bin-wieder-da.de> wrote in message news:O96Q7iQ0HHA.6072@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... > Burn the photos to CD or DVD. > I have known CDs and DVDs to become unreadable in as little as 3 months (branded disks as well). > A second harddrive or even an external harddrive would be just as prone to > catastrophic failure as the main drive. Some types of hardware failure in > the computer could take out both harddrives at the same time. External > drives can fail on their own, as happened to me recently with an external > drive that was less than 2 years old. Luckily it was only the electronics > in the external enclosure that failed and the data on the drive itself was > still intact, but the possibility of having lost everything in an instant > was there. > Indeed, which is why you make 2 copies to 2 hard disks. The likelihood of 2 drives failing simultaneously is vastly lower than just 1 failing. My own personal preference is to backup using Acronis Trueimage* and make an incremental backup alternately to each backup disk. Since I backup weekly, that means that one disk has an image that is less than 1 week old and the other has an image that is between 1 and 2 weeks old. The amount of new files created on my home PC is such that the risk of the younger backup disk failing and my having to restore an image that is 1 week older is acceptable to me. You need to examine your own situation and decide what is an acceptable risk. My backup hard disks are large enough that I can use them to back up 3 different PCs. Remember: it's not a back up unless it's backed up. *though perfectly useable for backing up in a home environment, it is neither designed for backing up nor intended for the purpose, and may be unsuitable in a more demanding environment. > > "mike" <mikaelpetterson@hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:1185620512.822268.217190@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com... >> Hi, >> >> Since we have a lot of family pictures on our pc I don't want to loose >> them if my disk crashes. My idea is to add another disk and then use >> some open source software to backup my original disk. I have Windows >> Xp on my computer. >> >> All hints are appreciated. >> >> cheers, >> >> //mikael >> > >
Guest RalfG Posted July 30, 2007 Posted July 30, 2007 Re: Backup solution There's bad luck and then there's bad luck. :-) If you get my meaning. :-) I burned my first CDs in 1999 and the ones that weren't immediately turned into coasters are still good. A couple or three of RWs didn't last very long mind. I was at the point of posting yesterday that this thread has been using the concepts of Backup and Archiving interchangeably. If I understand the OP's intent correctly what he wants to do is archive his digital photo collection. Backing up to harddrive(s) is very convenient, I was doing that myself on a different external drive, but I'd never consider it more than temporary storage. I don't know the OPs situation but I could archive my own current digital photo collection with triple redundancy on fewer than 30DVDs. For the cost of my external harddrive that failed I could have burned about 900 regular DVDs (4000GB). Ironically these days if you can catch a good sale, a 200+Gig external drive might cost only as much as a 100 disc spindle of good quality DVDs. "M.I.5¾" <no.one@no.where.NO_SPAM.co.uk> wrote in message news:46ada09c$1_1@glkas0286.greenlnk.net... > > "RalfG" <itsnotme@bin-wieder-da.de> wrote in message > news:O96Q7iQ0HHA.6072@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... >> Burn the photos to CD or DVD. >> > > I have known CDs and DVDs to become unreadable in as little as 3 months > (branded disks as well). > >> A second harddrive or even an external harddrive would be just as prone >> to catastrophic failure as the main drive. Some types of hardware failure >> in the computer could take out both harddrives at the same time. External >> drives can fail on their own, as happened to me recently with an external >> drive that was less than 2 years old. Luckily it was only the electronics >> in the external enclosure that failed and the data on the drive itself >> was still intact, but the possibility of having lost everything in an >> instant was there. >> > > Indeed, which is why you make 2 copies to 2 hard disks. The likelihood of > 2 drives failing simultaneously is vastly lower than just 1 failing. > > My own personal preference is to backup using Acronis Trueimage* and make > an incremental backup alternately to each backup disk. Since I backup > weekly, that means that one disk has an image that is less than 1 week old > and the other has an image that is between 1 and 2 weeks old. The amount > of new files created on my home PC is such that the risk of the younger > backup disk failing and my having to restore an image that is 1 week older > is acceptable to me. You need to examine your own situation and decide > what is an acceptable risk. > > My backup hard disks are large enough that I can use them to back up 3 > different PCs. > > Remember: it's not a back up unless it's backed up. > > *though perfectly useable for backing up in a home environment, it is > neither designed for backing up nor intended for the purpose, and may be > unsuitable in a more demanding environment. > >> >> "mike" <mikaelpetterson@hotmail.com> wrote in message >> news:1185620512.822268.217190@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com... >>> Hi, >>> >>> Since we have a lot of family pictures on our pc I don't want to loose >>> them if my disk crashes. My idea is to add another disk and then use >>> some open source software to backup my original disk. I have Windows >>> Xp on my computer. >>> >>> All hints are appreciated. >>> >>> cheers, >>> >>> //mikael >>> >> >> > >
Guest M.I.5¾ Posted July 31, 2007 Posted July 31, 2007 Re: Backup solution "RalfG" <itsnotme@bin-wieder-da.de> wrote in message news:OzkN21s0HHA.3400@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... > There's bad luck and then there's bad luck. :-) If you get my meaning. :-) > I burned my first CDs in 1999 and the ones that weren't immediately turned > into coasters are still good. A couple or three of RWs didn't last very > long mind. > > I was at the point of posting yesterday that this thread has been using > the concepts of Backup and Archiving interchangeably. If I understand the > OP's intent correctly what he wants to do is archive his digital photo > collection. Backing up to harddrive(s) is very convenient, I was doing > that myself on a different external drive, but I'd never consider it more > than temporary storage. I don't know the OPs situation but I could archive > my own current digital photo collection with triple redundancy on fewer > than 30DVDs. For the cost of my external harddrive that failed I could > have burned about 900 regular DVDs (4000GB). Ironically these days if you > can catch a good sale, a 200+Gig external drive might cost only as much as > a 100 disc spindle of good quality DVDs. > > I don't think we were considering archiving. Many people fail to understand the concept of 'archiving'. Archiving is making a copy essentially for posterity. It brings up a whole can of worms all of its own. The main thing you have to consider is the 'archival life' of the medium onto which you make your archive copy. This is vastly shorter than you may think. The 'Archival life' of a medium is essentially that period of time for which you can *guarantee* to be able to recover the data from it. That is much shorter than you may think. The archival life of a modern day sheet of paper is just 20 years. It *may* last longer, but you can't guarantee it (modern paper self destructs because it contains acid used in its manufacture - it's why it turns yellow (and brittle) with age). My father was researching historical information about his home village. He visited his local council's archives because some information he wanted was contained on an eighty year old paper scroll contained in a polished mahogany box. The archivist reached in the box, but as soon as he touched the scroll, it shattered into dust. The archival life of most computer media is vastly shorter than 20 years. It's worth remembering that as media has progressed in the modern world, that the archival life has got shorter and shorter in the name of lowering production costs. Egyptian stone tablets can be read with relative ease, but an eight inch floppy? Hmm, tricky. Even if you can find a drive, the chances of the magnetic image being intact are fairly low.
Guest RalfG Posted July 31, 2007 Posted July 31, 2007 Re: Backup solution I think your definition of archiving is a touch arbitrary. The only requirement is for the long term storage of the data files, or copies of the files, in question. Paper doesn't last, film doesn't last, magnetic media doesn't last and CD/DVD media won't last forever either. The point is irrelevent. What you miss is that we are not just passive observers of this inevitable decay. My photo slides and prints are fading so I scan them to make digital copies. I know that my harddrive will ultimately fail so I store copies of those files on CD/DVD. I know that CDs and DVDs may eventually degrade so periodically I will renew those copies onto new CDs, or whatever medium becomes current in the future. Production costs naturally go down as sales volume goes up. I think you've got some erroneous preconceptions in that regard. Changes in technology are making CD/DVD media more long lived, not less. The manufacturers of CD/DVD media are talking in terms of 100+ years archival lifespan for the current best quality media. Even half of that time would take it well beyond my point of caring about what happens to my files. Not to extend this too much farther off-topic, as long as we're talking anecdotes about paper, I have some personal papers that are already more than 20 years old (school notes), an encyclopedia set in excellent condition that is 80+ years old and a mass-printed one volume history, on cheap paper, a bit yellowed and certainly fragile but basically intact, in which the original owner inscribed his name and date in 1880. Admittedly the last two examples don't neccessarily qualify as "modern" paper, but modern paper is also made in archival grades and such are expected to last well over 100 years. "M.I.5¾" <no.one@no.where.NO_SPAM.co.uk> wrote in message news:46aedbad$1_1@glkas0286.greenlnk.net... > > "RalfG" <itsnotme@bin-wieder-da.de> wrote in message > news:OzkN21s0HHA.3400@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... >> There's bad luck and then there's bad luck. :-) If you get my meaning. >> :-) I burned my first CDs in 1999 and the ones that weren't immediately >> turned into coasters are still good. A couple or three of RWs didn't last >> very long mind. >> >> I was at the point of posting yesterday that this thread has been using >> the concepts of Backup and Archiving interchangeably. If I understand the >> OP's intent correctly what he wants to do is archive his digital photo >> collection. Backing up to harddrive(s) is very convenient, I was doing >> that myself on a different external drive, but I'd never consider it more >> than temporary storage. I don't know the OPs situation but I could >> archive my own current digital photo collection with triple redundancy on >> fewer than 30DVDs. For the cost of my external harddrive that failed I >> could have burned about 900 regular DVDs (4000GB). Ironically these days >> if you can catch a good sale, a 200+Gig external drive might cost only as >> much as a 100 disc spindle of good quality DVDs. >> >> > > I don't think we were considering archiving. > > Many people fail to understand the concept of 'archiving'. Archiving is > making a copy essentially for posterity. It brings up a whole can of > worms all of its own. The main thing you have to consider is the > 'archival life' of the medium onto which you make your archive copy. This > is vastly shorter than you may think. The 'Archival life' of a medium is > essentially that period of time for which you can *guarantee* to be able > to recover the data from it. That is much shorter than you may think. > The archival life of a modern day sheet of paper is just 20 years. It > *may* last longer, but you can't guarantee it (modern paper self destructs > because it contains acid used in its manufacture - it's why it turns > yellow (and brittle) with age). > > My father was researching historical information about his home village. > He visited his local council's archives because some information he wanted > was contained on an eighty year old paper scroll contained in a polished > mahogany box. The archivist reached in the box, but as soon as he touched > the scroll, it shattered into dust. > > The archival life of most computer media is vastly shorter than 20 years. > It's worth remembering that as media has progressed in the modern world, > that the archival life has got shorter and shorter in the name of lowering > production costs. > > Egyptian stone tablets can be read with relative ease, but an eight inch > floppy? Hmm, tricky. Even if you can find a drive, the chances of the > magnetic image being intact are fairly low. > >
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