Guest Brightbelt Posted August 14, 2007 Posted August 14, 2007 Hi, I'm trying to use my XP laptop to format a drive with FAT32 so it will be compatible with an Intel Mac. But when I right-click the drive and choose 'Format', NTFS is the only choice there, like a default. Is there something I'm missing? How can I get it to format with FAT32? I appreciate any assistance on this,....Frank B.
Guest Pegasus \(MVP\) Posted August 14, 2007 Posted August 14, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? "Brightbelt" <Brightbelt@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message news:51007D69-741C-4EB3-9FAF-402772CC1418@microsoft.com... > Hi, > I'm trying to use my XP laptop to format a drive with FAT32 so it will be > compatible with an Intel Mac. > > But when I right-click the drive and choose 'Format', NTFS is the only > choice there, like a default. > > Is there something I'm missing? How can I get it to format with FAT32? > > I appreciate any assistance on this,....Frank B. FAT32 has a limit of 32 GBytes when you use the Windows partitioning/formatting tool.
Guest Brightbelt Posted August 14, 2007 Posted August 14, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? "Pegasus (MVP)" wrote: > > "Brightbelt" <Brightbelt@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message > news:51007D69-741C-4EB3-9FAF-402772CC1418@microsoft.com... > > Hi, > > I'm trying to use my XP laptop to format a drive with FAT32 so it will be > > compatible with an Intel Mac. > > > > But when I right-click the drive and choose 'Format', NTFS is the only > > choice there, like a default. > > > > Is there something I'm missing? How can I get it to format with FAT32? > > > > I appreciate any assistance on this,....Frank B. > > FAT32 has a limit of 32 GBytes when you use the Windows > partitioning/formatting tool. OK Thanks, I was finding this out through searches as you answered me. This is an external drive - can I create 32 GB partitions and format them that way? Many Thanks, Frank B. > > >
Guest philo Posted August 14, 2007 Posted August 14, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? <snip> > > > > > > Is there something I'm missing? How can I get it to format with FAT32? > > > > > > I appreciate any assistance on this,....Frank B. > > > > FAT32 has a limit of 32 GBytes when you use the Windows > > partitioning/formatting tool. > > OK Thanks, I was finding this out through searches as you answered me. This > is an external drive - can I create 32 GB partitions and format them that way? > > Many Thanks, Frank B. > > > > > > That will work or else you can use 3rd party partitioning software as XP will recognize fat32 partitions over 32 gigs...(it just can't create them)
Guest HEMI-Powered Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? =?Utf-8?B?QnJpZ2h0YmVsdA==?= added these comments in the current discussion du jour ... > Hi, > I'm trying to use my XP laptop to format a drive with FAT32 > so it will be > compatible with an Intel Mac. > > But when I right-click the drive and choose 'Format', NTFS is > the only choice there, like a default. > > Is there something I'm missing? How can I get it to format > with FAT32? > > I appreciate any assistance on this,....Frank B. I believe you need a 3rd party utility to format FAT32, e.g., Partition Magic or something like it. I don't think it was ever reasonable for MS to offer a format to what they perceive, rightly, is an obsolete system, far too limited in capacity for any one partition and virtually impossible to apply any semblence of security to. As always, just the opinion of an old fool, YMMV. -- HP, aka Jerry
Guest HEMI-Powered Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? philo added these comments in the current discussion du jour ... > That will work or else you can use 3rd party partitioning > software as XP will recognize fat32 partitions over 32 > gigs...(it just can't create them) There's still a limit on partition size. Please don't hold me to this number, but it is in the range of 150 gig for any single partitition. -- HP, aka Jerry
Guest Jim Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? "HEMI-Powered" <none@none.sn> wrote in message news:Xns998CCD8ABF7CDReplyScoreID@216.168.3.30... > =?Utf-8?B?QnJpZ2h0YmVsdA==?= added these comments in the current > discussion du jour ... > >> Hi, >> I'm trying to use my XP laptop to format a drive with FAT32 >> so it will be >> compatible with an Intel Mac. >> >> But when I right-click the drive and choose 'Format', NTFS is >> the only choice there, like a default. >> >> Is there something I'm missing? How can I get it to format >> with FAT32? >> >> I appreciate any assistance on this,....Frank B. > > I believe you need a 3rd party utility to format FAT32, e.g., > Partition Magic or something like it. I don't think it was ever > reasonable for MS to offer a format to what they perceive, rightly, > is an obsolete system, far too limited in capacity for any one > partition and virtually impossible to apply any semblence of > security to. As always, just the opinion of an old fool, YMMV. > > -- > HP, aka Jerry Here is another one with the same opinion. Jim
Guest Paul Randall Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? I use 300 GB drives, single partition, formated FAT32. No problems. I use DOS program GDisk.exe which comes with Norton Ghost. -Paul Randall "HEMI-Powered" <none@none.sn> wrote in message news:Xns998CCDBE5526AReplyScoreID@216.168.3.30... > philo added these comments in the current discussion du jour ... > >> That will work or else you can use 3rd party partitioning >> software as XP will recognize fat32 partitions over 32 >> gigs...(it just can't create them) > > There's still a limit on partition size. Please don't hold me to > this number, but it is in the range of 150 gig for any single > partitition. > > -- > HP, aka Jerry
Guest Brightbelt Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? "Jim" wrote: > > "HEMI-Powered" <none@none.sn> wrote in message > news:Xns998CCD8ABF7CDReplyScoreID@216.168.3.30... > > =?Utf-8?B?QnJpZ2h0YmVsdA==?= added these comments in the current > > discussion du jour ... > > > >> Hi, > >> I'm trying to use my XP laptop to format a drive with FAT32 > >> so it will be > >> compatible with an Intel Mac. > >> > >> But when I right-click the drive and choose 'Format', NTFS is > >> the only choice there, like a default. > >> > >> Is there something I'm missing? How can I get it to format > >> with FAT32? > >> > >> I appreciate any assistance on this,....Frank B. > > > > I believe you need a 3rd party utility to format FAT32, e.g., > > Partition Magic or something like it. I don't think it was ever > > reasonable for MS to offer a format to what they perceive, rightly, > > is an obsolete system, far too limited in capacity for any one > > partition and virtually impossible to apply any semblence of > > security to. As always, just the opinion of an old fool, YMMV. > > > > -- > > HP, aka Jerry > Here is another one with the same opinion. > Jim In case anyone follows this thread to this length, what I ended up doing (after reading some Mac forums as well) was to have Mac format the drive (using Disk Utility) to MS-Dos. I read that the write rate is a lot faster for that format than Fat32. Yes, the 32 GB restriction makes it hard to deal with. Many Thanks for all your assistance, ...Frank B.
Guest M.I.5¾ Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? "HEMI-Powered" <none@none.sn> wrote in message news:Xns998CCDBE5526AReplyScoreID@216.168.3.30... > philo added these comments in the current discussion du jour ... > >> That will work or else you can use 3rd party partitioning >> software as XP will recognize fat32 partitions over 32 >> gigs...(it just can't create them) > > There's still a limit on partition size. Please don't hold me to > this number, but it is in the range of 150 gig for any single > partitition. > Well if there is, it's *much* bigger than that. I run a 400GB FAT32 partition with no problem.
Guest M.I.5¾ Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? "HEMI-Powered" <none@none.sn> wrote in message news:Xns998CCD8ABF7CDReplyScoreID@216.168.3.30... > =?Utf-8?B?QnJpZ2h0YmVsdA==?= added these comments in the current > discussion du jour ... > >> Hi, >> I'm trying to use my XP laptop to format a drive with FAT32 >> so it will be >> compatible with an Intel Mac. >> >> But when I right-click the drive and choose 'Format', NTFS is >> the only choice there, like a default. >> >> Is there something I'm missing? How can I get it to format >> with FAT32? >> >> I appreciate any assistance on this,....Frank B. > > I believe you need a 3rd party utility to format FAT32, e.g., > Partition Magic or something like it. I don't think it was ever > reasonable for MS to offer a format to what they perceive, rightly, > is an obsolete system, far too limited in capacity for any one > partition and virtually impossible to apply any semblence of > security to. As always, just the opinion of an old fool, YMMV. > It may be obsolete, but it is very necessary when you format disks that you require to operate with othersystems that don't speak NTFS. Also there is still the odd application that for some strange reason won't operate from NTFS partitions, but is otherwise quite compatible with XP..
Guest M.I.5¾ Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? "Brightbelt" <Brightbelt@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message news:040E075F-4217-4666-A5CB-571EDECAFB66@microsoft.com... > > > "Jim" wrote: > >> >> "HEMI-Powered" <none@none.sn> wrote in message >> news:Xns998CCD8ABF7CDReplyScoreID@216.168.3.30... >> > =?Utf-8?B?QnJpZ2h0YmVsdA==?= added these comments in the current >> > discussion du jour ... >> > >> >> Hi, >> >> I'm trying to use my XP laptop to format a drive with FAT32 >> >> so it will be >> >> compatible with an Intel Mac. >> >> >> >> But when I right-click the drive and choose 'Format', NTFS is >> >> the only choice there, like a default. >> >> >> >> Is there something I'm missing? How can I get it to format >> >> with FAT32? >> >> >> >> I appreciate any assistance on this,....Frank B. >> > >> > I believe you need a 3rd party utility to format FAT32, e.g., >> > Partition Magic or something like it. I don't think it was ever >> > reasonable for MS to offer a format to what they perceive, rightly, >> > is an obsolete system, far too limited in capacity for any one >> > partition and virtually impossible to apply any semblence of >> > security to. As always, just the opinion of an old fool, YMMV. >> > >> > -- >> > HP, aka Jerry >> Here is another one with the same opinion. >> Jim > > In case anyone follows this thread to this length, what I ended up doing > (after reading some Mac forums as well) was to have Mac format the drive > (using Disk Utility) to MS-Dos. I read that the write rate is a lot faster > for that format than Fat32. > > There isn't actually a format called MS-DOS. I suspect that the Mac formatted it to FAT32 or possibly even FAT16 (which is what MS-DOS actually used).
Guest HEMI-Powered Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? Paul Randall added these comments in the current discussion du jour ... > I use 300 GB drives, single partition, formated FAT32. No > problems. I use DOS program GDisk.exe which comes with Norton > Ghost. I can't get Partition Magic to go over about 150 gig as I said, I've tried it on 3 externals. If you got 300, then great! I didn't think there was enough bit length in 32bits to do that, but I learn new things every day, Paul. > -Paul Randall >>> That will work or else you can use 3rd party partitioning >>> software as XP will recognize fat32 partitions over 32 >>> gigs...(it just can't create them) >> >> There's still a limit on partition size. Please don't hold me >> to this number, but it is in the range of 150 gig for any >> single partitition. -- HP, aka Jerry
Guest HEMI-Powered Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? M.I.5¾ added these comments in the current discussion du jour .... >> I believe you need a 3rd party utility to format FAT32, e.g., >> Partition Magic or something like it. I don't think it was >> ever reasonable for MS to offer a format to what they >> perceive, rightly, is an obsolete system, far too limited in >> capacity for any one partition and virtually impossible to >> apply any semblence of security to. As always, just the >> opinion of an old fool, YMMV. > > It may be obsolete, but it is very necessary when you format > disks that you require to operate with othersystems that don't > speak NTFS. Also there is still the odd application that for > some strange reason won't operate from NTFS partitions, but is > otherwise quite compatible with XP.. > I understand legacy app requirements like you say. Please re-read my comment above where I relate "obsolete" to MS's opinion, which I believe is correct. There is no point to SP2-style security or even base XP much of anything on a FAT32 partition that doesn't support that, but I ran it for years on two extended partitions anyway because it is almost always faster, in my testing, for read/write and much faster just getting a folder tree up in Explorer. NTFS can take a lot of time, for me at least, making up its mind to display the folder tree. Not sure what it's doing, but I would guess it is examining the tree and caching certain attributes. My nephew who is also a very good friend and my PC builder, runs a multi-boot PC at his father's machine shop that has 4-6 boot partitions from Win 95/98, to XP, to 2000, and, of course, his favorite, Linux. Aside from Linux, the reason he has all the olderr Windows still multi-booting is that much of his CNC computers are still not being updated by their manufacturers to support even XP. Ditto for various kinds of measurement and machined parts testing computers. Naturally, a legacy O/S is going to expect FAT32 or even FAT16 if you go back far enough. -- HP, aka Jerry
Guest Tim Slattery Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? "HEMI-Powered" <none@none.sn> wrote: >philo added these comments in the current discussion du jour ... > >> That will work or else you can use 3rd party partitioning >> software as XP will recognize fat32 partitions over 32 >> gigs...(it just can't create them) > >There's still a limit on partition size. Please don't hold me to >this number, but it is in the range of 150 gig for any single >partitition. The theoretical limit for a FAT32 partition is 2 terabytes. The theoretical limit for an NTFS volume is 2**64 allocation units, though current implementations are limited to 2**32 allocation units, which is still much larger than any disk you'll find. Look here: http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/windows2000serv/reskit/core/fncc_fil_tvjq.mspx?mfr=true -- Tim Slattery MS MVP(DTS) Slattery_T@bls.gov http://members.cox.net/slatteryt
Guest HEMI-Powered Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? Tim Slattery added these comments in the current discussion du jour ... >>There's still a limit on partition size. Please don't hold me >>to this number, but it is in the range of 150 gig for any >>single partitition. > > The theoretical limit for a FAT32 partition is 2 terabytes. > The theoretical limit for an NTFS volume is 2**64 allocation > units, though current implementations are limited to 2**32 > allocation units, which is still much larger than any disk > you'll find. > > Look here: > http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/windows2000serv/re > skit/core/fncc_fil_tvjq.mspx?mfr=true > OK, I stand/sit corrected; I did a quick 2^32 in Excel. So, why is it that PM won't format over abut 150 gig do you think? Sorry to be obtuse and stubborn but it has always been my belief and that of friends more technically knowledgeable than myself that it isn't as large as you suggest. And again, if you know me at all, you know that I understand theory but do not rely on it, being a consumate pragmatist. I far more believe what is in front of my eyes for ANYTHING than what the pure math may suggest or a "theoretical" viewpoint on such things as MTBF for an external HD or an LCD monitor. I DO take theory into consideration and DID study it in engineering school along with the practical applications, but if you're at all familiar with the education engineers get, no matter what their specialty, the profs rely on the appropriate schols of mathematics, physics, chemistry, etc. to provide the theoretical background but they teach and demonstrate how theory is applied. That is the hallmark of professional engineers who must be acutely aware of the theoretical foundations for whatever they are designing or developing, but they must focus more on design of experiments for testing and validation. My views may not sit well with lots of folks here, but they have kept me out of falling for some unusual problems that did plague those who believe every word anyone may tell them, but without verifying it for themselves. -- HP, aka Jerry
Guest Anna Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? > "HEMI-Powered" <none@none.sn> wrote: > >>philo added these comments in the current discussion du jour ... >> >>> That will work or else you can use 3rd party partitioning >>> software as XP will recognize fat32 partitions over 32 >>> gigs...(it just can't create them) >> >>There's still a limit on partition size. Please don't hold me to >>this number, but it is in the range of 150 gig for any single >>partitition. > > The theoretical limit for a FAT32 partition is 2 terabytes. The > theoretical limit for an NTFS volume is 2**64 allocation units, though > current implementations are limited to 2**32 allocation units, which > is still much larger than any disk you'll find. "Tim Slattery" <Slattery_T@bls.gov> wrote in message news:r0u5c39gmv72e0oi2fil6fugon3onclk3b@4ax.com... > Look here: > http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/windows2000serv/reskit/core/fncc_fil_tvjq.mspx?mfr=true > > -- > Tim Slattery > MS MVP(DTS) > Slattery_T@bls.gov > http://members.cox.net/slatteryt As Tim has pointed out, for all practical purposes there really is no limit to partition size re FAT32-formatted partitions. If, for one reason or another, a user desires to use the FAT32 file system in a WinXP environment, he or she can do so. As we all know there is that 32 GB limitation involving *creating* FAT32 partitions from within XP, i.e., through the Disk Management utility, however these > 32 GB FAT32 partitions can be created through other means, primarily using the FDISK/FORMAT commands from a DOS boot disk, e.g., a Win9x/Me "Startup Disk". And then the XP OS will happily use those > 32 GB FAT32 partitions. There was (and is) a problem with large-capacity disks, i.e., > 127 GB binary, when used with a Win9x/Me OS. For one thing problems arise in those operating systems with using the defragmentation & disk scanning utilities. We've also run into serious disk corruption errors in general which we attributed to those large-capacity FAT32-formatted drives. Our general recommendation to users of those operating systems is to install no HDD > 120 GB. Like virtually all other commentators, for a variety of reasons, we ordinarily recommend using the NTFS file system in an XP environment. However, as one or more posters has commented, we too have run into situations - primarily involving custom-designed programs specialized for use in a business - where the program simply refused to work or worked erratically within an NTFS file system but had no problem when installed in a FAT32 file system in an XP environment. So in those cases the user had little or no choice to use the FAT32 file system. Anna
Guest HEMI-Powered Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? Anna added these comments in the current discussion du jour ... >>>> That will work or else you can use 3rd party partitioning >>>> software as XP will recognize fat32 partitions over 32 >>>> gigs...(it just can't create them) >>> >>>There's still a limit on partition size. Please don't hold me >>>to this number, but it is in the range of 150 gig for any >>>single partitition. >> >> The theoretical limit for a FAT32 partition is 2 terabytes. >> The theoretical limit for an NTFS volume is 2**64 allocation >> units, though current implementations are limited to 2**32 >> allocation units, which is still much larger than any disk >> you'll find. > > > "Tim Slattery" <Slattery_T@bls.gov> wrote in message > news:r0u5c39gmv72e0oi2fil6fugon3onclk3b@4ax.com... >> Look here: >> http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/windows2000serv/r >> eskit/core/fncc_fil_tvjq.mspx?mfr=true > > As Tim has pointed out, for all practical purposes there > really is no limit to partition size re FAT32-formatted > partitions. If, for one reason or another, a user desires to > use the FAT32 file system in a WinXP environment, he or she > can do so. As we all know there is that 32 GB limitation > involving *creating* FAT32 partitions from within XP, i.e., > through the Disk Management utility, however these > 32 GB > FAT32 partitions can be created through other means, primarily > using the FDISK/FORMAT commands from a DOS boot disk, e.g., a > Win9x/Me "Startup Disk". And then the XP OS will happily use > those > 32 GB FAT32 partitions. > > There was (and is) a problem with large-capacity disks, i.e., > > 127 GB binary, when used with a Win9x/Me OS. For one thing > problems arise in those operating systems with using the > defragmentation & disk scanning utilities. We've also run into > serious disk corruption errors in general which we attributed > to those large-capacity FAT32-formatted drives. Our general > recommendation to users of those operating systems is to > install no HDD > 120 GB. I still don't understand, Anna, why I can't get Partition Magic to format larger than in the 150 gig range. Is it wounded or defective? As you know, Symantec bought it but never ever updated it. And, other competitive products seem to have similar problems, although I cannot personally vouch for any limits on partition size. Just for the record, how would I format a FAT32 partition on, say, a 500 gig external to over 150? I know and understand FDISK but am very skittish about it because a minor mistep can wipe out my primary. Yes, I am cautious, some would say overly cautious, but I've found in my 60 year life that it pays to not lead with my chin. Thanks for your comments. > Like virtually all other commentators, for a variety of > reasons, we ordinarily recommend using the NTFS file system in > an XP environment. However, as one or more posters has > commented, we too have run into situations - primarily > involving custom-designed programs specialized for use in a > business - where the program simply refused to work or worked > erratically within an NTFS file system but had no problem when > installed in a FAT32 file system in an XP environment. So in > those cases the user had little or no choice to use the FAT32 > file system. Anna > Here, you're talking about my nephew's experience in getting proprietary SW to run on newer versions of Windows that he wants for various computer-controlled machine tools or measuring devices, as well as some versions of smaller CAD or CAM cutter path SW, or even apps designed to program things like so-called "programmable controllers" for CNC-anything, robots, and the like. Incidently, do you have an opinion on my observation that FAT32 is much faster on read/writes than NTFS as well as far faster to just bring up a folder tree? For awhile, NTFS on my extended partitions (I have two) and my external were SO slow, many minutes to just get a tree, that I reformatted them as FAT32. For other reasons, primarily the need to store very large Acronis True Image image files, I was forced to go back to NTFS. It was as if a miracle had occurred. I've had little trouble since, although my Maxtor 300 gig with 2 NTFS partitions (I wanted 2 to separate the data on the drive logically) normally works fine, there ARE occasions when it'll go away for a minute or two trying to access one of the partitions in Explorer. Again, thanks for your observations. Am I correc that you are the same "Anna" that posted that excellent True Image tutorial some time back? Very nicely written and quite helpful. -- HP, aka Jerry
Guest Anna Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? >> "HEMI-Powered" <none@none.sn> wrote: >> >>>philo added these comments in the current discussion du jour ... >>> >>>> That will work or else you can use 3rd party partitioning >>>> software as XP will recognize fat32 partitions over 32 >>>> gigs...(it just can't create them) >>> >>>There's still a limit on partition size. Please don't hold me to >>>this number, but it is in the range of 150 gig for any single >>>partitition. >> >> The theoretical limit for a FAT32 partition is 2 terabytes. The >> theoretical limit for an NTFS volume is 2**64 allocation units, though >> current implementations are limited to 2**32 allocation units, which >> is still much larger than any disk you'll find. > "Tim Slattery" <Slattery_T@bls.gov> wrote in message > news:r0u5c39gmv72e0oi2fil6fugon3onclk3b@4ax.com... >> Look here: http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/windows2000serv/reskit/core/fncc_fil_tvjq.mspx?mfr=true>> -->> Tim Slattery>> MS MVP(DTS)>> Slattery_T@bls.gov>> http://members.cox.net/slatteryt"Anna" <myname@myisp.net> wrote in messagenews:%23s0v%23N03HHA.5424@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...> As Tim has pointed out, for all practical purposes there really is nolimit> to partition size re FAT32-formatted partitions. If, for one reason or> another, a user desires to use the FAT32 file system in a WinXPenvironment,> he or she can do so. As we all know there is that 32 GB limitationinvolving> *creating* FAT32 partitions from within XP, i.e., through the Disk> Management utility, however these > 32 GB FAT32 partitions can be created> through other means, primarily using the FDISK/FORMAT commands from a> DOS boot disk, e.g., a Win9x/Me "Startup Disk". And then the XP OS will> happily use those > 32 GB FAT32 partitions.>> There was (and is) a problem with large-capacity disks, i.e., > 127 GB> binary, when used with a Win9x/Me OS. For one thing problems arise inthose> operating systems with using the defragmentation & disk scanningutilities.> We've also run into serious disk corruption errors in general which we> attributed to those large-capacity FAT32-formatted drives. Our general> recommendation to users of those operating systems is to install no HDD >> 120 GB.>> Like virtually all other commentators, for a variety of reasons, we> ordinarily recommend using the NTFS file system in an XP environment.> However, as one or more posters has commented, we too have run into> situations - primarily involving custom-designed programs specialized for> use in a business - where the program simply refused to work or worked> erratically within an NTFS file system but had no problem when installedin> a FAT32 file system in an XP environment. So in those cases the user had> little or no choice to use the FAT32 file system.> Anna"HEMI-Powered" <none@none.sn> wrote in messagenews:Xns998D6B1668A8ReplyScoreID@216.168.3.30...> I still don't understand, Anna, why I can't get Partition Magic> to format larger than in the 150 gig range. Is it wounded or> defective? As you know, Symantec bought it but never ever updated> it. And, other competitive products seem to have similar> problems, although I cannot personally vouch for any limits on> partition size.>> Just for the record, how would I format a FAT32 partition on,> say, a 500 gig external to over 150? I know and understand FDISK> but am very skittish about it because a minor mistep can wipe out> my primary. Yes, I am cautious, some would say overly cautious,> but I've found in my 60 year life that it pays to not lead with> my chin.>> Thanks for your comments.(SNIP)> Incidently, do you have an opinion on my observation that FAT32> is much faster on read/writes than NTFS as well as far faster to> just bring up a folder tree? For awhile, NTFS on my extended> partitions (I have two) and my external were SO slow, many> minutes to just get a tree, that I reformatted them as FAT32. For> other reasons, primarily the need to store very large Acronis> True Image image files, I was forced to go back to NTFS. It was> as if a miracle had occurred. I've had little trouble since,> although my Maxtor 300 gig with 2 NTFS partitions (I wanted 2 to> separate the data on the drive logically) normally works fine,> there ARE occasions when it'll go away for a minute or two trying> to access one of the partitions in Explorer.>> Again, thanks for your observations. Am I correc that you are the> same "Anna" that posted that excellent True Image tutorial some> time back? Very nicely written and quite helpful.> --> HP, aka JerryJerry:I honestly don't know why you're having trouble using the Partition Magicprogram (I assume you're using the 8.01 version) to create one or more FAT32partitions. It's usually a very "cut & dried" procedure with PM. Although Ihave to admit it's been a very long time since we used that program tocreate large FAT32 partitions. In the event we *do* find it necessary, weinvariably use the FDISK & FORMAT commands from a DOS boot floppy disk or CDto create FAT32 partitions.As to formatting a FAT32 partition on your external 500 GB HDD...I'm assuming it's a USB external HDD, right? If so, you really won't be ableto use the FDISK/FORMAT commands in that situation because of the USBinterface. It will be necessary to install the disk as an *internal* HDD inyour system and then boot to the DOS boot disk to invoke the FDISK/FORMATcommands. Then, of course, reinstall the disk in its USB enclosure.Now, there *is* ostensibly a program that purports to format FAT32partitions > 32 GB from *within* WinXP. It's a Linux-based program - themkdosfs.exe program that you can download in ZIP format fromhttp://www.mager.org/mkdosfs/Basically the process is to create the partition on your USB external HDDusing the Disk Management utility in XP and format the > 32 GB partition inNTFS. Then use the mkdosfs.exe program which will be installed in your XPsystem to format that partition FAT32. We've used this program a number oftimes and for the most part it "worked". But I have to tell you that in acouple of cases we later ran into some data corruption issues which, whilewe couldn't *prove* they were caused by the mkdosfs FAT32-formattingprocess, we were (and continue to be) uneasy about using the program again.So you may first want to experiment with this program by testing it withsome non-critical data. But I would be cautious about using it without anyreservations until you're confident of its effectiveness.In any event, if you are able to uninstall the 500 GB HDD from its USBenclosure and then install it as an internal HDD in your XP system, I wouldgo ahead and use the FDISK/FORMAT commands as indicated above. As youprobably know it's a rather straightforward process and shouldn't cause youany difficulty. Just take your time and understand those commands' optionsas you go through the process.As to your questions re the differences between the FAT32 & NTFS filesystems as to performance (speed of read/writes). I really can't concludethe FAT32 file system is faster in this regard. As I previously stated,unless the user has some special need to use the FAT32 file system becauseof some program/system compatibility issues, we strongly recommend employingthe NTFS file system in an XP environment.And yes, I'm the very same "Anna" and thank you for your nice comment. I'mglad to hear you found those Acronis True Image step-by-step instructionshelpful. I might mention in passing that we've actually been using anotherdisk cloning program since earlier this year and we've been quite impressedwith it. To the point where it's our disk-cloning program of choice and weprefer it over the ATI program. It's the Casper 4.0 program (seehttp://www.fssdev.com)Perhaps you've come across a couple of my postings in which I extolled thevirtues of this program and provided some details as to using it. It'scertainly worth looking into. In this connection you might want to take alook at my post to this newsgroup of August 7 - the subject being "Re: needa good backup method or program".(BTW, I'm leaving for a two-month overseas assignment tomorrow morning andwill not have access to this & other newsgroups during that time. I mentionthis only because I probably won't have an opportunity to respond to anyfurther posts over the next few months.)Anna
Guest Tim Slattery Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? "HEMI-Powered" <none@none.sn> wrote: >OK, I stand/sit corrected; I did a quick 2^32 in Excel. So, why >is it that PM won't format over abut 150 gig do you think? I think you'd have to ask Symantec that question. We've heard in this newsgroup from people who have used FAT32 partitions larger than 150GB (one poster reported a FAT32 partition of 300GB! Not for me, thanks), so it's certainly possible to do. -- Tim Slattery MS MVP(DTS) Slattery_T@bls.gov http://members.cox.net/slatteryt
Guest Anna Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? (Sorry about the screwy formatting in my previous post. Trust this one is clearer!) >> "HEMI-Powered" <none@none.sn> wrote: >>>philo added these comments in the current discussion du jour ... >>>> That will work or else you can use 3rd party partitioning >>>> software as XP will recognize fat32 partitions over 32 >>>> gigs...(it just can't create them) >>> >>>There's still a limit on partition size. Please don't hold me to >>>this number, but it is in the range of 150 gig for any single >>>partitition. >> >> The theoretical limit for a FAT32 partition is 2 terabytes. The >> theoretical limit for an NTFS volume is 2**64 allocation units, though >> current implementations are limited to 2**32 allocation units, which >> is still much larger than any disk you'll find. Anna" <myname@myisp.net> wrote in message As Tim (Slattery) has pointed out, for all practical purposes there really is no limit to partition size re FAT32-formatted partitions. If, for one reason or another, a user desires to use the FAT32 file system in a WinXPenvironment, he or she can do so. As we all know there is that 32 GB limitation involving *creating* FAT32 partitions from within XP, i.e., through the Disk Management utility, however these > 32 GB FAT32 partitions can be created through other means, primarily using the FDISK/FORMAT commands from a DOS boot disk, e.g., a Win9x/Me "Startup Disk". And then the XP OS will happily use those > 32 GB FAT32 partitions. There was (and is) a problem with large-capacity disks, i.e., > 127 GB binary, when used with a Win9x/Me OS. For one thing problems arise in those operating systems with using the defragmentation & disk scanning utilities. We've also run into serious disk corruption errors in general which we attributed to those large-capacity FAT32-formatted drives. Our general recommendation to users of those operating systems is to install no HDD > 120 GB. Like virtually all other commentators, for a variety of reasons, we ordinarily recommend using the NTFS file system in an XP environment. However, as one or more posters has commented, we too have run into situations - primarily involving custom-designed programs specialized for use in a business - where the program simply refused to work or worked erratically within an NTFS file system but had no problem when installedin a FAT32 file system in an XP environment. So in those cases the user had little or no choice to use the FAT32 file system. Anna "HEMI-Powered" <none@none.sn> wrote... I still don't understand, Anna, why I can't get Partition Magic to format larger than in the 150 gig range. Is it wounded or defective? As you know, Symantec bought it but never ever updated it. And, other competitive products seem to have similar problems, although I cannot personally vouch for any limits on partition size. Just for the record, how would I format a FAT32 partition on, say, a 500 gig external to over 150? I know and understand FDISK but am very skittish about it because a minor mistep can wipe out my primary. Yes, I am cautious, some would say overly cautious, but I've found in my 60 year life that it pays to not lead with my chin. Thanks for your comments. (SNIP) Incidently, do you have an opinion on my observation that FAT32 is much faster on read/writes than NTFS as well as far faster to just bring up a folder tree? For awhile, NTFS on my extended partitions (I have two) and my external were SO slow, many minutes to just get a tree, that I reformatted them as FAT32. For other reasons, primarily the need to store very large Acronis True Image image files, I was forced to go back to NTFS. It was as if a miracle had occurred. I've had little trouble since, although my Maxtor 300 gig with 2 NTFS partitions (I wanted 2 to separate the data on the drive logically) normally works fine, there ARE occasions when it'll go away for a minute or two trying to access one of the partitions in Explorer. Again, thanks for your observations. Am I correc that you are the same "Anna" that posted that excellent True Image tutorial some time back? Very nicely written and quite helpful. -- HP, aka Jerry Anna responds... Jerry:I honestly don't know why you're having trouble using the Partition Magic program (I assume you're using the 8.01 version) to create one or more FAT32 partitions. It's usually a very "cut & dried" procedure with PM. Although I have to admit it's been a very long time since we used that program to create large FAT32 partitions. In the event when we *do* find it necessary, we invariably use the FDISK & FORMAT commands from a DOS boot floppy disk or CD to create FAT32 partitions. As to formatting a FAT32 partition on your external 500 GB HDD... I'm assuming it's a USB external HDD, right? If so, you really won't be able to use the FDISK/FORMAT commands in that situation because of the USB interface. It will be necessary to install the disk as an *internal* HDD in your system and then boot to the DOS boot disk to invoke the FDISK/FORMATcommands. Then, of course, reinstall the disk back in its USB enclosure. Now, there *is* ostensibly a program that purports to format FAT32 partitions > 32 GB from *within* WinXP. It's a Linux-based program - the mkdosfs.exe program that you can download in ZIP format from... http://www.mager.org/mkdosfs/ Basically the process is to create the partition on your USB external HDD using the Disk Management utility in XP and format the > 32 GB partition in NTFS. Then use the mkdosfs.exe program which will be installed in your XP system to format that partition FAT32. We've used this program a number of times and for the most part it "worked". But I have to tell you that in a couple of cases we later ran into some data corruption issues which, while we couldn't definitively *prove* they were caused by the mkdosfs FAT32-formatting process, we were (and continue to be) uneasy about using the program again. So if you want to try out this program (it's a freebie) you may first want to experiment with it by testing with some non-critical data. But I would be cautious about using it without any reservations until you're confident of its validity. In any event, if you are able to uninstall the 500 GB HDD from its USB enclosure and then install it as an internal HDD in your XP system, I would go ahead and use the FDISK/FORMAT commands as indicated above. As you probably know it's a rather straightforward process and shouldn't cause you any difficulty. Just take your time and understand those commands' options before you start pressing keys as you go through the process. As to your questions re the differences between the FAT32 & NTFS file systems as to performance (speed of read/writes). I really can't conclude the FAT32 file system is faster in this regard. As I previously stated, unless the user has some special need to use the FAT32 file system because of some program/system compatibility issues, we strongly recommend employing the NTFS file system in an XP environment. And yes, I'm the very same "Anna" and thank you for your nice comment. I'm glad to hear you found those Acronis True Image step-by-step instructions helpful. I might mention in passing that we've actually been using another disk cloning program since earlier this year and we've been quite impressed with it. To the point where it's our disk-cloning program of choice and we prefer it over the ATI program. It's the Casper 4.0 program (http://www.fssdev.com). Perhaps you've come across a couple of my postings in which I extolled the virtues of this program and provided some details as to using it. It's certainly worth looking into. In this connection you might want to take a look at my post to this newsgroup of August 7 - the subject being "Re: needa good backup method or program". (BTW, I'm leaving for a two-month overseas assignment tomorrow morning and will not have access to this & other newsgroups during that time. I mention this only because I probably won't have an opportunity to respond to any further posts over the next few months.) Anna
Guest Ken Blake, MVP Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? On Wed, 15 Aug 2007 00:13:12 -0000, "HEMI-Powered" <none@none.sn> wrote: > philo added these comments in the current discussion du jour ... > > > That will work or else you can use 3rd party partitioning > > software as XP will recognize fat32 partitions over 32 > > gigs...(it just can't create them) > > There's still a limit on partition size. Please don't hold me to > this number, but it is in the range of 150 gig for any single > partitition. No, it's *much* greater than 150GB. The maximum FAT32 volume size is 2TB (2048GB)--greater than any hard drive available today. -- Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP Windows - Shell/User Please Reply to the Newsgroup
Guest Brightbelt Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? "M.I.5¾" wrote: > > "Brightbelt" <Brightbelt@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message > news:040E075F-4217-4666-A5CB-571EDECAFB66@microsoft.com... > > > > > > "Jim" wrote: > > > >> > >> "HEMI-Powered" <none@none.sn> wrote in message > >> news:Xns998CCD8ABF7CDReplyScoreID@216.168.3.30... > >> > =?Utf-8?B?QnJpZ2h0YmVsdA==?= added these comments in the current > >> > discussion du jour ... > >> > > >> >> Hi, > >> >> I'm trying to use my XP laptop to format a drive with FAT32 > >> >> so it will be > >> >> compatible with an Intel Mac. > >> >> > >> >> But when I right-click the drive and choose 'Format', NTFS is > >> >> the only choice there, like a default. > >> >> > >> >> Is there something I'm missing? How can I get it to format > >> >> with FAT32? > >> >> > >> >> I appreciate any assistance on this,....Frank B. > >> > > >> > I believe you need a 3rd party utility to format FAT32, e.g., > >> > Partition Magic or something like it. I don't think it was ever > >> > reasonable for MS to offer a format to what they perceive, rightly, > >> > is an obsolete system, far too limited in capacity for any one > >> > partition and virtually impossible to apply any semblence of > >> > security to. As always, just the opinion of an old fool, YMMV. > >> > > >> > -- > >> > HP, aka Jerry > >> Here is another one with the same opinion. > >> Jim > > > > In case anyone follows this thread to this length, what I ended up doing > > (after reading some Mac forums as well) was to have Mac format the drive > > (using Disk Utility) to MS-Dos. I read that the write rate is a lot faster > > for that format than Fat32. > > > > > There isn't actually a format called MS-DOS. I suspect that the Mac > formatted it to FAT32 or possibly even FAT16 (which is what MS-DOS actually > used). Yes, Thanks. I had a "Duh" moment when I looked at it again and saw (FAT32) in parentheses. ;) Thanks, Frank B.
Guest Tim Slattery Posted August 15, 2007 Posted August 15, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? > Incidently, do you have an opinion on my observation that FAT32 is much >faster on read/writes than NTFS as well as far faster to just bring up a >folder tree? I doubt there's much difference in reads and writes, once you have a file open. NTFS stores files within a directory in a Btree structure, while FAT32 simply has a sequential list. That means that it will be faster to get the entire list from the FAT-style directory, but it will be *lots* faster to find one file in a large NTFS directory. (And, of course, there's no limit on number of files in an NTFS directory.) -- Tim Slattery MS MVP(DTS) Slattery_T@bls.gov http://members.cox.net/slatteryt
Guest M.I.5¾ Posted August 16, 2007 Posted August 16, 2007 Re: Is FAT32 format gone? "Tim Slattery" <Slattery_T@bls.gov> wrote in message news:i996c3h6d0hrqi44bqh7ugjnslg7q01d9k@4ax.com... > "HEMI-Powered" <none@none.sn> wrote: > > >>OK, I stand/sit corrected; I did a quick 2^32 in Excel. So, why >>is it that PM won't format over abut 150 gig do you think? > > I think you'd have to ask Symantec that question. We've heard in this > newsgroup from people who have used FAT32 partitions larger than 150GB > (one poster reported a FAT32 partition of 300GB! Not for me, thanks), > so it's certainly possible to do. > Erm 400GB here.
Recommended Posts