Guest PCR Posted August 20, 2007 Posted August 20, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message news:1187618687.961616.264920@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com | On Aug 19, 12:12 pm, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: |> 1. He probably doesn't want the added expense of another HDD. Then |> again, sounds like he could use one. Drives are cheap, but I'd want |> one that's fairly small to avoid possible problems with the mobo |> supporting large drives. Might be hard to find, and the issues of |> incompatibility can be EXTREMELY frustrating. |> |> > Are C:\ & D:\ two partitions on a single master HDD on the Primary |> > IDE connector of the motherboard in the 98FE machine? And is the |> > CD drive connected as a master on the Secondary IDE connector of |> > the motherboard? That's the setup I had! So... a second option is |> > to connect a second HDD as a slave to the first & cut the |> > XP-machine out of the picture altogether! I have a master on how |> > to do that! Probably, when done, your D:partition will become |> > E:partition, if you elect to keep the second HDD permanently |> > installed. |> | | Those are both good suggestions, provided this was a desktop machine. | However, it's a lqptop. A very limited laptop. Thought I said that | early on. Sorry if I didn't, or it got buried. Yes, C: & D: are 2 GB | partitions on the one 4 GB HDD. Yea, I see you said "laptop"-- (& usually I do stay out of such threads! But, now that I'm here)... What is the CD-ROM plugged into? Can you unplug it temporarily & plug in a 2nd HDD? Do you have a floppy drive? Even without a floppy drive, it's possible BING can get the job done-- IF a 2nd HDD will work in the CD-ROM slot. This is the best way to avoid secret, irradiated XP-folders-- unless Terhune comes up with something involving LAN, USB or LPT ports! (But I know nothing about birthing babies or laptop computers!) | Being an older laptop, the HDD is buried under the keyboard, so | removing it to make an image isn't the simple loosen one screw and | slide it out, like my XP machine (also a lqptop), but that's the only | solution I could come up with, UNLESS, I could somehow use one of | those Internet-based storage sites as the recipient for the Ghost / | True Image output. Anyone know if that would work? | | Interesting MS discussion. -- Thanks or Good Luck, There may be humor in this post, and, Naturally, you will not sue, Should things get worse after this, PCR pcrrcp@netzero.net
Guest PCR Posted August 20, 2007 Posted August 20, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade "Curt Christianson" <curtchristnsn@NOSPAM.Yahoo.com> wrote in message news:OLeETeq4HHA.2108@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl | Us XP users *love* our secrets! Christianson! It's an early symptom of XP-irradiation poisoning for XP-users to love secret, irradiated folders & irradiated Recycle Bins! After a while, you will begin to reveal the secrets-- JUST as Terhune has done! | -- | HTH, | Curt | | Windows Support Center | http://www.aumha.org | Practically Nerded,... | http://dundats.mvps.org/Index.htm | | "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> wrote in message | news:%23M59Qhp4HHA.5740@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... || "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote in message || news:e0G$qTp4HHA.5804@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl ||| 1. He probably doesn't want the added expense of another HDD. Then ||| again, sounds like he could use one. Drives are cheap, but I'd want ||| one that's fairly small to avoid possible problems with the mobo ||| supporting large drives. Might be hard to find, and the issues of ||| incompatibility can be EXTREMELY frustrating. || || Understood. Still, Teflon may as well face those issues now-- & not || wait for the day an HDD crash puts his head through the ceiling! || ||| 2. Outside of using BING, he has no imaging app that will likely run ||| on the 98 machine, whether it's run from Windows or run from a ||| bootable CD. || || BING is good enough for it, then... || || http://www.bootitng.com/ 's BootIt NG, has a variety of backup || capabilities & works with all OS: Copy partition(s) to HDD, or Image || to HDD or to CD or DVD. Create, move, shrink or expand partitions || without data loss. Multi-boot too. To install & use beyond 30 days, || $34.95. || ||| My ideal solution would be another HD (one that's large enough to ||| hold images of C: and D:) and BING. Partition letters don't enter ||| into the equation, since the machine never needs to be booted with ||| the disk connected. But Teflon sounds like he has a decent plan, ||| already. || || I guess his plan is a good one, except he'll need that 2nd HDD some || day anyhow. And there is the caveat you did bring up about booting || XP & the secret folders it may create. || ||| -- ||| Gary S. Terhune ||| MS-MVP Shell/User ||| http://www.grystmill.com ||| ||| "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> wrote in message ||| news:%23AL0YGp4HHA.5852@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... |||> "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message |||> news:1187537643.175079.269170@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com |||> | On Aug 18, 9:56 pm, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: |||> |> Same applies to Ghost (more so -- I doubt any recent version of |||> |> Ghost will run on Win98, period.) Maybe OP already has a legacy |||> |> copy. However, OP is using a newer XP machine to do the task. If |||> |> the imaging app needs to run on the Win98 machine, then I'd |||> |> recommend BootIt NG. |||> | |||> | Being referred to as OP always makes me think I'm Ron Howard on |||> | Mayberry RFD with Andy Griffith (don't I wish). |||> | |||> | Anyway, thanks for your input. I'm not going to try running |||> | Ghost or True Image on the 98FE machine. Since the machine only |||> | has a CD ROM drive, and I can't connect an external HDD or DVD |||> | burner to that machine, plus the partitioned internal HDD's D: |||> | drive is full, the only option I saw to get an 'image / clone' |||> | (always got those two confused) of the C: drive was to remove it |||> | and use my XP machine's more robust facilities to create that |||> | image for backup (fall-back) purposes. |||> |||> Are C:\ & D:\ two partitions on a single master HDD on the Primary |||> IDE connector of the motherboard in the 98FE machine? And is the CD |||> drive connected as a master on the Secondary IDE connector of the |||> motherboard? That's the setup I had! So... a second option is to |||> connect a second HDD as a slave to the first & cut the XP-machine |||> out of the picture altogether! I have a master on how to do that! |||> Probably, when done, your D:partition will become E:partition, if |||> you elect to keep the second HDD permanently installed. |||> |||> | I do have both Ghost and True Image, so will try both to create |||> | an image on the external HDD, then burn them to DVD. Will have |||> | to transfer to several CD's if I do need to fall-back, since the |||> | 98 machine only has CD ROM and floppy drives. Would multiple |||> | CD's be a problem? |||> | |||> | Thanks again for your comments and suggestions. |||> | |||> | One other question, could I install SE over FE and save the |||> | effort of reapplying all the MS fixes and reinstalling all the |||> | apps? Probably not, or someone probably would have suggested |||> | that. |||> | |||> | Some may consider that to be a really dumb question, but I've |||> | found the only really dumb question is the one that isn't asked. |||> |||> -- |||> Thanks or Good Luck, |||> There may be humor in this post, and, |||> Naturally, you will not sue, |||> Should things get worse after this, |||> PCR |||> pcrrcp@netzero.net || || -- || Thanks or Good Luck, || There may be humor in this post, and, || Naturally, you will not sue, || Should things get worse after this, || PCR || pcrrcp@netzero.net -- Thanks or Good Luck, There may be humor in this post, and, Naturally, you will not sue, Should things get worse after this, PCR pcrrcp@netzero.net
Guest Gary S. Terhune Posted August 20, 2007 Posted August 20, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade You can run BING from a CD. TI and NG might also have that capability. But you need some place to put the image. -- Gary S. Terhune MS-MVP Shell/User http://www.grystmill.com "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> wrote in message news:ei9BGk24HHA.1208@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... > "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message > news:1187618687.961616.264920@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com > | On Aug 19, 12:12 pm, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: > |> 1. He probably doesn't want the added expense of another HDD. Then > |> again, sounds like he could use one. Drives are cheap, but I'd want > |> one that's fairly small to avoid possible problems with the mobo > |> supporting large drives. Might be hard to find, and the issues of > |> incompatibility can be EXTREMELY frustrating. > |> > |> > Are C:\ & D:\ two partitions on a single master HDD on the Primary > |> > IDE connector of the motherboard in the 98FE machine? And is the > |> > CD drive connected as a master on the Secondary IDE connector of > |> > the motherboard? That's the setup I had! So... a second option is > |> > to connect a second HDD as a slave to the first & cut the > |> > XP-machine out of the picture altogether! I have a master on how > |> > to do that! Probably, when done, your D:partition will become > |> > E:partition, if you elect to keep the second HDD permanently > |> > installed. > |> > | > | Those are both good suggestions, provided this was a desktop machine. > | However, it's a lqptop. A very limited laptop. Thought I said that > | early on. Sorry if I didn't, or it got buried. Yes, C: & D: are 2 GB > | partitions on the one 4 GB HDD. > > Yea, I see you said "laptop"-- (& usually I do stay out of such threads! > But, now that I'm here)... > > What is the CD-ROM plugged into? Can you unplug it temporarily & plug in > a 2nd HDD? Do you have a floppy drive? Even without a floppy drive, it's > possible BING can get the job done-- IF a 2nd HDD will work in the > CD-ROM slot. This is the best way to avoid secret, irradiated > XP-folders-- unless Terhune comes up with something involving LAN, USB > or LPT ports! > > (But I know nothing about birthing babies or laptop computers!) > > | Being an older laptop, the HDD is buried under the keyboard, so > | removing it to make an image isn't the simple loosen one screw and > | slide it out, like my XP machine (also a lqptop), but that's the only > | solution I could come up with, UNLESS, I could somehow use one of > | those Internet-based storage sites as the recipient for the Ghost / > | True Image output. Anyone know if that would work? > | > | Interesting MS discussion. > > -- > Thanks or Good Luck, > There may be humor in this post, and, > Naturally, you will not sue, > Should things get worse after this, > PCR > pcrrcp@netzero.net > >
Guest PCR Posted August 20, 2007 Posted August 20, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade "Dan" <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message news:095127BA-8FAF-4D3F-8095-CC4D1D45A0C9@microsoft.com | The question that I ask is if you reveal all files in XP Professional | does it really reveal all the files or still keep some secret. Looks like Terhune's lips are loose enough now to reveal the full truth. I'll leave it to him! | I | have heard with 98SE when you reveal all the files then it actually | reveals them. It isn't like XP! Nothing is irradiated! BUT... I have found this Registry key in Win98, named "ShowSuperHidden"... You know, this will allow one to see in Explorer all files that have the Hidden attribute... "START, Settings, Folder Options, View tab", & bolt "Show all files"; may as well uncheck "Hide file extensions..." too. To know whether a file has that attribute, R-Clk it in Explorer, & select "Properties". Alternatively... HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer\Adv anced ShowAttribCol 0x00000001 (1) <<--DWORD. Value data: 1 ShowSuperHidden 0x00000001 (1) <<--DWORD: 1 PersistBrowsers 0x00000001 (1) <<--DWORD: 1 ShowAttribCol See Attributes listed in Explorer ShowSuperHidden Well, I think I saw my first .htt after setting that. PersistBrowsers An open folder will remain open after a reboot. "ShowAttribCol" has no space in it's name, although it seems that way with this font. (None of them do.) Type a "1" in "Value Data". It won't look like a simple "1" in the right pane. If the column doesn't appear immediately in Explorer, then re-boot. 1. "START button, Run"; Type "RegEdit" & Enter. 2. Click the plus (+) signs in the left pane starting at "HKEY_CURRENT_USER" & ending at "Explorer". 3. Finally, click the key "Advanced" in the left pane. 4. In the right pane, R-Clk an empty area; point to "new"; select "Dword value"; type or paste "ShowAttribCol" & Enter. 5. R-Clk "ShowAttribCol"; select "Modify", enter "1" in Value Data, & click OK. 6. Do the other two, as desired, from step (4). 7. Close RegEdit & reboot, if it doesn't already show in Explorer. | I still see 98SE and the 9x source code as being the | superior source code in terms of compatibility and working with APS | has shown me how APS still needs and uses old 98SE computers for all | of their older software that has cost too much to get rid of. Uhuh. Stick with it, until the day it crumbles to dust! | Now if | Microsoft would only listen to me and realize they made a mistake by | elimating the 9x line then maybe things would be better. Absolutely-- & some day we must storm the castle at Redmond or some other secret, irradiated city! A few more bolts of XP-irradiation-- & Terhune or Christianson may reveal where that is! | I am now | using Millenium at work and it is not terrible. It is stupid that | Microsoft removed the easy access to MS-DOS from Millenium. In | addition, some of the tabing issues and style issues of ME irritate | me. I may just have to format the ME machine and install 98 Second | Edition on it. I hope Win98 drivers will exist for all the peripherials! | I already have some valid and legal copies of 98 | Second Edition and could always buy more on Ebay if it becomes | necessary. Heck, I think 98 SE still has some life in it left | despite the fact that support was elimated by Microsoft on July 11, | 2006. It WILL live, until our fingers fall through mush or dust & break on a solid, wooden desktop! | 98SE is still a killer operating system in my opinion and the | best operating system Microsoft has to offer. Yea! | XP Professional would | be my second choice after 98SE with Microsoft operating systems. I don't know. I have no opinion yet on what's 2nd best. Seems doubtful it could be XP, though! | | "PCR" wrote: | |> "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote in message |> news:e0G$qTp4HHA.5804@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl |> | 1. He probably doesn't want the added expense of another HDD. Then |> | again, sounds like he could use one. Drives are cheap, but I'd want |> | one that's fairly small to avoid possible problems with the mobo |> | supporting large drives. Might be hard to find, and the issues of |> | incompatibility can be EXTREMELY frustrating. |> |> Understood. Still, Teflon may as well face those issues now-- & not |> wait for the day an HDD crash puts his head through the ceiling! |> |> | 2. Outside of using BING, he has no imaging app that will likely |> | run on the 98 machine, whether it's run from Windows or run from a |> | bootable CD. |> |> BING is good enough for it, then... |> |> http://www.bootitng.com/ 's BootIt NG, has a variety of backup |> capabilities & works with all OS: Copy partition(s) to HDD, or Image |> to HDD or to CD or DVD. Create, move, shrink or expand partitions |> without data loss. Multi-boot too. To install & use beyond 30 days, |> $34.95. |> |> | My ideal solution would be another HD (one that's large enough to |> | hold images of C: and D:) and BING. Partition letters don't enter |> | into the equation, since the machine never needs to be booted with |> | the disk connected. But Teflon sounds like he has a decent plan, |> | already. |> |> I guess his plan is a good one, except he'll need that 2nd HDD some |> day anyhow. And there is the caveat you did bring up about booting |> XP & the secret folders it may create. |> |> | -- |> | Gary S. Terhune |> | MS-MVP Shell/User |> | http://www.grystmill.com |> | |> | "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> wrote in message |> | news:%23AL0YGp4HHA.5852@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... |> |> "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message |> |> news:1187537643.175079.269170@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com |> |> | On Aug 18, 9:56 pm, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: |> |> |> Same applies to Ghost (more so -- I doubt any recent version of |> |> |> Ghost will run on Win98, period.) Maybe OP already has a legacy |> |> |> copy. However, OP is using a newer XP machine to do the task. |> |> |> If the imaging app needs to run on the Win98 machine, then I'd |> |> |> recommend BootIt NG. |> |> | |> |> | Being referred to as OP always makes me think I'm Ron Howard on |> |> | Mayberry RFD with Andy Griffith (don't I wish). |> |> | |> |> | Anyway, thanks for your input. I'm not going to try running |> |> | Ghost or True Image on the 98FE machine. Since the machine only |> |> | has a CD ROM drive, and I can't connect an external HDD or DVD |> |> | burner to that machine, plus the partitioned internal HDD's D: |> |> | drive is full, the only option I saw to get an 'image / clone' |> |> | (always got those two confused) of the C: drive was to remove |> |> | it and use my XP machine's more robust facilities to create |> |> | that image for backup (fall-back) purposes. |> |> |> |> Are C:\ & D:\ two partitions on a single master HDD on the Primary |> |> IDE connector of the motherboard in the 98FE machine? And is the |> |> CD drive connected as a master on the Secondary IDE connector of |> |> the motherboard? That's the setup I had! So... a second option is |> |> to connect a second HDD as a slave to the first & cut the |> |> XP-machine out of the picture altogether! I have a master on how |> |> to do that! Probably, when done, your D:partition will become |> |> E:partition, if you elect to keep the second HDD permanently |> |> installed. |> |> |> |> | I do have both Ghost and True Image, so will try both to create |> |> | an image on the external HDD, then burn them to DVD. Will have |> |> | to transfer to several CD's if I do need to fall-back, since |> |> | the 98 machine only has CD ROM and floppy drives. Would |> |> | multiple CD's be a problem? |> |> | |> |> | Thanks again for your comments and suggestions. |> |> | |> |> | One other question, could I install SE over FE and save the |> |> | effort of reapplying all the MS fixes and reinstalling all the |> |> | apps? Probably not, or someone probably would have suggested |> |> | that. |> |> | |> |> | Some may consider that to be a really dumb question, but I've |> |> | found the only really dumb question is the one that isn't asked. |> |> |> |> -- |> |> Thanks or Good Luck, |> |> There may be humor in this post, and, |> |> Naturally, you will not sue, |> |> Should things get worse after this, |> |> PCR |> |> pcrrcp@netzero.net |> |> -- |> Thanks or Good Luck, |> There may be humor in this post, and, |> Naturally, you will not sue, |> Should things get worse after this, |> PCR |> pcrrcp@netzero.net -- Thanks or Good Luck, There may be humor in this post, and, Naturally, you will not sue, Should things get worse after this, PCR pcrrcp@netzero.net
Guest PCR Posted August 20, 2007 Posted August 20, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote in message news:u4PEO224HHA.5724@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl | You can run BING from a CD. TI and NG might also have that | capability. But you need some place to put the image. That is the rub, as you know Hamlet did say. I'm thinking, Teflon can run BING from a floppy or install it to the current HDD. Then -- if a 2nd HDD can function in place of the CD-ROM (I don't know)-- Teflon can make his copy to that. | -- | Gary S. Terhune | MS-MVP Shell/User | http://www.grystmill.com | | "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> wrote in message | news:ei9BGk24HHA.1208@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... |> "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message |> news:1187618687.961616.264920@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com |> | On Aug 19, 12:12 pm, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: |> |> 1. He probably doesn't want the added expense of another HDD. Then |> |> again, sounds like he could use one. Drives are cheap, but I'd |> |> want one that's fairly small to avoid possible problems with the |> |> mobo supporting large drives. Might be hard to find, and the |> |> issues of incompatibility can be EXTREMELY frustrating. |> |> |> |> > Are C:\ & D:\ two partitions on a single master HDD on the |> |> > Primary IDE connector of the motherboard in the 98FE machine? |> |> > And is the CD drive connected as a master on the Secondary IDE |> |> > connector of the motherboard? That's the setup I had! So... a |> |> > second option is to connect a second HDD as a slave to the |> |> > first & cut the XP-machine out of the picture altogether! I |> |> > have a master on how to do that! Probably, when done, your |> |> > D:partition will become E:partition, if you elect to keep the |> |> > second HDD permanently installed. |> |> |> | |> | Those are both good suggestions, provided this was a desktop |> | machine. However, it's a lqptop. A very limited laptop. Thought |> | I said that early on. Sorry if I didn't, or it got buried. Yes, |> | C: & D: are 2 GB partitions on the one 4 GB HDD. |> |> Yea, I see you said "laptop"-- (& usually I do stay out of such |> threads! But, now that I'm here)... |> |> What is the CD-ROM plugged into? Can you unplug it temporarily & |> plug in a 2nd HDD? Do you have a floppy drive? Even without a floppy |> drive, it's possible BING can get the job done-- IF a 2nd HDD will |> work in the CD-ROM slot. This is the best way to avoid secret, |> irradiated XP-folders-- unless Terhune comes up with something |> involving LAN, USB or LPT ports! |> |> (But I know nothing about birthing babies or laptop computers!) |> |> | Being an older laptop, the HDD is buried under the keyboard, so |> | removing it to make an image isn't the simple loosen one screw and |> | slide it out, like my XP machine (also a lqptop), but that's the |> | only solution I could come up with, UNLESS, I could somehow use |> | one of those Internet-based storage sites as the recipient for the |> | Ghost / True Image output. Anyone know if that would work? |> | |> | Interesting MS discussion. |> |> -- |> Thanks or Good Luck, |> There may be humor in this post, and, |> Naturally, you will not sue, |> Should things get worse after this, |> PCR |> pcrrcp@netzero.net -- Thanks or Good Luck, There may be humor in this post, and, Naturally, you will not sue, Should things get worse after this, PCR pcrrcp@netzero.net
Guest MEB Posted August 21, 2007 Posted August 21, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote in message news:eYJCh604HHA.5852@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... | OK... Sounds to me like the same thing True Image, Ghost, or even BING are | capable of. They do not include empty clusters in their images unless you | tell them to. (Well, I don't know about Ghost, but that's the case for the | other two.) They can span several CDs or DVDs, as well. You just have to | have a CD (or DVD) burner attached. | | -- | Gary S. Terhune | MS-MVP Shell/User | http://www.grystmill.com Right, same style with partition saving, just the sectors being used. Like I said, for free, , , , works pretty good. No need to use Bing and feel like you should actually pay for the program. [Of course you don't get the boot manager / MBR / partition tool like Bing though.] So as an easily downloaded program, here's another option for Teflon, and others in need. Makes me wonder how long this prog will be free. Apparently works with XP and VISTA as well. -- MEB http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com ________ | | "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message | news:uxnl2e04HHA.5316@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... | > | > | > "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote in message | > news:uakuhnu4HHA.5880@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... | > | Sounds really complicated, MEB, <s>. | > | | > | -- | > | Gary S. Terhune | > | MS-MVP Shell/User | > | http://www.grystmill.com | > | > Ah, not really, its actually rather simple, and easily accomplished. But | > then I have done this before with small hard drives on laptops and | > desktops. | > The prog basicly sets up the method for you, assigning consecutive CD | > images. Burn them to disk, use the DOS disk [with CDROM support] to boot | > after you've done what you need, and put the images back on the disk. When | > done run scandisk to reset the disk, boot to Safe Mode just to check the | > disk and files, boot normally and its done. | > | > If the second partition contains nothing more than storage, its even | > easier. Though even then, one need only save the storage area first, burn | > it | > and then remove it to free space for the actual system files/images. | > | > Remember we have to always consider that others may not have extra disks | > just laying around to use, or a networked computer to transfer the files | > to. | > This happens to be a relatively easy way for the normal user to accomplish | > the task without extra hardware or the need to purchase some program. | > | > Of course some of the other imaging progs provide the same basic | > abilities, | > but for a free DOS disk ONLY program, partition saving [partsav] seems to | > work quite well. | > | > | > | | > | "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message | > | news:ujDHfYu4HHA.1484@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl... | > | > | > | > "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote in message | > | > news:e0G$qTp4HHA.5804@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... | > | > | 1. He probably doesn't want the added expense of another HDD. Then | > | > again, | > | > | sounds like he could use one. Drives are cheap, but I'd want one | > that's | > | > | fairly small to avoid possible problems with the mobo supporting | > large | > | > | drives. Might be hard to find, and the issues of incompatibility can | > be | > | > | EXTREMELY frustrating. | > | > | | > | > | 2. Outside of using BING, he has no imaging app that will likely run | > on | > | > the | > | > | 98 machine, whether it's run from Windows or run from a bootable CD. | > | > | | > | > | My ideal solution would be another HD (one that's large enough to | > hold | > | > | images of C: and D:) and BING. Partition letters don't enter into | > the | > | > | equation, since the machine never needs to be booted with the disk | > | > | connected. But Teflon sounds like he has a decent plan, already. | > | > | | > | > | -- | > | > | Gary S. Terhune | > | > | MS-MVP Shell/User | > | > | http://www.grystmill.com | > | > | | > | > | > | > | > | > Excuse the interruption, and not following down through the extremely | > long | > | > thread: | > | > | > | > One could also use a free program called partition saving, which also | > | > happens to be its web link | > | > Simple DOS based, saves only the used portions OR whatever | > | > portions/elements | > | > you want, Can cut the partition into CDROM sized segments.. | > | > | > | > http://www.partition-saving.com | > | > | > | > The one issue might be the external hard drive used for saving the | > | > partition. Saves the potential issues with XP connection. | > | > | > | > Though, with careful usage, one could save parts of the partition, | > burn | > to | > | > CDROM, delete those parts freeing space for the main program areas and | > | > system. Then burning those to disk, before doing whatever needs done. | > | > | > | > -- | > | > MEB | > | > http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com | > | > ________ | > | > | > | > -- | > MEB | > http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com | > ________ | > | > | > | |
Guest Dan Posted August 25, 2007 Posted August 25, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade I think 98SE is really stable if the user knows how to configure it properly and what they are doing. The only issue may be poor drivers that can be written for some of the hardware that I have run into. Another issue may be problems with dlls if they get very mixed up but it really is more stable than people give it credit in my opinion. "philo" wrote: > > "Dan" <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message > news:0EC79EC6-012E-4BCE-8E64-32FBA1D728A9@microsoft.com... > > Remember philo that each operating system has its own uses. Windows 2000 > is > > much more business orientated and centered around NT technology as > compared > > to Windows 98 Second Edition which is consumer orientated and based on 9x > > technology although it was a big hit with businesses also much to the > > surprise of Microsoft. This is a key in realizing why there is still so > much > > potential to the 9x source code. I hope eventually a combination product > or > > perhaps another 9x product will come out to the marketplace. I am working > on > > this but it will most likely take years to see the light of day if it > happens > > at all. > > > > True Win98 and Win2k are two entirely different operating systems...but > because the use essentially the same GUI... > anyone who can use win98 should have no problems using Win2k. > > Though, through the years I've upgraded my hardware...I eventually switched > , for the most part, to Win2k simply because it's more stable than > win98...however I never wanted to give up win98 entirely as some of the > older apps and dos apps run better on win98 for sure. > > With my last hardware upgrade...win98 did not survive. I could not get it to > work with my new equipment. > What I did was to clone it to another drive...then put that into an AMD-550 > that has removable drive kits installed. > In a short time I had my old win98 again up and running. Because of the > removable drive kits I must have about 20 old operating systems saved... > going back to win3x, OS2, NT3.5 etc. > > >
Guest Dan Posted August 25, 2007 Posted August 25, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade Thanks! "Gary S. Terhune" wrote: > I don't know what you mean, "how" did I subscribe to MSDN. I subscribed, > period. No, MS does not offer the 98 to 98SE UPDATE CD anymore. You'd have > to look around and find someone who has it and make a copy. > > -- > Gary S. Terhune > MS-MVP Shell/User > http://www.grystmill.com > > "Dan" <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message > news:B2160DDA-9EEC-47FC-9E76-492A7AF970FF@microsoft.com... > > <snipped for length concerns> > > > > Hey Gary, I am a technet subscriber and have considered becoming a technet > > plus subscriber. Is it honesty worth $500? BTW, what did you do to > > become a > > MSDN subscriber and what does that offer? In addition, I still have my 98 > > update cd that has come in very handy to upgrade 98 Second Edition to the > > B > > version from the A version. I actually ended up with 2 copies due to a > > glitch, I think. I ordered one as Dan and another as Daniel and got 2 > > copies. I ordered a second time because I thought the first order got > > lost > > and figured requesting a 2 copy would be the easiest way to make sure I > > got > > the cd. Do you know if Microsoft offers that cd anymore for people like > > the > > OP that could make it easier to update 98 S.E. to Internet Explorer 6 to > > allow for use with Windows Update. You also get WMP 9 whether you want it > > or > > not. I have never had too much of an issue with WMP 9, personally. > > Thanks > > in advance for the replies. > > >
Guest Dan Posted August 25, 2007 Posted August 25, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade The movie was Sneakers. "Curt Christianson" wrote: > I don't remember too much from the 1980's Dan. I think I was in the midst > of a decade-long blackout. > > -- > HTH, > Curt > > Windows Support Center > http://www.aumha.org > Practically Nerded,... > http://dundats.mvps.org/Index.htm > > "Dan" <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message > news:3B9514A1-E2E4-40B1-A909-BB7FCE80BED5@microsoft.com... > | Now, now we can't have "too many secrets" now can we. Anyone catch the > movie > | reference between the quotes. Hint it is an older movie and I think it is > | from the 1980's. > | > | "Curt Christianson" wrote: > | > | > Us XP users *love* our secrets! > | > > | > -- > | > HTH, > | > Curt > | > > | > Windows Support Center > | > http://www.aumha.org > | > Practically Nerded,... > | > http://dundats.mvps.org/Index.htm > | > > | > "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> wrote in message > | > news:%23M59Qhp4HHA.5740@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... > | > | "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote in message > | > | news:e0G$qTp4HHA.5804@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl > | > || 1. He probably doesn't want the added expense of another HDD. Then > | > || again, sounds like he could use one. Drives are cheap, but I'd want > | > || one that's fairly small to avoid possible problems with the mobo > | > || supporting large drives. Might be hard to find, and the issues of > | > || incompatibility can be EXTREMELY frustrating. > | > | > | > | Understood. Still, Teflon may as well face those issues now-- & not > wait > | > | for the day an HDD crash puts his head through the ceiling! > | > | > | > || 2. Outside of using BING, he has no imaging app that will likely run > | > || on the 98 machine, whether it's run from Windows or run from a > | > || bootable CD. > | > | > | > | BING is good enough for it, then... > | > | > | > | http://www.bootitng.com/ 's BootIt NG, has a variety of backup > | > | capabilities & works with all OS: Copy partition(s) to HDD, or Image > to > | > | HDD or to CD or DVD. Create, move, shrink or expand partitions without > | > | data loss. Multi-boot too. To install & use beyond 30 days, $34.95. > | > | > | > || My ideal solution would be another HD (one that's large enough to > hold > | > || images of C: and D:) and BING. Partition letters don't enter into the > | > || equation, since the machine never needs to be booted with the disk > | > || connected. But Teflon sounds like he has a decent plan, already. > | > | > | > | I guess his plan is a good one, except he'll need that 2nd HDD some > day > | > | anyhow. And there is the caveat you did bring up about booting XP & > the > | > | secret folders it may create. > | > | > | > || -- > | > || Gary S. Terhune > | > || MS-MVP Shell/User > | > || http://www.grystmill.com > | > || > | > || "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> wrote in message > | > || news:%23AL0YGp4HHA.5852@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... > | > ||> "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message > | > ||> news:1187537643.175079.269170@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com > | > ||> | On Aug 18, 9:56 pm, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: > | > ||> |> Same applies to Ghost (more so -- I doubt any recent version of > | > ||> |> Ghost will run on Win98, period.) Maybe OP already has a legacy > | > ||> |> copy. However, OP is using a newer XP machine to do the task. If > | > ||> |> the imaging app needs to run on the Win98 machine, then I'd > | > ||> |> recommend BootIt NG. > | > ||> | > | > ||> | Being referred to as OP always makes me think I'm Ron Howard on > | > ||> | Mayberry RFD with Andy Griffith (don't I wish). > | > ||> | > | > ||> | Anyway, thanks for your input. I'm not going to try running Ghost > | > ||> | or True Image on the 98FE machine. Since the machine only has a CD > | > ||> | ROM drive, and I can't connect an external HDD or DVD burner to > | > ||> | that machine, plus the partitioned internal HDD's D: drive is > | > ||> | full, the only option I saw to get an 'image / clone' (always got > | > ||> | those two confused) of the C: drive was to remove it and use my XP > | > ||> | machine's more robust facilities to create that image for backup > | > ||> | (fall-back) purposes. > | > ||> > | > ||> Are C:\ & D:\ two partitions on a single master HDD on the Primary > | > ||> IDE connector of the motherboard in the 98FE machine? And is the CD > | > ||> drive connected as a master on the Secondary IDE connector of the > | > ||> motherboard? That's the setup I had! So... a second option is to > | > ||> connect a second HDD as a slave to the first & cut the XP-machine > | > ||> out of the picture altogether! I have a master on how to do that! > | > ||> Probably, when done, your D:partition will become E:partition, if > | > ||> you elect to keep the second HDD permanently installed. > | > ||> > | > ||> | I do have both Ghost and True Image, so will try both to create an > | > ||> | image on the external HDD, then burn them to DVD. Will have to > | > ||> | transfer to several CD's if I do need to fall-back, since the 98 > | > ||> | machine only has CD ROM and floppy drives. Would multiple CD's be > | > ||> | a problem? > | > ||> | > | > ||> | Thanks again for your comments and suggestions. > | > ||> | > | > ||> | One other question, could I install SE over FE and save the effort > | > ||> | of reapplying all the MS fixes and reinstalling all the apps? > | > ||> | Probably not, or someone probably would have suggested that. > | > ||> | > | > ||> | Some may consider that to be a really dumb question, but I've > found > | > ||> | the only really dumb question is the one that isn't asked. > | > ||> > | > ||> -- > | > ||> Thanks or Good Luck, > | > ||> There may be humor in this post, and, > | > ||> Naturally, you will not sue, > | > ||> Should things get worse after this, > | > ||> PCR > | > ||> pcrrcp@netzero.net > | > | > | > | -- > | > | Thanks or Good Luck, > | > | There may be humor in this post, and, > | > | Naturally, you will not sue, > | > | Should things get worse after this, > | > | PCR > | > | pcrrcp@netzero.net > | > | > | > | > | > > | > > | > > > >
Guest Dan Posted August 25, 2007 Posted August 25, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade Thanks for your input Gary. "Gary S. Terhune" wrote: > XP has three possible settings. Hide Hidden files, show Hidden files, and > show "super-hidden" files (Protected Operating System files). I leave that > last turned of because it makes a lot of things more inconvenient. They > often can't be moved or deleted and that makes mass file operations a pain.. > > As for XP vs 9x, or the prospects of a new 9x... You realize that you're > beating a dead horse, right? Ain't never going to happen unless MS for some > reason gives away the patent on the 9x kernel and someone else does it. > Writing endless paragraphs about it is not going to change the facts (and > will prompt me to start ignoring your posts again). You could bury MS in > suggestion/complaint letters and it still would never happen. It's like > asking Ford to bring back the Econoline. Never going to happen. Get over it. > > -- > Gary S. Terhune > MS-MVP Shell/User > http://www.grystmill.com > > "Dan" <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message > news:095127BA-8FAF-4D3F-8095-CC4D1D45A0C9@microsoft.com... > > The question that I ask is if you reveal all files in XP Professional does > > it > > really reveal all the files or still keep some secret. I have heard with > > 98SE when you reveal all the files then it actually reveals them. I still > > see 98SE and the 9x source code as being the superior source code in terms > > of > > compatibility and working with APS has shown me how APS still needs and > > uses > > old 98SE computers for all of their older software that has cost too much > > to > > get rid of. Now if Microsoft would only listen to me and realize they > > made a > > mistake by elimating the 9x line then maybe things would be better. I am > > now > > using Millenium at work and it is not terrible. It is stupid that > > Microsoft > > removed the easy access to MS-DOS from Millenium. In addition, some of > > the > > tabing issues and style issues of ME irritate me. I may just have to > > format > > the ME machine and install 98 Second Edition on it. I already have some > > valid and legal copies of 98 Second Edition and could always buy more on > > Ebay > > if it becomes necessary. Heck, I think 98 SE still has some life in it > > left > > despite the fact that support was elimated by Microsoft on July 11, 2006. > > 98SE is still a killer operating system in my opinion and the best > > operating > > system Microsoft has to offer. XP Professional would be my second choice > > after 98SE with Microsoft operating systems. > > > > "PCR" wrote: > > > >> "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote in message > >> news:e0G$qTp4HHA.5804@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl > >> | 1. He probably doesn't want the added expense of another HDD. Then > >> | again, sounds like he could use one. Drives are cheap, but I'd want > >> | one that's fairly small to avoid possible problems with the mobo > >> | supporting large drives. Might be hard to find, and the issues of > >> | incompatibility can be EXTREMELY frustrating. > >> > >> Understood. Still, Teflon may as well face those issues now-- & not wait > >> for the day an HDD crash puts his head through the ceiling! > >> > >> | 2. Outside of using BING, he has no imaging app that will likely run > >> | on the 98 machine, whether it's run from Windows or run from a > >> | bootable CD. > >> > >> BING is good enough for it, then... > >> > >> http://www.bootitng.com/ 's BootIt NG, has a variety of backup > >> capabilities & works with all OS: Copy partition(s) to HDD, or Image to > >> HDD or to CD or DVD. Create, move, shrink or expand partitions without > >> data loss. Multi-boot too. To install & use beyond 30 days, $34.95. > >> > >> | My ideal solution would be another HD (one that's large enough to hold > >> | images of C: and D:) and BING. Partition letters don't enter into the > >> | equation, since the machine never needs to be booted with the disk > >> | connected. But Teflon sounds like he has a decent plan, already. > >> > >> I guess his plan is a good one, except he'll need that 2nd HDD some day > >> anyhow. And there is the caveat you did bring up about booting XP & the > >> secret folders it may create. > >> > >> | -- > >> | Gary S. Terhune > >> | MS-MVP Shell/User > >> | http://www.grystmill.com > >> | > >> | "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> wrote in message > >> | news:%23AL0YGp4HHA.5852@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... > >> |> "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message > >> |> news:1187537643.175079.269170@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com > >> |> | On Aug 18, 9:56 pm, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: > >> |> |> Same applies to Ghost (more so -- I doubt any recent version of > >> |> |> Ghost will run on Win98, period.) Maybe OP already has a legacy > >> |> |> copy. However, OP is using a newer XP machine to do the task. If > >> |> |> the imaging app needs to run on the Win98 machine, then I'd > >> |> |> recommend BootIt NG. > >> |> | > >> |> | Being referred to as OP always makes me think I'm Ron Howard on > >> |> | Mayberry RFD with Andy Griffith (don't I wish). > >> |> | > >> |> | Anyway, thanks for your input. I'm not going to try running Ghost > >> |> | or True Image on the 98FE machine. Since the machine only has a CD > >> |> | ROM drive, and I can't connect an external HDD or DVD burner to > >> |> | that machine, plus the partitioned internal HDD's D: drive is > >> |> | full, the only option I saw to get an 'image / clone' (always got > >> |> | those two confused) of the C: drive was to remove it and use my XP > >> |> | machine's more robust facilities to create that image for backup > >> |> | (fall-back) purposes. > >> |> > >> |> Are C:\ & D:\ two partitions on a single master HDD on the Primary > >> |> IDE connector of the motherboard in the 98FE machine? And is the CD > >> |> drive connected as a master on the Secondary IDE connector of the > >> |> motherboard? That's the setup I had! So... a second option is to > >> |> connect a second HDD as a slave to the first & cut the XP-machine > >> |> out of the picture altogether! I have a master on how to do that! > >> |> Probably, when done, your D:partition will become E:partition, if > >> |> you elect to keep the second HDD permanently installed. > >> |> > >> |> | I do have both Ghost and True Image, so will try both to create an > >> |> | image on the external HDD, then burn them to DVD. Will have to > >> |> | transfer to several CD's if I do need to fall-back, since the 98 > >> |> | machine only has CD ROM and floppy drives. Would multiple CD's be > >> |> | a problem? > >> |> | > >> |> | Thanks again for your comments and suggestions. > >> |> | > >> |> | One other question, could I install SE over FE and save the effort > >> |> | of reapplying all the MS fixes and reinstalling all the apps? > >> |> | Probably not, or someone probably would have suggested that. > >> |> | > >> |> | Some may consider that to be a really dumb question, but I've found > >> |> | the only really dumb question is the one that isn't asked. > >> |> > >> |> -- > >> |> Thanks or Good Luck, > >> |> There may be humor in this post, and, > >> |> Naturally, you will not sue, > >> |> Should things get worse after this, > >> |> PCR > >> |> pcrrcp@netzero.net > >> > >> -- > >> Thanks or Good Luck, > >> There may be humor in this post, and, > >> Naturally, you will not sue, > >> Should things get worse after this, > >> PCR > >> pcrrcp@netzero.net > >> > >> > >> > > >
Guest Dan Posted August 25, 2007 Posted August 25, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade Wow, did you do anything special to allow for that set up? "98 Guy" wrote: > Dan wrote: > > > I have heard a controller card can allow the OP to get around > > this barrier but I have not tried it myself. > > Win-98 works fine on a 500 gb SATA hard drive (the largest drive I've > tried so far). >
Guest Teflon Posted August 25, 2007 Posted August 25, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade On Aug 20, 9:22 am, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: > I wouldn't trust an internet backup solution. If you had the disk space, you > could make an image and then store that on the internet, but any scheme that > has the backup writing directly to the remote server is almost bound to > fail, and would take a long, long time. It's the slowest and least reliable > of all the solutions thus far, and I don't think either True Image or Ghost > will do the job. Internet backup is a special program that I consider OK for > backing up a few files, but not for an image. > > Your laptop has no LAN or USB port? Does it have a serial port? Does your > desktop machine have a serial port? What about LPT ports? > > -- > Gary S. Terhune > MS-MVP Shell/Userwww.grystmill.com Yes Gary, the 98 FE laptop does not have a LAN connection, but does have a wireless card, a 1.0 USB port, a serial port and a parallel port. Don't think I can drive an external HDD via that 1.0 USB port, or run Ghost or True Image with the 98FE's laptop's limited resources. My XP machine is also a laptop with wireless, a 2.0 USB port and a parallel (printer) port. I used to be able to get them to talk to each other via an ad hoc wireless connection, but that stopped working. Also had a crossover cable that connected them via the parallel port, but haven't used that for awhile. Does that generate ideas about any other possabilities? I do like Lil Dave's idea about creating space for a 3rd partition on the 98 HDD and creating an image of C: there. I do have Partition Magic. Will check to see if anything I have will run on FE to create the image. Thanks again to you all for hanging in here. Nothing critical, more a learning experience than anything else, so all your help, advise and observations is much appreciated.
Guest Dan Posted August 25, 2007 Posted August 25, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade You are most welcome. I feel that I learn more here than anywhere else in many ways. <smile> "Teflon" wrote: > On Aug 20, 9:22 am, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: > > I wouldn't trust an internet backup solution. If you had the disk space, you > > could make an image and then store that on the internet, but any scheme that > > has the backup writing directly to the remote server is almost bound to > > fail, and would take a long, long time. It's the slowest and least reliable > > of all the solutions thus far, and I don't think either True Image or Ghost > > will do the job. Internet backup is a special program that I consider OK for > > backing up a few files, but not for an image. > > > > Your laptop has no LAN or USB port? Does it have a serial port? Does your > > desktop machine have a serial port? What about LPT ports? > > > > -- > > Gary S. Terhune > > MS-MVP Shell/Userwww.grystmill.com > > Yes Gary, the 98 FE laptop does not have a LAN connection, but does > have a wireless card, a 1.0 USB port, a serial port and a parallel > port. Don't think I can drive an external HDD via that 1.0 USB port, > or run Ghost or True Image with the 98FE's laptop's limited resources. > > My XP machine is also a laptop with wireless, a 2.0 USB port and a > parallel (printer) port. I used to be able to get them to talk to > each other via an ad hoc wireless connection, but that stopped > working. Also had a crossover cable that connected them via the > parallel port, but haven't used that for awhile. > > Does that generate ideas about any other possabilities? > > I do like Lil Dave's idea about creating space for a 3rd partition on > the 98 HDD and creating an image of C: there. I do have Partition > Magic. Will check to see if anything I have will run on FE to create > the image. > > Thanks again to you all for hanging in here. Nothing critical, more a > learning experience than anything else, so all your help, advise and > observations is much appreciated. > > >
Guest Gary S. Terhune Posted August 25, 2007 Posted August 25, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade Well, you'd need a Windows-based imaging tool to use any network solution. That leaves out Ghost or TrueImage, unless you have an old copy. Image from BootIt NG, though, would work. You'd need the Image program, you couldn't use the imaging utility contained in BootIt NG. To image to the same hard drive, you'd need to have enough space to shrink your existing partition and still leave enough room to run Windows and perform the upgrade. while leaving enough unpartitioned space to store the image. How large is your hard drive and how much free space does it have (look in My Computer.) BootIt NG is the tool for this job. An external USB hard drive will run just fine on USB1, just very slowly. My question would be if the mobo has native USB support so that BootIt NG would see it, otherwise you'd have to use Image from Terabyte Unlimited (the makes of BootIt NG.) Have we already gone over the use of BootIt NG? -- Gary S. Terhune MS-MVP Shell/User http://www.grystmill.com "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message news:1188056925.770017.298540@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com... > On Aug 20, 9:22 am, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: >> I wouldn't trust an internet backup solution. If you had the disk space, >> you >> could make an image and then store that on the internet, but any scheme >> that >> has the backup writing directly to the remote server is almost bound to >> fail, and would take a long, long time. It's the slowest and least >> reliable >> of all the solutions thus far, and I don't think either True Image or >> Ghost >> will do the job. Internet backup is a special program that I consider OK >> for >> backing up a few files, but not for an image. >> >> Your laptop has no LAN or USB port? Does it have a serial port? Does your >> desktop machine have a serial port? What about LPT ports? >> >> -- >> Gary S. Terhune >> MS-MVP Shell/Userwww.grystmill.com > > Yes Gary, the 98 FE laptop does not have a LAN connection, but does > have a wireless card, a 1.0 USB port, a serial port and a parallel > port. Don't think I can drive an external HDD via that 1.0 USB port, > or run Ghost or True Image with the 98FE's laptop's limited resources. > > My XP machine is also a laptop with wireless, a 2.0 USB port and a > parallel (printer) port. I used to be able to get them to talk to > each other via an ad hoc wireless connection, but that stopped > working. Also had a crossover cable that connected them via the > parallel port, but haven't used that for awhile. > > Does that generate ideas about any other possabilities? > > I do like Lil Dave's idea about creating space for a 3rd partition on > the 98 HDD and creating an image of C: there. I do have Partition > Magic. Will check to see if anything I have will run on FE to create > the image. > > Thanks again to you all for hanging in here. Nothing critical, more a > learning experience than anything else, so all your help, advise and > observations is much appreciated. > >
Guest Wandering Posted August 25, 2007 Posted August 25, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade In the good old DOS days stuff like Laplink and others connected things with serial or parallel ports. Since you have a suitable cable, why not try it. You can get it and others at: http://vetusware.com/ Good luck! "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message news:1188056925.770017.298540@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com... > On Aug 20, 9:22 am, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: > > I wouldn't trust an internet backup solution. If you had the disk space, you > > could make an image and then store that on the internet, but any scheme that > > has the backup writing directly to the remote server is almost bound to > > fail, and would take a long, long time. It's the slowest and least reliable > > of all the solutions thus far, and I don't think either True Image or Ghost > > will do the job. Internet backup is a special program that I consider OK for > > backing up a few files, but not for an image. > > > > Your laptop has no LAN or USB port? Does it have a serial port? Does your > > desktop machine have a serial port? What about LPT ports? > > > > -- > > Gary S. Terhune > > MS-MVP Shell/Userwww.grystmill.com > > Yes Gary, the 98 FE laptop does not have a LAN connection, but does > have a wireless card, a 1.0 USB port, a serial port and a parallel > port. Don't think I can drive an external HDD via that 1.0 USB port, > or run Ghost or True Image with the 98FE's laptop's limited resources. > > My XP machine is also a laptop with wireless, a 2.0 USB port and a > parallel (printer) port. I used to be able to get them to talk to > each other via an ad hoc wireless connection, but that stopped > working. Also had a crossover cable that connected them via the > parallel port, but haven't used that for awhile. > > Does that generate ideas about any other possabilities? > > I do like Lil Dave's idea about creating space for a 3rd partition on > the 98 HDD and creating an image of C: there. I do have Partition > Magic. Will check to see if anything I have will run on FE to create > the image. > > Thanks again to you all for hanging in here. Nothing critical, more a > learning experience than anything else, so all your help, advise and > observations is much appreciated. > >
Guest Gary S. Terhune Posted August 25, 2007 Posted August 25, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade Connecting the computers is not a problem. The issue is what program to use that will create an image of Computer A on Computer B's storage media. I know of no such program for DOS, and only one for Windows that will work in Win98 and is currently available: Image, from Terabyte Unlimited. I don't *think* there is an evaluation version, I *think* you have to pay for it, period. Whereas BootIt NG has an imaging program built-in, is free for the purpose, and can write to CD, to an external drive (if the mobo has native USB support), to an existing partition on the hard drive (as an ISO file), or to free space on the hard drive. If Teflon's intent is to create a one-time backup in preparation for an upgrade, without incurring costs, BootIt NG is the solution, and writing to the same partition and then copying the ISO file to Computer B using some sort of networking, which I guess in this case is the LPT link. Writing the BootIt NG to free space on the disk, after shrinking the existing partition is a distant second, since it can't be copied the Computer B. -- Gary S. Terhune MS-MVP Shell/User http://www.grystmill.com "Wandering" <AmoreDei@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:tpOdnaLBR5m1903bnZ2dnUVZ_sGvnZ2d@comcast.com... > In the good old DOS days stuff like Laplink and others connected > things with serial or parallel ports. Since you have a suitable cable, > why not try it. You can get it and others at: > > http://vetusware.com/ > > Good luck! > > > "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message > news:1188056925.770017.298540@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com... >> On Aug 20, 9:22 am, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: >> > I wouldn't trust an internet backup solution. If you had the disk > space, you >> > could make an image and then store that on the internet, but any > scheme that >> > has the backup writing directly to the remote server is almost > bound to >> > fail, and would take a long, long time. It's the slowest and least > reliable >> > of all the solutions thus far, and I don't think either True Image > or Ghost >> > will do the job. Internet backup is a special program that I > consider OK for >> > backing up a few files, but not for an image. >> > >> > Your laptop has no LAN or USB port? Does it have a serial port? > Does your >> > desktop machine have a serial port? What about LPT ports? >> > >> > -- >> > Gary S. Terhune >> > MS-MVP Shell/Userwww.grystmill.com >> >> Yes Gary, the 98 FE laptop does not have a LAN connection, but does >> have a wireless card, a 1.0 USB port, a serial port and a parallel >> port. Don't think I can drive an external HDD via that 1.0 USB > port, >> or run Ghost or True Image with the 98FE's laptop's limited > resources. >> >> My XP machine is also a laptop with wireless, a 2.0 USB port and a >> parallel (printer) port. I used to be able to get them to talk to >> each other via an ad hoc wireless connection, but that stopped >> working. Also had a crossover cable that connected them via the >> parallel port, but haven't used that for awhile. >> >> Does that generate ideas about any other possabilities? >> >> I do like Lil Dave's idea about creating space for a 3rd partition > on >> the 98 HDD and creating an image of C: there. I do have Partition >> Magic. Will check to see if anything I have will run on FE to > create >> the image. >> >> Thanks again to you all for hanging in here. Nothing critical, more > a >> learning experience than anything else, so all your help, advise and >> observations is much appreciated. >> >> > >
Guest PCR Posted August 25, 2007 Posted August 25, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message news:1188056925.770017.298540@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com | On Aug 20, 9:22 am, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: |> I wouldn't trust an internet backup solution. If you had the disk |> space, you could make an image and then store that on the internet, |> but any scheme that has the backup writing directly to the remote |> server is almost bound to fail, and would take a long, long time. |> It's the slowest and least reliable of all the solutions thus far, |> and I don't think either True Image or Ghost will do the job. |> Internet backup is a special program that I consider OK for backing |> up a few files, but not for an image. |> |> Your laptop has no LAN or USB port? Does it have a serial port? Does |> your desktop machine have a serial port? What about LPT ports? |> |> -- |> Gary S. Terhune |> MS-MVP Shell/Userwww.grystmill.com | | Yes Gary, the 98 FE laptop does not have a LAN connection, but does | have a wireless card, a 1.0 USB port, a serial port and a parallel | port. Don't think I can drive an external HDD via that 1.0 USB port, | or run Ghost or True Image with the 98FE's laptop's limited resources. | | My XP machine is also a laptop with wireless, a 2.0 USB port and a | parallel (printer) port. I used to be able to get them to talk to | each other via an ad hoc wireless connection, but that stopped | working. Also had a crossover cable that connected them via the | parallel port, but haven't used that for awhile. | | Does that generate ideas about any other possabilities? | | I do like Lil Dave's idea about creating space for a 3rd partition on | the 98 HDD and creating an image of C: there. I do have Partition | Magic. Will check to see if anything I have will run on FE to create | the image. | | Thanks again to you all for hanging in here. Nothing critical, more a | learning experience than anything else, so all your help, advise and | observations is much appreciated. You are welcome. Lil Dave's idea is a good one, if you've got the space. Have you examined that CD-ROM? Is it an IDE device? If so, maybe unplug it & put an HDD temporarily in its place. That's a second or third solution! If you have no floppy drive & you want to use BING, you'd have to make a Maintenance CD on maybe the XP machine, since you cannot write to the Win98 CD-ROM. Then, install it to the 98's HDD.
Guest Dan Posted August 25, 2007 Posted August 25, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/imagew.html Is this the program you are referring to, Gary? Also, how does an image of someone's computer get transferred from one computer to another computer when they are both in different locations. Is it done through remote access of XP Professional. Feel Free to add the XP newsgroup because I am not sure the best newsgroup there to post this under and this group has always been the most friendly to me out of all the other newsgroups. "Gary S. Terhune" wrote: > Connecting the computers is not a problem. The issue is what program to use > that will create an image of Computer A on Computer B's storage media. I > know of no such program for DOS, and only one for Windows that will work in > Win98 and is currently available: Image, from Terabyte Unlimited. I don't > *think* there is an evaluation version, I *think* you have to pay for it, > period. Whereas BootIt NG has an imaging program built-in, is free for the > purpose, and can write to CD, to an external drive (if the mobo has native > USB support), to an existing partition on the hard drive (as an ISO file), > or to free space on the hard drive. > > If Teflon's intent is to create a one-time backup in preparation for an > upgrade, without incurring costs, BootIt NG is the solution, and writing to > the same partition and then copying the ISO file to Computer B using some > sort of networking, which I guess in this case is the LPT link. Writing the > BootIt NG to free space on the disk, after shrinking the existing partition > is a distant second, since it can't be copied the Computer B. > > -- > Gary S. Terhune > MS-MVP Shell/User > http://www.grystmill.com > > "Wandering" <AmoreDei@hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:tpOdnaLBR5m1903bnZ2dnUVZ_sGvnZ2d@comcast.com... > > In the good old DOS days stuff like Laplink and others connected > > things with serial or parallel ports. Since you have a suitable cable, > > why not try it. You can get it and others at: > > > > http://vetusware.com/ > > > > Good luck! > > > > > > "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message > > news:1188056925.770017.298540@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com... > >> On Aug 20, 9:22 am, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: > >> > I wouldn't trust an internet backup solution. If you had the disk > > space, you > >> > could make an image and then store that on the internet, but any > > scheme that > >> > has the backup writing directly to the remote server is almost > > bound to > >> > fail, and would take a long, long time. It's the slowest and least > > reliable > >> > of all the solutions thus far, and I don't think either True Image > > or Ghost > >> > will do the job. Internet backup is a special program that I > > consider OK for > >> > backing up a few files, but not for an image. > >> > > >> > Your laptop has no LAN or USB port? Does it have a serial port? > > Does your > >> > desktop machine have a serial port? What about LPT ports? > >> > > >> > -- > >> > Gary S. Terhune > >> > MS-MVP Shell/Userwww.grystmill.com > >> > >> Yes Gary, the 98 FE laptop does not have a LAN connection, but does > >> have a wireless card, a 1.0 USB port, a serial port and a parallel > >> port. Don't think I can drive an external HDD via that 1.0 USB > > port, > >> or run Ghost or True Image with the 98FE's laptop's limited > > resources. > >> > >> My XP machine is also a laptop with wireless, a 2.0 USB port and a > >> parallel (printer) port. I used to be able to get them to talk to > >> each other via an ad hoc wireless connection, but that stopped > >> working. Also had a crossover cable that connected them via the > >> parallel port, but haven't used that for awhile. > >> > >> Does that generate ideas about any other possabilities? > >> > >> I do like Lil Dave's idea about creating space for a 3rd partition > > on > >> the 98 HDD and creating an image of C: there. I do have Partition > >> Magic. Will check to see if anything I have will run on FE to > > create > >> the image. > >> > >> Thanks again to you all for hanging in here. Nothing critical, more > > a > >> learning experience than anything else, so all your help, advise and > >> observations is much appreciated. > >> > >> > > > > > > >
Guest Dan Posted August 25, 2007 Posted August 25, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade I know I am not the OP but how do you go about making a maintenance cd and could you elaborate what you are getting at PCR? "PCR" wrote: > "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message > news:1188056925.770017.298540@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com > | On Aug 20, 9:22 am, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: > |> I wouldn't trust an internet backup solution. If you had the disk > |> space, you could make an image and then store that on the internet, > |> but any scheme that has the backup writing directly to the remote > |> server is almost bound to fail, and would take a long, long time. > |> It's the slowest and least reliable of all the solutions thus far, > |> and I don't think either True Image or Ghost will do the job. > |> Internet backup is a special program that I consider OK for backing > |> up a few files, but not for an image. > |> > |> Your laptop has no LAN or USB port? Does it have a serial port? Does > |> your desktop machine have a serial port? What about LPT ports? > |> > |> -- > |> Gary S. Terhune > |> MS-MVP Shell/Userwww.grystmill.com > | > | Yes Gary, the 98 FE laptop does not have a LAN connection, but does > | have a wireless card, a 1.0 USB port, a serial port and a parallel > | port. Don't think I can drive an external HDD via that 1.0 USB port, > | or run Ghost or True Image with the 98FE's laptop's limited resources. > | > | My XP machine is also a laptop with wireless, a 2.0 USB port and a > | parallel (printer) port. I used to be able to get them to talk to > | each other via an ad hoc wireless connection, but that stopped > | working. Also had a crossover cable that connected them via the > | parallel port, but haven't used that for awhile. > | > | Does that generate ideas about any other possabilities? > | > | I do like Lil Dave's idea about creating space for a 3rd partition on > | the 98 HDD and creating an image of C: there. I do have Partition > | Magic. Will check to see if anything I have will run on FE to create > | the image. > | > | Thanks again to you all for hanging in here. Nothing critical, more a > | learning experience than anything else, so all your help, advise and > | observations is much appreciated. > > You are welcome. Lil Dave's idea is a good one, if you've got the space. > Have you examined that CD-ROM? Is it an IDE device? If so, maybe unplug > it & put an HDD temporarily in its place. That's a second or third > solution! > > If you have no floppy drive & you want to use BING, you'd have to make a > Maintenance CD on maybe the XP machine, since you cannot write to the > Win98 CD-ROM. Then, install it to the 98's HDD. > > >
Guest PCR Posted August 25, 2007 Posted August 25, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade "Dan" <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message news:7DB89C3F-E9E7-473E-9A19-F85B8F13C8B5@microsoft.com | I know I am not the OP but how do you go about making a maintenance | cd and could you elaborate what you are getting at PCR? The answer you seek about creating a Maintenance CD I'm sure is somewhere at... http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/kb/ The Terabyte Knowledge Base There's no sense in my re-writing it, especially as I personally only use a floppy drive for it. It's at least a 4 or 5 step procedure! After the maintenance CD is created, it must be used to install BING to the current HDD. That will be a number of additional steps, also to found at the TKB. (And I've never actually installed BING, but only run it from a Maintenance Floppy.) Then, unplug the CD-ROM & plug the 2nd HDD temporarily in its stead-- which I can't swear is possible. You do have to get the jumpers right. After that, make the copy or image & replace the CD-ROM. I probably would prefer a copy (not an Image). Also, I would switch this 2nd HDD with the first & boot it. Again, there will be jumpers to get right & a few additional considerations, which I can post upon request. But let the ORIGINAL be the copy at least until the work is done-- which is (IIRC) that Teflon wants to install Win98SE in place of FE! | "PCR" wrote: | |> "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message |> news:1188056925.770017.298540@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com |> | On Aug 20, 9:22 am, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: |> |> I wouldn't trust an internet backup solution. If you had the disk |> |> space, you could make an image and then store that on the |> |> internet, but any scheme that has the backup writing directly to |> |> the remote server is almost bound to fail, and would take a long, |> |> long time. It's the slowest and least reliable of all the |> |> solutions thus far, and I don't think either True Image or Ghost |> |> will do the job. Internet backup is a special program that I |> |> consider OK for backing up a few files, but not for an image. |> |> |> |> Your laptop has no LAN or USB port? Does it have a serial port? |> |> Does your desktop machine have a serial port? What about LPT |> |> ports? |> |> |> |> -- |> |> Gary S. Terhune |> |> MS-MVP Shell/Userwww.grystmill.com |> | |> | Yes Gary, the 98 FE laptop does not have a LAN connection, but does |> | have a wireless card, a 1.0 USB port, a serial port and a parallel |> | port. Don't think I can drive an external HDD via that 1.0 USB |> | port, or run Ghost or True Image with the 98FE's laptop's limited |> | resources. |> | |> | My XP machine is also a laptop with wireless, a 2.0 USB port and a |> | parallel (printer) port. I used to be able to get them to talk to |> | each other via an ad hoc wireless connection, but that stopped |> | working. Also had a crossover cable that connected them via the |> | parallel port, but haven't used that for awhile. |> | |> | Does that generate ideas about any other possabilities? |> | |> | I do like Lil Dave's idea about creating space for a 3rd partition |> | on the 98 HDD and creating an image of C: there. I do have |> | Partition Magic. Will check to see if anything I have will run on |> | FE to create the image. |> | |> | Thanks again to you all for hanging in here. Nothing critical, |> | more a learning experience than anything else, so all your help, |> | advise and observations is much appreciated. |> |> You are welcome. Lil Dave's idea is a good one, if you've got the |> space. Have you examined that CD-ROM? Is it an IDE device? If so, |> maybe unplug it & put an HDD temporarily in its place. That's a |> second or third solution! |> |> If you have no floppy drive & you want to use BING, you'd have to |> make a Maintenance CD on maybe the XP machine, since you cannot |> write to the Win98 CD-ROM. Then, install it to the 98's HDD. -- Thanks or Good Luck, There may be humor in this post, and, Naturally, you will not sue, Should things get worse after this, PCR pcrrcp@netzero.net
Guest Gary S. Terhune Posted August 25, 2007 Posted August 25, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade An image is a regular file, Dan. Most often with the ISO extension. You can do with it the same things you can do with any file. Because an image of a hard drive partition is usually quite large, the only decent ways to transport it are over a network, whether it's a LAN, WAN or the internet, or using an external hard drive. That or you break it up using some utility and burn it to CDs or DVDs. No, the XP groups are not interested in this conversation. -- Gary S. Terhune MS-MVP Shell/User http://www.grystmill.com "Dan" <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message news:A4C0B217-5D65-40A9-8B0D-1794C9370057@microsoft.com... > http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/imagew.html > > Is this the program you are referring to, Gary? Also, how does an image > of > someone's computer get transferred from one computer to another computer > when > they are both in different locations. Is it done through remote access of > XP > Professional. Feel Free to add the XP newsgroup because I am not sure the > best newsgroup there to post this under and this group has always been the > most friendly to me out of all the other newsgroups. > > "Gary S. Terhune" wrote: > >> Connecting the computers is not a problem. The issue is what program to >> use >> that will create an image of Computer A on Computer B's storage media. I >> know of no such program for DOS, and only one for Windows that will work >> in >> Win98 and is currently available: Image, from Terabyte Unlimited. I don't >> *think* there is an evaluation version, I *think* you have to pay for it, >> period. Whereas BootIt NG has an imaging program built-in, is free for >> the >> purpose, and can write to CD, to an external drive (if the mobo has >> native >> USB support), to an existing partition on the hard drive (as an ISO >> file), >> or to free space on the hard drive. >> >> If Teflon's intent is to create a one-time backup in preparation for an >> upgrade, without incurring costs, BootIt NG is the solution, and writing >> to >> the same partition and then copying the ISO file to Computer B using some >> sort of networking, which I guess in this case is the LPT link. Writing >> the >> BootIt NG to free space on the disk, after shrinking the existing >> partition >> is a distant second, since it can't be copied the Computer B. >> >> -- >> Gary S. Terhune >> MS-MVP Shell/User >> http://www.grystmill.com >> >> "Wandering" <AmoreDei@hotmail.com> wrote in message >> news:tpOdnaLBR5m1903bnZ2dnUVZ_sGvnZ2d@comcast.com... >> > In the good old DOS days stuff like Laplink and others connected >> > things with serial or parallel ports. Since you have a suitable cable, >> > why not try it. You can get it and others at: >> > >> > http://vetusware.com/ >> > >> > Good luck! >> > >> > >> > "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message >> > news:1188056925.770017.298540@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com... >> >> On Aug 20, 9:22 am, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: >> >> > I wouldn't trust an internet backup solution. If you had the disk >> > space, you >> >> > could make an image and then store that on the internet, but any >> > scheme that >> >> > has the backup writing directly to the remote server is almost >> > bound to >> >> > fail, and would take a long, long time. It's the slowest and least >> > reliable >> >> > of all the solutions thus far, and I don't think either True Image >> > or Ghost >> >> > will do the job. Internet backup is a special program that I >> > consider OK for >> >> > backing up a few files, but not for an image. >> >> > >> >> > Your laptop has no LAN or USB port? Does it have a serial port? >> > Does your >> >> > desktop machine have a serial port? What about LPT ports? >> >> > >> >> > -- >> >> > Gary S. Terhune >> >> > MS-MVP Shell/Userwww.grystmill.com >> >> >> >> Yes Gary, the 98 FE laptop does not have a LAN connection, but does >> >> have a wireless card, a 1.0 USB port, a serial port and a parallel >> >> port. Don't think I can drive an external HDD via that 1.0 USB >> > port, >> >> or run Ghost or True Image with the 98FE's laptop's limited >> > resources. >> >> >> >> My XP machine is also a laptop with wireless, a 2.0 USB port and a >> >> parallel (printer) port. I used to be able to get them to talk to >> >> each other via an ad hoc wireless connection, but that stopped >> >> working. Also had a crossover cable that connected them via the >> >> parallel port, but haven't used that for awhile. >> >> >> >> Does that generate ideas about any other possabilities? >> >> >> >> I do like Lil Dave's idea about creating space for a 3rd partition >> > on >> >> the 98 HDD and creating an image of C: there. I do have Partition >> >> Magic. Will check to see if anything I have will run on FE to >> > create >> >> the image. >> >> >> >> Thanks again to you all for hanging in here. Nothing critical, more >> > a >> >> learning experience than anything else, so all your help, advise and >> >> observations is much appreciated. >> >> >> >> >> > >> > >> >> >>
Guest Dan Posted August 26, 2007 Posted August 26, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade Ah, thank you and that makes so much sense. When I helped test Vista Ultimate, 32 bit for Microsoft; I burned the ISO image from the website to a DVD after I had downloaded the file. I have a CD burner and a DVD burner as well. I really do enjoy dual-booting with XP Professional and 98 Second Edition. I was talking to Microsoft support recently and the engineer who said he was from India said that he did the same thing as I did with a dual-boot of 98SE and XP Pro. So it could be possible to remotely transport someone's entire computer desktop via an ISO image to another computer and then setup the account on that other computer. Ah, now I see why Chris Quirke, MVP is so concerned about Windows XP Professional and the lack of maintance operating system like 98SE has with DOS. The way I see it now is that XP has too many services and this makes it vulnerable. In addition, XP Pro. has remote desktop while really nice for remote admin. it allows for a vulnerability such as what happened at the school that I work at to happen. 98SE is a closed system and has much more limited access by other people remotely. 98SE also has DOS which allows for people to use older programs and have great fun. Because, 98SE is tied with the 9x source code then this allows for people and even schools to use older programs like games and educational software that will not run on XP. This is the reason that I think 98SE is a great operating system and hopefully people will see this and jump back on the bandwagon by purchasing full copies of 98SE for dual-boot systems and to allow schools to use all of their older educational software that otherwise would have to be thrown away. "Gary S. Terhune" wrote: > An image is a regular file, Dan. Most often with the ISO extension. You can > do with it the same things you can do with any file. Because an image of a > hard drive partition is usually quite large, the only decent ways to > transport it are over a network, whether it's a LAN, WAN or the internet, or > using an external hard drive. That or you break it up using some utility and > burn it to CDs or DVDs. > > No, the XP groups are not interested in this conversation. > > -- > Gary S. Terhune > MS-MVP Shell/User > http://www.grystmill.com > > "Dan" <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message > news:A4C0B217-5D65-40A9-8B0D-1794C9370057@microsoft.com... > > http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/imagew.html > > > > Is this the program you are referring to, Gary? Also, how does an image > > of > > someone's computer get transferred from one computer to another computer > > when > > they are both in different locations. Is it done through remote access of > > XP > > Professional. Feel Free to add the XP newsgroup because I am not sure the > > best newsgroup there to post this under and this group has always been the > > most friendly to me out of all the other newsgroups. > > > > "Gary S. Terhune" wrote: > > > >> Connecting the computers is not a problem. The issue is what program to > >> use > >> that will create an image of Computer A on Computer B's storage media. I > >> know of no such program for DOS, and only one for Windows that will work > >> in > >> Win98 and is currently available: Image, from Terabyte Unlimited. I don't > >> *think* there is an evaluation version, I *think* you have to pay for it, > >> period. Whereas BootIt NG has an imaging program built-in, is free for > >> the > >> purpose, and can write to CD, to an external drive (if the mobo has > >> native > >> USB support), to an existing partition on the hard drive (as an ISO > >> file), > >> or to free space on the hard drive. > >> > >> If Teflon's intent is to create a one-time backup in preparation for an > >> upgrade, without incurring costs, BootIt NG is the solution, and writing > >> to > >> the same partition and then copying the ISO file to Computer B using some > >> sort of networking, which I guess in this case is the LPT link. Writing > >> the > >> BootIt NG to free space on the disk, after shrinking the existing > >> partition > >> is a distant second, since it can't be copied the Computer B. > >> > >> -- > >> Gary S. Terhune > >> MS-MVP Shell/User > >> http://www.grystmill.com > >> > >> "Wandering" <AmoreDei@hotmail.com> wrote in message > >> news:tpOdnaLBR5m1903bnZ2dnUVZ_sGvnZ2d@comcast.com... > >> > In the good old DOS days stuff like Laplink and others connected > >> > things with serial or parallel ports. Since you have a suitable cable, > >> > why not try it. You can get it and others at: > >> > > >> > http://vetusware.com/ > >> > > >> > Good luck! > >> > > >> > > >> > "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message > >> > news:1188056925.770017.298540@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com... > >> >> On Aug 20, 9:22 am, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: > >> >> > I wouldn't trust an internet backup solution. If you had the disk > >> > space, you > >> >> > could make an image and then store that on the internet, but any > >> > scheme that > >> >> > has the backup writing directly to the remote server is almost > >> > bound to > >> >> > fail, and would take a long, long time. It's the slowest and least > >> > reliable > >> >> > of all the solutions thus far, and I don't think either True Image > >> > or Ghost > >> >> > will do the job. Internet backup is a special program that I > >> > consider OK for > >> >> > backing up a few files, but not for an image. > >> >> > > >> >> > Your laptop has no LAN or USB port? Does it have a serial port? > >> > Does your > >> >> > desktop machine have a serial port? What about LPT ports? > >> >> > > >> >> > -- > >> >> > Gary S. Terhune > >> >> > MS-MVP Shell/Userwww.grystmill.com > >> >> > >> >> Yes Gary, the 98 FE laptop does not have a LAN connection, but does > >> >> have a wireless card, a 1.0 USB port, a serial port and a parallel > >> >> port. Don't think I can drive an external HDD via that 1.0 USB > >> > port, > >> >> or run Ghost or True Image with the 98FE's laptop's limited > >> > resources. > >> >> > >> >> My XP machine is also a laptop with wireless, a 2.0 USB port and a > >> >> parallel (printer) port. I used to be able to get them to talk to > >> >> each other via an ad hoc wireless connection, but that stopped > >> >> working. Also had a crossover cable that connected them via the > >> >> parallel port, but haven't used that for awhile. > >> >> > >> >> Does that generate ideas about any other possabilities? > >> >> > >> >> I do like Lil Dave's idea about creating space for a 3rd partition > >> > on > >> >> the 98 HDD and creating an image of C: there. I do have Partition > >> >> Magic. Will check to see if anything I have will run on FE to > >> > create > >> >> the image. > >> >> > >> >> Thanks again to you all for hanging in here. Nothing critical, more > >> > a > >> >> learning experience than anything else, so all your help, advise and > >> >> observations is much appreciated. > >> >> > >> >> > >> > > >> > > >> > >> > >> > > >
Guest Dan Posted August 26, 2007 Posted August 26, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade Thanks PCR! "PCR" wrote: > "Dan" <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message > news:7DB89C3F-E9E7-473E-9A19-F85B8F13C8B5@microsoft.com > | I know I am not the OP but how do you go about making a maintenance > | cd and could you elaborate what you are getting at PCR? > > The answer you seek about creating a Maintenance CD I'm sure is > somewhere at... > http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/kb/ > The Terabyte Knowledge Base > > There's no sense in my re-writing it, especially as I personally only > use a floppy drive for it. It's at least a 4 or 5 step procedure! After > the maintenance CD is created, it must be used to install BING to the > current HDD. That will be a number of additional steps, also to found at > the TKB. (And I've never actually installed BING, but only run it from a > Maintenance Floppy.) > > Then, unplug the CD-ROM & plug the 2nd HDD temporarily in its stead-- > which I can't swear is possible. You do have to get the jumpers right. > After that, make the copy or image & replace the CD-ROM. > > I probably would prefer a copy (not an Image). Also, I would switch this > 2nd HDD with the first & boot it. Again, there will be jumpers to get > right & a few additional considerations, which I can post upon request. > But let the ORIGINAL be the copy at least until the work is done-- which > is (IIRC) that Teflon wants to install Win98SE in place of FE! > > | "PCR" wrote: > | > |> "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message > |> news:1188056925.770017.298540@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com > |> | On Aug 20, 9:22 am, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: > |> |> I wouldn't trust an internet backup solution. If you had the disk > |> |> space, you could make an image and then store that on the > |> |> internet, but any scheme that has the backup writing directly to > |> |> the remote server is almost bound to fail, and would take a long, > |> |> long time. It's the slowest and least reliable of all the > |> |> solutions thus far, and I don't think either True Image or Ghost > |> |> will do the job. Internet backup is a special program that I > |> |> consider OK for backing up a few files, but not for an image. > |> |> > |> |> Your laptop has no LAN or USB port? Does it have a serial port? > |> |> Does your desktop machine have a serial port? What about LPT > |> |> ports? > |> |> > |> |> -- > |> |> Gary S. Terhune > |> |> MS-MVP Shell/Userwww.grystmill.com > |> | > |> | Yes Gary, the 98 FE laptop does not have a LAN connection, but does > |> | have a wireless card, a 1.0 USB port, a serial port and a parallel > |> | port. Don't think I can drive an external HDD via that 1.0 USB > |> | port, or run Ghost or True Image with the 98FE's laptop's limited > |> | resources. > |> | > |> | My XP machine is also a laptop with wireless, a 2.0 USB port and a > |> | parallel (printer) port. I used to be able to get them to talk to > |> | each other via an ad hoc wireless connection, but that stopped > |> | working. Also had a crossover cable that connected them via the > |> | parallel port, but haven't used that for awhile. > |> | > |> | Does that generate ideas about any other possabilities? > |> | > |> | I do like Lil Dave's idea about creating space for a 3rd partition > |> | on the 98 HDD and creating an image of C: there. I do have > |> | Partition Magic. Will check to see if anything I have will run on > |> | FE to create the image. > |> | > |> | Thanks again to you all for hanging in here. Nothing critical, > |> | more a learning experience than anything else, so all your help, > |> | advise and observations is much appreciated. > |> > |> You are welcome. Lil Dave's idea is a good one, if you've got the > |> space. Have you examined that CD-ROM? Is it an IDE device? If so, > |> maybe unplug it & put an HDD temporarily in its place. That's a > |> second or third solution! > |> > |> If you have no floppy drive & you want to use BING, you'd have to > |> make a Maintenance CD on maybe the XP machine, since you cannot > |> write to the Win98 CD-ROM. Then, install it to the 98's HDD. > > -- > Thanks or Good Luck, > There may be humor in this post, and, > Naturally, you will not sue, > Should things get worse after this, > PCR > pcrrcp@netzero.net > > >
Guest Curt Christianson Posted August 26, 2007 Posted August 26, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade Hi Dan, I understand your fondness of 98SE, and I wouldn't consider giving up my copy. I'm currently using XP Pro because that is what was on the machine when I got it. As far as others "jumping back on the 98 bandwagon", it ain't gonna happen. For one thing, there aren't that many copies just floating around any longer. Secondly, fewer and fewer applications will run on 98, and very little hardware is marketed with 98 in mind. I kind of doubt MS will re-release W98, and that would be the only way it could be available to "the masses" again. Besides, the masses are no longer interested in 98. -- Curt Windows Support Center http://www.aumha.org Practically Nerded,... http://dundats.mvps.org/Index.htm "Dan" <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message news:287AE979-0755-4B0F-A6FE-42F41ED6D06A@microsoft.com... | Ah, thank you and that makes so much sense. When I helped test Vista | Ultimate, 32 bit for Microsoft; I burned the ISO image from the website to a | DVD after I had downloaded the file. I have a CD burner and a DVD burner as | well. I really do enjoy dual-booting with XP Professional and 98 Second | Edition. I was talking to Microsoft support recently and the engineer who | said he was from India said that he did the same thing as I did with a | dual-boot of 98SE and XP Pro. So it could be possible to remotely transport | someone's entire computer desktop via an ISO image to another computer and | then setup the account on that other computer. Ah, now I see why Chris | Quirke, MVP is so concerned about Windows XP Professional and the lack of | maintance operating system like 98SE has with DOS. The way I see it now is | that XP has too many services and this makes it vulnerable. In addition, XP | Pro. has remote desktop while really nice for remote admin. it allows for a | vulnerability such as what happened at the school that I work at to happen. | 98SE is a closed system and has much more limited access by other people | remotely. 98SE also has DOS which allows for people to use older programs | and have great fun. Because, 98SE is tied with the 9x source code then this | allows for people and even schools to use older programs like games and | educational software that will not run on XP. This is the reason that I | think 98SE is a great operating system and hopefully people will see this and | jump back on the bandwagon by purchasing full copies of 98SE for dual-boot | systems and to allow schools to use all of their older educational software | that otherwise would have to be thrown away. | | "Gary S. Terhune" wrote: | | > An image is a regular file, Dan. Most often with the ISO extension. You can | > do with it the same things you can do with any file. Because an image of a | > hard drive partition is usually quite large, the only decent ways to | > transport it are over a network, whether it's a LAN, WAN or the internet, or | > using an external hard drive. That or you break it up using some utility and | > burn it to CDs or DVDs. | > | > No, the XP groups are not interested in this conversation. | > | > -- | > Gary S. Terhune | > MS-MVP Shell/User | > http://www.grystmill.com | > | > "Dan" <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message | > news:A4C0B217-5D65-40A9-8B0D-1794C9370057@microsoft.com... | > > http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/imagew.html | > > | > > Is this the program you are referring to, Gary? Also, how does an image | > > of | > > someone's computer get transferred from one computer to another computer | > > when | > > they are both in different locations. Is it done through remote access of | > > XP | > > Professional. Feel Free to add the XP newsgroup because I am not sure the | > > best newsgroup there to post this under and this group has always been the | > > most friendly to me out of all the other newsgroups. | > > | > > "Gary S. Terhune" wrote: | > > | > >> Connecting the computers is not a problem. The issue is what program to | > >> use | > >> that will create an image of Computer A on Computer B's storage media. I | > >> know of no such program for DOS, and only one for Windows that will work | > >> in | > >> Win98 and is currently available: Image, from Terabyte Unlimited. I don't | > >> *think* there is an evaluation version, I *think* you have to pay for it, | > >> period. Whereas BootIt NG has an imaging program built-in, is free for | > >> the | > >> purpose, and can write to CD, to an external drive (if the mobo has | > >> native | > >> USB support), to an existing partition on the hard drive (as an ISO | > >> file), | > >> or to free space on the hard drive. | > >> | > >> If Teflon's intent is to create a one-time backup in preparation for an | > >> upgrade, without incurring costs, BootIt NG is the solution, and writing | > >> to | > >> the same partition and then copying the ISO file to Computer B using some | > >> sort of networking, which I guess in this case is the LPT link. Writing | > >> the | > >> BootIt NG to free space on the disk, after shrinking the existing | > >> partition | > >> is a distant second, since it can't be copied the Computer B. | > >> | > >> -- | > >> Gary S. Terhune | > >> MS-MVP Shell/User | > >> http://www.grystmill.com | > >> | > >> "Wandering" <AmoreDei@hotmail.com> wrote in message | > >> news:tpOdnaLBR5m1903bnZ2dnUVZ_sGvnZ2d@comcast.com... | > >> > In the good old DOS days stuff like Laplink and others connected | > >> > things with serial or parallel ports. Since you have a suitable cable, | > >> > why not try it. You can get it and others at: | > >> > | > >> > http://vetusware.com/ | > >> > | > >> > Good luck! | > >> > | > >> > | > >> > "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message | > >> > news:1188056925.770017.298540@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com... | > >> >> On Aug 20, 9:22 am, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: | > >> >> > I wouldn't trust an internet backup solution. If you had the disk | > >> > space, you | > >> >> > could make an image and then store that on the internet, but any | > >> > scheme that | > >> >> > has the backup writing directly to the remote server is almost | > >> > bound to | > >> >> > fail, and would take a long, long time. It's the slowest and least | > >> > reliable | > >> >> > of all the solutions thus far, and I don't think either True Image | > >> > or Ghost | > >> >> > will do the job. Internet backup is a special program that I | > >> > consider OK for | > >> >> > backing up a few files, but not for an image. | > >> >> > | > >> >> > Your laptop has no LAN or USB port? Does it have a serial port? | > >> > Does your | > >> >> > desktop machine have a serial port? What about LPT ports? | > >> >> > | > >> >> > -- | > >> >> > Gary S. Terhune | > >> >> > MS-MVP Shell/Userwww.grystmill.com | > >> >> | > >> >> Yes Gary, the 98 FE laptop does not have a LAN connection, but does | > >> >> have a wireless card, a 1.0 USB port, a serial port and a parallel | > >> >> port. Don't think I can drive an external HDD via that 1.0 USB | > >> > port, | > >> >> or run Ghost or True Image with the 98FE's laptop's limited | > >> > resources. | > >> >> | > >> >> My XP machine is also a laptop with wireless, a 2.0 USB port and a | > >> >> parallel (printer) port. I used to be able to get them to talk to | > >> >> each other via an ad hoc wireless connection, but that stopped | > >> >> working. Also had a crossover cable that connected them via the | > >> >> parallel port, but haven't used that for awhile. | > >> >> | > >> >> Does that generate ideas about any other possabilities? | > >> >> | > >> >> I do like Lil Dave's idea about creating space for a 3rd partition | > >> > on | > >> >> the 98 HDD and creating an image of C: there. I do have Partition | > >> >> Magic. Will check to see if anything I have will run on FE to | > >> > create | > >> >> the image. | > >> >> | > >> >> Thanks again to you all for hanging in here. Nothing critical, more | > >> > a | > >> >> learning experience than anything else, so all your help, advise and | > >> >> observations is much appreciated. | > >> >> | > >> >> | > >> > | > >> > | > >> | > >> | > >> | > | > | >
Guest PCR Posted August 26, 2007 Posted August 26, 2007 Re: Cloning Win98FE prior to SE upgrade "Dan" <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message news:9C012F27-A798-49E9-8E4A-3F0E651EF12F@microsoft.com | Thanks PCR! You are welcome. | "PCR" wrote: | |> "Dan" <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message |> news:7DB89C3F-E9E7-473E-9A19-F85B8F13C8B5@microsoft.com |> | I know I am not the OP but how do you go about making a maintenance |> | cd and could you elaborate what you are getting at PCR? |> |> The answer you seek about creating a Maintenance CD I'm sure is |> somewhere at... |> http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/kb/ |> The Terabyte Knowledge Base |> |> There's no sense in my re-writing it, especially as I personally only |> use a floppy drive for it. It's at least a 4 or 5 step procedure! |> After the maintenance CD is created, it must be used to install BING |> to the current HDD. That will be a number of additional steps, also |> to found at the TKB. (And I've never actually installed BING, but |> only run it from a Maintenance Floppy.) |> |> Then, unplug the CD-ROM & plug the 2nd HDD temporarily in its stead-- |> which I can't swear is possible. You do have to get the jumpers |> right. After that, make the copy or image & replace the CD-ROM. |> |> I probably would prefer a copy (not an Image). Also, I would switch |> this 2nd HDD with the first & boot it. Again, there will be jumpers |> to get right & a few additional considerations, which I can post |> upon request. But let the ORIGINAL be the copy at least until the |> work is done-- which is (IIRC) that Teflon wants to install Win98SE |> in place of FE! |> |> | "PCR" wrote: |> | |> |> "Teflon" <spambaitmeister@gmail.com> wrote in message |> |> news:1188056925.770017.298540@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com |> |> | On Aug 20, 9:22 am, "Gary S. Terhune" <none> wrote: |> |> |> I wouldn't trust an internet backup solution. If you had the |> |> |> disk space, you could make an image and then store that on the |> |> |> internet, but any scheme that has the backup writing directly |> |> |> to the remote server is almost bound to fail, and would take a |> |> |> long, long time. It's the slowest and least reliable of all the |> |> |> solutions thus far, and I don't think either True Image or |> |> |> Ghost will do the job. Internet backup is a special program |> |> |> that I consider OK for backing up a few files, but not for an |> |> |> image. |> |> |> |> |> |> Your laptop has no LAN or USB port? Does it have a serial port? |> |> |> Does your desktop machine have a serial port? What about LPT |> |> |> ports? |> |> |> |> |> |> -- |> |> |> Gary S. Terhune |> |> |> MS-MVP Shell/Userwww.grystmill.com |> |> | |> |> | Yes Gary, the 98 FE laptop does not have a LAN connection, but |> |> | does have a wireless card, a 1.0 USB port, a serial port and a |> |> | parallel port. Don't think I can drive an external HDD via |> |> | that 1.0 USB port, or run Ghost or True Image with the 98FE's |> |> | laptop's limited resources. |> |> | |> |> | My XP machine is also a laptop with wireless, a 2.0 USB port |> |> | and a parallel (printer) port. I used to be able to get them |> |> | to talk to each other via an ad hoc wireless connection, but |> |> | that stopped working. Also had a crossover cable that |> |> | connected them via the parallel port, but haven't used that for |> |> | awhile. |> |> | |> |> | Does that generate ideas about any other possabilities? |> |> | |> |> | I do like Lil Dave's idea about creating space for a 3rd |> |> | partition on the 98 HDD and creating an image of C: there. I |> |> | do have Partition Magic. Will check to see if anything I have |> |> | will run on FE to create the image. |> |> | |> |> | Thanks again to you all for hanging in here. Nothing critical, |> |> | more a learning experience than anything else, so all your help, |> |> | advise and observations is much appreciated. |> |> |> |> You are welcome. Lil Dave's idea is a good one, if you've got the |> |> space. Have you examined that CD-ROM? Is it an IDE device? If so, |> |> maybe unplug it & put an HDD temporarily in its place. That's a |> |> second or third solution! |> |> |> |> If you have no floppy drive & you want to use BING, you'd have to |> |> make a Maintenance CD on maybe the XP machine, since you cannot |> |> write to the Win98 CD-ROM. Then, install it to the 98's HDD. |> |> -- |> Thanks or Good Luck, |> There may be humor in this post, and, |> Naturally, you will not sue, |> Should things get worse after this, |> PCR |> pcrrcp@netzero.net -- Thanks or Good Luck, There may be humor in this post, and, Naturally, you will not sue, Should things get worse after this, PCR pcrrcp@netzero.net
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