Guest Franc Zabkar Posted October 20, 2007 Posted October 20, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units On Fri, 19 Oct 2007 18:22:50 -0400, "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> put finger to keyboard and composed: >Franc Zabkar wrote: >| It doesn't appear to be a case >| translation issue on your Win98 box. You can save us all a lot of time >| and verify this beyond doubt by using Debug to look at the directory >| structure on your floppy diskette. > >I think he WILL find the case to be correct in the SFN field-- & the LFN >field will be empty! I used Debug to change the SFN directory entry for a file named TAILOR.MAK to tailor.mak. Below are the results (output edited for clarity). Note that the original directory entries were all in uppercase DOS 8.3 format with no LFNs. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WARNING: The "W(rite) command in DEBUG can do serious damage to your file system if you get it wrong. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! C:\WIN98SE>debug -L 100 0 13 1 -D 100 10f 100 54 41 49 4C 4F 52 20 20-4D 41 4B 20 00 00 00 00 TAILOR MAK .... -E 100 "tailor mak" -D 100 100 74 61 69 6C 6F 72 20 20-6D 61 6B 20 00 00 00 00 tailor mak .... 110 00 00 00 00 00 00 97 A8-98 22 1B 00 91 00 00 00 ........."...... 120 53 50 4F 55 53 45 20 20-45 58 45 20 00 00 00 00 SPOUSE EXE .... 130 00 00 F4 36 00 00 19 B0-98 22 49 00 21 1F 00 00 ...6....."I.!... 140 43 55 52 52 45 4E 43 59-46 52 4D 20 00 00 00 00 CURRENCYFRM .... 150 00 00 00 00 00 00 51 A3-98 22 06 00 5D 05 00 00 ......Q.."..]... -W 100 0 13 1 -Q C:\WIN98SE>dir a:\ Volume in drive A has no label Directory of A:\ tailor mak 145 04-24-97 9:04p tailor.mak SPOUSE EXE 7,969 04-24-97 10:00p SPOUSE.EXE CURRENCY FRM 1,373 04-24-97 8:26p CURRENCY.FRM .... CLA5-2 MAK 145 06-12-97 9:29p CLA5-2.MAK 42 file(s) 123,934 bytes 2 dir(s) 1,271,808 bytes free - Franc Zabkar -- Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
Guest a Posted October 20, 2007 Posted October 20, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units So there is way to have the filename correctly displayed in W98 other than renaming them (manually or by an utility)?
Guest Franc Zabkar Posted October 20, 2007 Posted October 20, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units On Sat, 20 Oct 2007 01:17:52 -0400, "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> put finger to keyboard and composed: > Perhaps a review of this Resource Kit document [and other] might help. > > Read to understand XP's filing systems, down to the lower segments >http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/winxppro/reskit/c13621675.mspx I found the same document while researching for this thread but I couldn't see anything that was helpful to the OP. >Or use this link [though you'll miss the necessary leadup related to 8.3 >names, long file names, and blocked file entry aspects]. SEE: >File Naming in Windows XP Professional >File Names on FAT Volumes >Generating Short File Names >http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/winxppro/reskit/c13621675.mspx#EEIBG > > Then over to [if Home Edition]: > >http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/winxppro/reskit/z04d621675.mspx - Franc Zabkar -- Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
Guest Franc Zabkar Posted October 20, 2007 Posted October 20, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units On Sat, 20 Oct 2007 14:00:43 +0200, a <a@libero.it> put finger to keyboard and composed: >So there is way to have the filename correctly displayed in W98 >other than renaming them (manually or by an utility)? The filename *is* correctly displayed in W98, it's just that XP *saves* it as uppercase (but confuses you by *displaying* it as lowercase) whenever it is in 8.3 format. I suggest that you first add the "DontPrettyPath=1" setting to your Win XP registry as described elsewhere. This will force Explorer to display filenames with their actual capitalisation. Then here's one possible way to tackle your problem from the XP end. Let's say your files are .htm files. On the XP system try saving them as .html files. This should force XP to create corresponding lowercase LFNs for each of your 8.3 SFNs. Now on your Win98SE system rename them like this ... ren *.html *.htm This should retain the LFNs and preserve their (lower)case. If this workaround is unacceptable, let us know and I'll post a question to the gurus at alt.msdos.batch. Another possible solution involves 4DOS.com and this single command line: FOR %fn IN (*.txt) REN "%fn" %@REPLACE[ ,_,%@LOWER[" ",%fn]] Let me know if you want to try this. - Franc Zabkar -- Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
Guest PCR Posted October 20, 2007 Posted October 20, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units a wrote: | in the case someone forgot the problem, | I repeat the problem | | ---------------- | | I boot on XP | I create "hallo.txt" with Notepad (or onther type of file | with Winzip, Firefox...) on the XP drive My theory is... WinXP puts that name into the SFN (Short File Name) field with the lower-case letters. It does not put anything into the LFN field. | then I boot on W98 | and that file in Explorer | is shown as "Hallo.txt" You are UNchecked for "Allow all uppercase names" at "Folder Options, View tab". You must CHECK it-- or Win98 will always show just the 1st letter to be capitalized! However, it begins to look to me that only applies to SFNs. Once a LFN is created-- looks like it doesn't matter whether that box is checked or not. | boot back in Xp it is ok (always) That proves the letters really are lower-case in the SFN field, I think. | boot again in W98 it is wrong (always) My theory is... Win98 will only get it right when there is a name in the LFN field. It doesn't care what the case of the letters are in the SFN field. It always shows the SFN to be capitalized! | I don't want the first letter capitalized | | If , booted in W98, I manually rename the | first letter, uncapitalizing it, the problem is solved. When you create a name of any length in Win98 with lower-case letters-- a LFN will be created. Once that is done, the name will look good in Win98 & in WinXP. | note: | if the name is longer then 8 (eg: halllotoeveryone.txt) | the problem doesn't occur WinXP is creating the LFN for that; so, all is well. Too bad it doesn't do it when the only reason to do so is the case of the letters! I think the only cure for SFNs with lower-case letters is to do as you have been doing-- rename them in Win98. OR, just create them in Win98 in the first place. Can't you do that? | ------------------------- -- Thanks or Good Luck, There may be humor in this post, and, Naturally, you will not sue, Should things get worse after this, PCR pcrrcp@netzero.net
Guest PCR Posted October 20, 2007 Posted October 20, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units Franc Zabkar wrote: | On Fri, 19 Oct 2007 18:22:50 -0400, "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> put | finger to keyboard and composed: | |>Franc Zabkar wrote: | |>| It doesn't appear to be a case |>| translation issue on your Win98 box. You can save us all a lot of |>| time and verify this beyond doubt by using Debug to look at the |>| directory structure on your floppy diskette. |> |>I think he WILL find the case to be correct in the SFN field-- & the |>LFN field will be empty! | | I used Debug to change the SFN directory entry for a file named | TAILOR.MAK to tailor.mak. Below are the results (output edited for | clarity). Note that the original directory entries were all in | uppercase DOS 8.3 format with no LFNs. | | !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! | WARNING: The "W(rite) command in DEBUG can do serious damage to your | file system if you get it wrong. | !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You are a brave one, Zabcar! | C:\WIN98SE>debug | -L 100 0 13 1 | -D 100 10f | 100 54 41 49 4C 4F 52 20 20-4D 41 4B 20 00 00 00 00 TAILOR MAK .... | -E 100 "tailor mak" | -D 100 | 100 74 61 69 6C 6F 72 20 20-6D 61 6B 20 00 00 00 00 tailor mak .... | 110 00 00 00 00 00 00 97 A8-98 22 1B 00 91 00 00 00 ........."...... | 120 53 50 4F 55 53 45 20 20-45 58 45 20 00 00 00 00 SPOUSE EXE .... | 130 00 00 F4 36 00 00 19 B0-98 22 49 00 21 1F 00 00 ...6....."I.!... | 140 43 55 52 52 45 4E 43 59-46 52 4D 20 00 00 00 00 CURRENCYFRM .... | 150 00 00 00 00 00 00 51 A3-98 22 06 00 5D 05 00 00 ......Q.."..]... | -W 100 0 13 1 | -Q | | C:\WIN98SE>dir a:\ | | Volume in drive A has no label | Directory of A:\ | | tailor mak 145 04-24-97 9:04p tailor.mak | SPOUSE EXE 7,969 04-24-97 10:00p SPOUSE.EXE | CURRENCY FRM 1,373 04-24-97 8:26p CURRENCY.FRM | ... | CLA5-2 MAK 145 06-12-97 9:29p CLA5-2.MAK | 42 file(s) 123,934 bytes | 2 dir(s) 1,271,808 bytes free It looks to me like you did get the SFN to show up as lower-case. BUT-- does it look like that in Explorer too? It would blow my theory, if it does, presuming FAT12 (on a floppy, I think) would be the same FAT32. My theory, you know, is that Explorer in Win98 doesn't care about the case of letters in the SFN. | - Franc Zabkar | -- | Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email. -- Thanks or Good Luck, There may be humor in this post, and, Naturally, you will not sue, Should things get worse after this, PCR pcrrcp@netzero.net
Guest Franc Zabkar Posted October 21, 2007 Posted October 21, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units On Sat, 20 Oct 2007 18:46:32 -0400, "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> put finger to keyboard and composed: >Franc Zabkar wrote: >| C:\WIN98SE>dir a:\ >| >| Volume in drive A has no label >| Directory of A:\ >| >| tailor mak 145 04-24-97 9:04p tailor.mak >| SPOUSE EXE 7,969 04-24-97 10:00p SPOUSE.EXE >| CURRENCY FRM 1,373 04-24-97 8:26p CURRENCY.FRM >| ... >| CLA5-2 MAK 145 06-12-97 9:29p CLA5-2.MAK >| 42 file(s) 123,934 bytes >| 2 dir(s) 1,271,808 bytes free > >It looks to me like you did get the SFN to show up as lower-case. BUT-- >does it look like that in Explorer too? It would blow my theory, if it >does, presuming FAT12 (on a floppy, I think) would be the same FAT32. > >My theory, you know, is that Explorer in Win98 doesn't care about the >case of letters in the SFN. This is how it looks in W98 Explorer: ... TAILOR.FRM SPOUSE.MAK tailor.mak TRAFFIC.FRM TRAFFIC.FRX TRAFFIC.MAK ... - Franc Zabkar -- Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
Guest a Posted October 21, 2007 Posted October 21, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units On Sun, 21 Oct 2007 08:05:05 +1000, Franc Zabkar <fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> wrote: >On Sat, 20 Oct 2007 14:00:43 +0200, a <a@libero.it> put finger to >keyboard and composed: > >>So there is way to have the filename correctly displayed in W98 >>other than renaming them (manually or by an utility)? > >The filename *is* correctly displayed in W98, it's just that XP >*saves* it as uppercase (but confuses you by *displaying* it as >lowercase) whenever it is in 8.3 format. > >I suggest that you first add the "DontPrettyPath=1" setting to your >Win XP registry as described elsewhere. This will force Explorer to >display filenames with their actual capitalisation. Then here's one >possible way to tackle your problem from the XP end. > >Let's say your files are .htm files. On the XP system try saving them >as .html files. This should force XP to create corresponding lowercase >LFNs for each of your 8.3 SFNs. > >Now on your Win98SE system rename them like this ... > > ren *.html *.htm > >This should retain the LFNs and preserve their (lower)case. > >If this workaround is unacceptable, let us know and I'll post a >question to the gurus at alt.msdos.batch. > >Another possible solution involves 4DOS.com and this single command >line: > > FOR %fn IN (*.txt) REN "%fn" %@REPLACE[ ,_,%@LOWER[" ",%fn]] > >Let me know if you want to try this. > >- Franc Zabkar thanks for your concern, but I think I'm going to give it up all the solutions I'm going to face are too tricky in my opinion also because I have situation where in a same folder I have a mixed case: names with real first letter capitalized and names with fake first letter capitalized, so any batch renaming will fail I was hoping just in a manual and defenitive setting in the Registry or little more
Guest MEB Posted October 21, 2007 Posted October 21, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units Continuing the thought process: Is an older version of the autocompiler available? One which was used either during the *cross-over* time period {9X to XP} or before. -- MEB http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com ________ "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:uVxCLptEIHA.4628@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... | That was my thought as well, Unicode aspects and all these recent updates | to XP [at least we're not discussing VISTA,, ooooowwww], ALL would be | necessarily included in the compiler updates for XP. | | Let us know if you guys figure it out. | | -- | MEB | http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com | ________ | | | "BD" <JustMe@nothome.net> wrote in message | news:OPeX$HtEIHA.3548@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl... | | Not yet. We are looking to see how far back that bug goes. Probably back | to | | when Unicode was first introduced into it which was about 8 months ago. | | That's several releases now. I have a hunch that the new release of the | | compiler will be pushed ahead because there were quite a few fixes this | | time. | | "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message | | news:e5EPswsEIHA.5208@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... | | > Did you get the file to compile properly for the 9X OS? | | > | | > -- | | > MEB | | > http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com | | > ________ | | > | | > | | > "BD" <JustMe@nothome.net> wrote in message | | > news:eqr$yHpEIHA.4196@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... | | > | | | > | "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message | | > | news:OyFva4oEIHA.1056@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... | | > | > | | > | > | | > | > "BD" <JustMe@nothome.net> wrote in message | | > | > news:uNczeSoEIHA.5856@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... | | > | > | "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message | | > | > | news:uMb9v%23lEIHA.4400@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... | | > | > | > No I didn't. I knew you would do so before posting it. I thought | I | | > | > would | | > | > | > be | | > | > | > the 9X test bed for it. | | > | > | > BTW: When we've covered this, I have some questions related to | | > | > GEODISK. | | > | > | > | | > | > | > -- | | > | > | > MEB | | > | > | > ________ | | > | > | I recompiled using a different version of the compiler. Hope it's | | > right | | > | > now. | | > | > | The bug has been fixed in the next compiler release but it's not | | > | > available | | > | > | yet. Also I asked on the developer forum and we are starting to | | > think | | > | > that | | > | > | 98 may not support all lower case. Several people are playing | with | | > it | | > | > right | | > | > | now to find out. | | > | > | http://dundats.mvps.org/Beta/File_LowerCaseA.zip | | > | > | | > | > Well, my web site, retained locally, has upper and lower case files | | > [and | | > | > mixed], so 98 does support lower case. | | > | > Moreover, I have hundreds of lower or mixed case files elsewhere. | For | | > | > instance, the files I have been dowloading from you have a capital, | | > | > whereas | | > | > most of my files and directories are lower case. | | > | > | | > | > IMO, Since the NT file structure in XP is not held the same as in | | > | > DOS/9X/Fat, and handled via the ntfs driver upon creation, the | *hook* | | > to | | > | > Fat32 apparently retains the [original] MSDOS naming structure. | IIRC, | | > | > Seems | | > | > we did several lengthy discussions in here related to comparing | those | | > | > structures, and posted [by various parties] several dozen KBs and | | > other | | > | > materials during those discussions. | | > | > | | > | > Regretfully, that newer file version also creates the same error. | | > | > | | > | > | | | > | > | For safety make sure that you just run this against test files. | | > | > | Example | | > | > | Create a folder on your desktop named Test | | > | > | Create a few files named Test.txt, Test2.txt, Test3.txt etc. | | > | > | Run the app against that folder. | | > | > | | | > | > | BD | | > | > | | | > | > | | | > | > | | > | > I'll have to go back to the site for your email addy, though I think | I | | > | > tried that before and received no answer. | | > | > | | > | > -- | | > | > MEB | | > | > http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com | | > | > ________ | | > | > | | > | > | | > | > | | > | | | > | | | > | | > | | | | | |
Guest BD Posted October 21, 2007 Posted October 21, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:egLoJeAFIHA.4748@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl... > Continuing the thought process: > > Is an older version of the autocompiler available? One which was used > either during the *cross-over* time period {9X to XP} or before. > > -- > MEB > http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com > ________ Yes. The big problem there is a few changes in syntax and I may have to re-write some of the code. I think if I just restore the last version that did not have Unicode support it will work. A lot of code was broken when Unicode was added. I'm expecting the patched version within a day or so. BD
Guest MEB Posted October 21, 2007 Posted October 21, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units "BD" <JustMe@nothome.net> wrote in message news:OuwDwhAFIHA.4752@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... | | "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message | news:egLoJeAFIHA.4748@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl... | > Continuing the thought process: | > | > Is an older version of the autocompiler available? One which was used | > either during the *cross-over* time period {9X to XP} or before. | > | > -- | > MEB | > http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com | > ________ | Yes. The big problem there is a few changes in syntax and I may have to | re-write some of the code. I think if I just restore the last version that | did not have Unicode support it will work. A lot of code was broken when | Unicode was added. I'm expecting the patched version within a day or so. | BD | | Okay, thanks for the update, seems *a* is getting a little antsy . . . -- MEB http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com ________
Guest BD Posted October 21, 2007 Posted October 21, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:u%23WIW6BFIHA.1208@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... > > > Okay, thanks for the update, seems *a* is getting a little antsy . . . > > -- > MEB > http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com > ________ Antsy = The need for speed (NFS) NFS = Things that are broken
Guest PCR Posted October 21, 2007 Posted October 21, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units Franc Zabkar wrote: | On Sat, 20 Oct 2007 18:46:32 -0400, "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> put | finger to keyboard and composed: | |>Franc Zabkar wrote: | |>| C:\WIN98SE>dir a:\ |>| |>| Volume in drive A has no label |>| Directory of A:\ |>| |>| tailor mak 145 04-24-97 9:04p tailor.mak |>| SPOUSE EXE 7,969 04-24-97 10:00p SPOUSE.EXE |>| CURRENCY FRM 1,373 04-24-97 8:26p CURRENCY.FRM |>| ... |>| CLA5-2 MAK 145 06-12-97 9:29p CLA5-2.MAK |>| 42 file(s) 123,934 bytes |>| 2 dir(s) 1,271,808 bytes free |> |>It looks to me like you did get the SFN to show up as lower-case. |>BUT-- does it look like that in Explorer too? It would blow my |>theory, if it does, presuming FAT12 (on a floppy, I think) would be |>the same FAT32. |> |>My theory, you know, is that Explorer in Win98 doesn't care about the |>case of letters in the SFN. | | This is how it looks in W98 Explorer: | | ... | TAILOR.FRM | SPOUSE.MAK | tailor.mak | TRAFFIC.FRM | TRAFFIC.FRX | TRAFFIC.MAK | ... That seems to break my theory. Are you sure there is STILL no LFN for tailor.mac? If XP is putting upper-case letters into SFNs & displaying them as lower-case (which I think is your theory)-- why isn't it doing it to LFNs as well? Didn't OP a say LFNs showed just up fine Win98 after they were created in XP? | - Franc Zabkar | -- | Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email. -- Thanks or Good Luck, There may be humor in this post, and, Naturally, you will not sue, Should things get worse after this, PCR pcrrcp@netzero.net
Guest Franc Zabkar Posted October 21, 2007 Posted October 21, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units On Sun, 21 Oct 2007 16:57:10 -0400, "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> put finger to keyboard and composed: >Franc Zabkar wrote: >| On Sat, 20 Oct 2007 18:46:32 -0400, "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> put >| finger to keyboard and composed: >| >|>Franc Zabkar wrote: >| >|>| C:\WIN98SE>dir a:\ >|>| >|>| Volume in drive A has no label >|>| Directory of A:\ >|>| >|>| tailor mak 145 04-24-97 9:04p tailor.mak >|>| SPOUSE EXE 7,969 04-24-97 10:00p SPOUSE.EXE >|>| CURRENCY FRM 1,373 04-24-97 8:26p CURRENCY.FRM >|>| ... >|>| CLA5-2 MAK 145 06-12-97 9:29p CLA5-2.MAK >|>| 42 file(s) 123,934 bytes >|>| 2 dir(s) 1,271,808 bytes free >|> >|>It looks to me like you did get the SFN to show up as lower-case. >|>BUT-- does it look like that in Explorer too? It would blow my >|>theory, if it does, presuming FAT12 (on a floppy, I think) would be >|>the same FAT32. >|> >|>My theory, you know, is that Explorer in Win98 doesn't care about the >|>case of letters in the SFN. >| >| This is how it looks in W98 Explorer: >| >| ... >| TAILOR.FRM >| SPOUSE.MAK >| tailor.mak >| TRAFFIC.FRM >| TRAFFIC.FRX >| TRAFFIC.MAK >| ... > >That seems to break my theory. Are you sure there is STILL no LFN for >tailor.mac? I changed the case of a second filename using Debug and then enabled the diskette's write-protect tab before quitting. This guarantees that no LFN could have been written to the diskette. As with tailor.mak, Explorer displays the second modified filename in lowercase. >If XP is putting upper-case letters into SFNs & displaying them as >lower-case (which I think is your theory)-- why isn't it doing it to >LFNs as well? Didn't OP a say LFNs showed just up fine Win98 after they >were created in XP? I suspect that XP thinks that any 8.3 filename should follow the old DOS 8.3 format, which is all caps. Unfortunately I don't have an XP box to experiment with, otherwise I'd be testing this for myself. - Franc Zabkar -- Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
Guest PCR Posted October 21, 2007 Posted October 21, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units Franc Zabkar wrote: | On Sun, 21 Oct 2007 16:57:10 -0400, "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> put | finger to keyboard and composed: | |>Franc Zabkar wrote: |>| On Sat, 20 Oct 2007 18:46:32 -0400, "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> put |>| finger to keyboard and composed: |>| |>|>Franc Zabkar wrote: |>| |>|>| C:\WIN98SE>dir a:\ |>|>| |>|>| Volume in drive A has no label |>|>| Directory of A:\ |>|>| |>|>| tailor mak 145 04-24-97 9:04p tailor.mak |>|>| SPOUSE EXE 7,969 04-24-97 10:00p SPOUSE.EXE |>|>| CURRENCY FRM 1,373 04-24-97 8:26p CURRENCY.FRM |>|>| ... |>|>| CLA5-2 MAK 145 06-12-97 9:29p CLA5-2.MAK |>|>| 42 file(s) 123,934 bytes |>|>| 2 dir(s) 1,271,808 bytes free |>|> |>|>It looks to me like you did get the SFN to show up as lower-case. |>|>BUT-- does it look like that in Explorer too? It would blow my |>|>theory, if it does, presuming FAT12 (on a floppy, I think) would be |>|>the same FAT32. |>|> |>|>My theory, you know, is that Explorer in Win98 doesn't care about |>|>the case of letters in the SFN. |>| |>| This is how it looks in W98 Explorer: |>| |>| ... |>| TAILOR.FRM |>| SPOUSE.MAK |>| tailor.mak |>| TRAFFIC.FRM |>| TRAFFIC.FRX |>| TRAFFIC.MAK |>| ... |> |>That seems to break my theory. Are you sure there is STILL no LFN for |>tailor.mac? | | I changed the case of a second filename using Debug and then enabled | the diskette's write-protect tab before quitting. This guarantees that | no LFN could have been written to the diskette. As with tailor.mak, | Explorer displays the second modified filename in lowercase. I think that settles it. There is no reason to think FAT32 is unlike FAT12 in its handling of SFNs. I can only believe it is untrue that Explorer in Win98 would always show SFNs to be in upper-case no matter what their case actually is & that for it to show lower-case letters they would have to be in the LFN. My theory is blown! |>If XP is putting upper-case letters into SFNs & displaying them as |>lower-case (which I think is your theory)-- why isn't it doing it to |>LFNs as well? Didn't OP a say LFNs showed just up fine Win98 after |>they were created in XP? | | I suspect that XP thinks that any 8.3 filename should follow the old | DOS 8.3 format, which is all caps. That's what I thought Win98 must have been doing-- but it wasn't! Why would XP do it? Also, why, then, would XP display them as lower-case? I wonder what shows up in XP for a name like "FiLeNaMe.TxT"? Did anyone say? | Unfortunately I don't have an XP | box to experiment with, otherwise I'd be testing this for myself. Oh, you'd perish of irradiation on the 17th iteration! That is why it is good a has quit & Roxana has taken a sabbatical! | - Franc Zabkar | -- | Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email. -- Thanks or Good Luck, There may be humor in this post, and, Naturally, you will not sue, Should things get worse after this, PCR pcrrcp@netzero.net
Guest MEB Posted October 21, 2007 Posted October 21, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units 10-4 -- MEB http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com ________ "BD" <JustMe@nothome.net> wrote in message news:efGGHFCFIHA.280@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... | | "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message | news:u%23WIW6BFIHA.1208@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... | > | > | > Okay, thanks for the update, seems *a* is getting a little antsy . . . | > | > -- | > MEB | > http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com | > ________ | | Antsy = The need for speed (NFS) | | NFS = Things that are broken | |
Guest PCR Posted October 22, 2007 Posted October 22, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units MEB wrote: | 10-4 Hold Dundat®'s feet to the fire for that code, MEB! Even if he never does come up with it-- at least it will be a cure for the saltwater wrinkles between his toes! | -- | MEB | http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com | ________ | | | "BD" <JustMe@nothome.net> wrote in message | news:efGGHFCFIHA.280@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... || || "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message || news:u%23WIW6BFIHA.1208@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... || > || > || > Okay, thanks for the update, seems *a* is getting a little antsy . || > . . || > || > -- || > MEB || > http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com || > ________ || || Antsy = The need for speed (NFS) || || NFS = Things that are broken -- Thanks or Good Luck, There may be humor in this post, and, Naturally, you will not sue, Should things get worse after this, PCR pcrrcp@netzero.net
Guest Franc Zabkar Posted October 23, 2007 Posted October 23, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units On Mon, 22 Oct 2007 07:20:20 +1000, Franc Zabkar <fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> put finger to keyboard and composed: >I suspect that XP thinks that any 8.3 filename should follow the old >DOS 8.3 format, which is all caps. Unfortunately I don't have an XP >box to experiment with, otherwise I'd be testing this for myself. OK, I now have an XP box for testing. I used Notepad to save a text file as ... noquotes.txt "withquot.txt" longfilename.txt Mix_CaSe.TxT CAPITALS.TXT XP Explorer displays the files exactly as saved, as does a Dir from a CMD window. However, on a W98 box the filenames are displayed as ... NOQUOTES.TXT WITHQUOT.TXT longfilename.txt Mix_CaSe.TxT CAPITALS.TXT Debug shows the following directory structure: 100 E5 4F 51 55 4F 54 45 53-54 58 54 20 18 40 8F 16 .OQUOTESTXT .@.. 110 21 28 21 28 00 00 90 16-21 28 00 00 00 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... 120 4E 4F 51 55 4F 54 45 53-54 58 54 20 18 40 8F 16 NOQUOTESTXT .@.. 130 21 28 21 28 00 00 90 16-21 28 02 00 04 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... 140 E5 49 54 48 51 55 4F 54-54 58 54 20 18 83 A0 16 .ITHQUOTTXT .... 150 21 28 21 28 00 00 A1 16-21 28 00 00 00 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... 160 57 49 54 48 51 55 4F 54-54 58 54 20 18 83 A0 16 WITHQUOTTXT .... 170 21 28 21 28 00 00 A2 16-21 28 03 00 04 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... 180 E5 74 00 78 00 74 00 00-00 FF FF 0F 00 D4 FF FF .t.x.t.......... 190 FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF-FF FF 00 00 FF FF FF FF ................ 1A0 E5 6C 00 6F 00 6E 00 67-00 66 00 0F 00 D4 69 00 .l.o.n.g.f....i. 1B0 6C 00 65 00 6E 00 61 00-6D 00 00 00 65 00 2E 00 l.e.n.a.m...e... 1C0 E5 4F 4E 47 46 49 7E 31-54 58 54 20 00 BA AD 16 .ONGFI~1TXT .... 1D0 21 28 21 28 00 00 AE 16-21 28 00 00 00 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... 1E0 42 74 00 78 00 74 00 00-00 FF FF 0F 00 D4 FF FF Bt.x.t.......... 1F0 FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF-FF FF 00 00 FF FF FF FF ................ 200 01 6C 00 6F 00 6E 00 67-00 66 00 0F 00 D4 69 00 .l.o.n.g.f....i. 210 6C 00 65 00 6E 00 61 00-6D 00 00 00 65 00 2E 00 l.e.n.a.m...e... 220 4C 4F 4E 47 46 49 7E 31-54 58 54 20 00 BA AD 16 LONGFI~1TXT .... 230 21 28 21 28 00 00 AF 16-21 28 04 00 04 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... 240 E5 4D 00 69 00 78 00 5F-00 43 00 0F 00 F5 61 00 .M.i.x._.C....a. 250 53 00 65 00 2E 00 54 00-78 00 00 00 54 00 00 00 S.e...T.x...T... 260 E5 49 58 5F 43 41 53 45-54 58 54 20 00 75 CE 16 .IX_CASETXT .u.. 270 21 28 21 28 00 00 CF 16-21 28 00 00 00 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... 280 41 4D 00 69 00 78 00 5F-00 43 00 0F 00 F5 61 00 AM.i.x._.C....a. 290 53 00 65 00 2E 00 54 00-78 00 00 00 54 00 00 00 S.e...T.x...T... 2A0 4D 49 58 5F 43 41 53 45-54 58 54 20 00 75 CE 16 MIX_CASETXT .u.. 2B0 21 28 21 28 00 00 D0 16-21 28 05 00 04 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... .... 300 E5 41 50 49 54 41 4C 53-54 58 54 20 00 20 2E 18 .APITALSTXT . .. 310 21 28 21 28 00 00 2F 18-21 28 00 00 00 00 00 00 !(!(../.!(...... 320 43 41 50 49 54 41 4C 53-54 58 54 20 00 20 2E 18 CAPITALSTXT . .. 330 21 28 21 28 00 00 2F 18-21 28 08 00 04 00 00 00 !(!(../.!(...... This structure strikes me as peculiar because, although there are several entries that suggest that files have been deleted, I have not in fact deleted any. I can see why W98 displays the filenames as it does, but I can't understand how XP knows that CAPITALSTXT was originally saved as uppercase and NOQUOTESTXT was saved as lowercase (I've rebooted the machine between tests). More testing is in order ... - Franc Zabkar -- Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
Guest Franc Zabkar Posted October 23, 2007 Posted October 23, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units On Tue, 23 Oct 2007 19:21:37 +1000, Franc Zabkar <fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> put finger to keyboard and composed: >I can see why W98 displays the filenames as it does, but I can't >understand how XP knows that CAPITALSTXT was originally saved as >uppercase and NOQUOTESTXT was saved as lowercase (I've rebooted the >machine between tests). > >More testing is in order ... Here is the directory structure after I created a file named UPPRCASE.TXT using Notepad: 100 E5 50 50 52 43 41 53 45-54 58 54 20 00 28 97 2A .PPRCASETXT .(.* 110 21 28 21 28 00 00 98 2A-21 28 00 00 00 00 00 00 !(!(...*!(...... 120 55 50 50 52 43 41 53 45-54 58 54 20 00 28 97 2A UPPRCASETXT .(.* 130 21 28 21 28 00 00 98 2A-21 28 02 00 06 00 00 00 !(!(...*!(...... Here is the same structure after renaming UPPRCASE.TXT to lowrcase.txt in Explorer: 100 E5 50 50 52 43 41 53 45-54 58 54 20 00 28 97 2A .PPRCASETXT .(.* 110 21 28 21 28 00 00 98 2A-21 28 00 00 00 00 00 00 !(!(...*!(...... 120 4C 4F 57 52 43 41 53 45-54 58 54 20 18 28 97 2A LOWRCASETXT .(.* 130 21 28 21 28 00 00 98 2A-21 28 02 00 06 00 00 00 !(!(...*!(...... After renaming lowrcase.txt back to UPPRCASE.TXT, the first structure was restored. There is one byte (location 12C) that appears to determine whether a filename is all uppercase (value = 0x00) or all lowercase (value = 0x18). To test this hypothesis I used Debug to change the value of this byte from 00 to 0x18. XP then displayed the filename as upprcase.txt, which I believe confirms my observation. So it seems that this byte means something to XP but is ignored by Win9x and DOS. In summary I believe that XP will write both an SFN and LFN if the filename is not in 8.3 format, or if the filename is MiXeD CaSe 8.3. Otherwise it will write an SFN with a special byte that indicates whether the filename is ALL CAPS or all lowercase. - Franc Zabkar -- Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
Guest Franc Zabkar Posted October 23, 2007 Posted October 23, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units On Tue, 23 Oct 2007 20:37:00 +1000, Franc Zabkar <fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> put finger to keyboard and composed: >There is one byte (location 12C) that appears to determine whether a >filename is all uppercase (value = 0x00) or all lowercase (value = >0x18). To test this hypothesis I used Debug to change the value of >this byte from 00 to 0x18. XP then displayed the filename as >upprcase.txt, which I believe confirms my observation. So it seems >that this byte means something to XP but is ignored by Win9x and DOS. > >In summary I believe that XP will write both an SFN and LFN if the >filename is not in 8.3 format, or if the filename is MiXeD CaSe 8.3. >Otherwise it will write an SFN with a special byte that indicates >whether the filename is ALL CAPS or all lowercase. After some more thought it occurred to me that the difference between 0x18 and 0x00 is in two bits, and that 2 bits can code for 4 states. Additional experimentation reveals that the "special" byte is coded as follows: 0x00 --> FILENAME.EXT 0x18 --> filename.ext 0x10 --> FILENAME.ext 0x08 --> filename.EXT If the OP is watching, then a workaround for his/her problem would be to rename the files on the XP system as follows ... ren *.htm *.Htm ren *.txt *.Txt ren *.gif *.Gif .... and then on the W98 system restore their original names ... ren *.Htm *.htm ren *.Txt *.txt ren *.Gif *.gif BTW, here is Microsoft's FAT32 File System Specification: http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/system/platform/firmware/fatgen.mspx The "special" byte is documented as follows: "Reserved for use by Windows NT. Set value to 0 when a file is created and never modify or look at it after that." - Franc Zabkar -- Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
Guest a Posted October 24, 2007 Posted October 24, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units On Wed, 24 Oct 2007 06:08:45 +1000, Franc Zabkar <fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> wrote: >If the OP is watching, then a workaround for his/her problem would be >to rename the files on the XP system as follows ... > > ren *.htm *.Htm > ren *.txt *.Txt > ren *.gif *.Gif > >... and then on the W98 system restore their original names ... > > ren *.Htm *.htm > ren *.Txt *.txt > ren *.Gif *.gif i'm here (i'm a man) but I don't understant why now we are facing extensions also I prefer to rename file only once (from W98) (I don't want rename anything indeed...)
Guest PCR Posted October 24, 2007 Posted October 24, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units I've combined & decoded your 3 posts into 1... ---- Original Message ---- From: "Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> Newsgroups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 05:21 AM Subject: Re: UPPERCASE always from other units | On Mon, 22 Oct 2007 07:20:20 +1000, Franc Zabkar | <fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> put finger to keyboard and composed: | |>I suspect that XP thinks that any 8.3 filename should follow the old |>DOS 8.3 format, which is all caps. Unfortunately I don't have an XP |>box to experiment with, otherwise I'd be testing this for myself. | | OK, I now have an XP box for testing. | | I used Notepad to save a text file as ... | | noquotes.txt | "withquot.txt" | longfilename.txt | Mix_CaSe.TxT | CAPITALS.TXT | | XP Explorer displays the files exactly as saved, as does a Dir from a | CMD window. | | However, on a W98 box the filenames are displayed as ... | | NOQUOTES.TXT | WITHQUOT.TXT So, it is only 8.3 names of all lower-case that will show up badly in Win98, after they were created in WinXP. | longfilename.txt | Mix_CaSe.TxT | CAPITALS.TXT | | Debug shows the following directory structure: | | 100 E5 4F 51 55 4F 54 45 53-54 58 54 20 18 40 8F 16 .OQUOTESTXT .@.. | 110 21 28 21 28 00 00 90 16-21 28 00 00 00 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... | 120 4E 4F 51 55 4F 54 45 53-54 58 54 20 18 40 8F 16 NOQUOTESTXT .@.. | 130 21 28 21 28 00 00 90 16-21 28 02 00 04 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... | 140 E5 49 54 48 51 55 4F 54-54 58 54 20 18 83 A0 16 .ITHQUOTTXT .... | 150 21 28 21 28 00 00 A1 16-21 28 00 00 00 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... | 160 57 49 54 48 51 55 4F 54-54 58 54 20 18 83 A0 16 WITHQUOTTXT .... | 170 21 28 21 28 00 00 A2 16-21 28 03 00 04 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... | 180 E5 74 00 78 00 74 00 00-00 FF FF 0F 00 D4 FF FF .t.x.t.......... | 190 FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF-FF FF 00 00 FF FF FF FF ................ | 1A0 E5 6C 00 6F 00 6E 00 67-00 66 00 0F 00 D4 69 00 .l.o.n.g.f....i. | 1B0 6C 00 65 00 6E 00 61 00-6D 00 00 00 65 00 2E 00 l.e.n.a.m...e... | 1C0 E5 4F 4E 47 46 49 7E 31-54 58 54 20 00 BA AD 16 .ONGFI~1TXT .... | 1D0 21 28 21 28 00 00 AE 16-21 28 00 00 00 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... | 1E0 42 74 00 78 00 74 00 00-00 FF FF 0F 00 D4 FF FF Bt.x.t.......... | 1F0 FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF-FF FF 00 00 FF FF FF FF ................ | 200 01 6C 00 6F 00 6E 00 67-00 66 00 0F 00 D4 69 00 .l.o.n.g.f....i. | 210 6C 00 65 00 6E 00 61 00-6D 00 00 00 65 00 2E 00 l.e.n.a.m...e... | 220 4C 4F 4E 47 46 49 7E 31-54 58 54 20 00 BA AD 16 LONGFI~1TXT .... | 230 21 28 21 28 00 00 AF 16-21 28 04 00 04 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... This is what XP did for "Mix_CaSe.TxT"...?... | 240 E5 4D 00 69 00 78 00 5F-00 43 00 0F 00 F5 61 00 .M.i.x._.C....a. | 250 53 00 65 00 2E 00 54 00-78 00 00 00 54 00 00 00 S.e...T.x...T... | 260 E5 49 58 5F 43 41 53 45-54 58 54 20 00 75 CE 16 .IX_CASETXT .u.. | 270 21 28 21 28 00 00 CF 16-21 28 00 00 00 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... | 280 41 4D 00 69 00 78 00 5F-00 43 00 0F 00 F5 61 00 AM.i.x._.C....a. | 290 53 00 65 00 2E 00 54 00-78 00 00 00 54 00 00 00 S.e...T.x...T... | 2A0 4D 49 58 5F 43 41 53 45-54 58 54 20 00 75 CE 16 MIX_CASETXT .u.. | 2B0 21 28 21 28 00 00 D0 16-21 28 05 00 04 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... | ... How does Win98 display it right from that? I guess the 1st four lines are the "deleted" file, & the next four are a LFN & a SFN (which I'd have thought should be reversed in order, though-- the SFN 1st). looks like Win98 is getting it from the LFN, which was part of my own original theory-- that all would be well once a LFN was created. In your earlier doings, it seemed Win98 (Explorer & DOS) was able to pick up lower-case names from the SFN itself-- but, in that case, there was no LFN to choose from. | 300 E5 41 50 49 54 41 4C 53-54 58 54 20 00 20 2E 18 .APITALSTXT . .. | 310 21 28 21 28 00 00 2F 18-21 28 00 00 00 00 00 00 !(!(../.!(...... | 320 43 41 50 49 54 41 4C 53-54 58 54 20 00 20 2E 18 CAPITALSTXT . .. | 330 21 28 21 28 00 00 2F 18-21 28 08 00 04 00 00 00 !(!(../.!(...... | | This structure strikes me as peculiar because, although there are | several entries that suggest that files have been deleted, I have not | in fact deleted any. Very weird! But, I suppose no real harm is done. | I can see why W98 displays the filenames as it does, but I can't | understand how XP knows that CAPITALSTXT was originally saved as | uppercase and NOQUOTESTXT was saved as lowercase (I've rebooted the | machine between tests). | | More testing is in order ... | | - Franc Zabkar | -- | Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email. | On Tue, 23 Oct 2007 19:21:37 +1000, Franc Zabkar | <fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> put finger to keyboard and composed: | |>I can see why W98 displays the filenames as it does, but I can't |>understand how XP knows that CAPITALSTXT was originally saved as |>uppercase and NOQUOTESTXT was saved as lowercase (I've rebooted the |>machine between tests). |> |>More testing is in order ... | | Here is the directory structure after I created a file named | UPPRCASE.TXT using Notepad: | | 100 E5 50 50 52 43 41 53 45-54 58 54 20 00 28 97 2A .PPRCASETXT .(.* | 110 21 28 21 28 00 00 98 2A-21 28 00 00 00 00 00 00 !(!(...*!(...... | 120 55 50 50 52 43 41 53 45-54 58 54 20 00 28 97 2A UPPRCASETXT .(.* | 130 21 28 21 28 00 00 98 2A-21 28 02 00 06 00 00 00 !(!(...*!(...... | | Here is the same structure after renaming UPPRCASE.TXT to lowrcase.txt | in Explorer: | | 100 E5 50 50 52 43 41 53 45-54 58 54 20 00 28 97 2A .PPRCASETXT .(.* | 110 21 28 21 28 00 00 98 2A-21 28 00 00 00 00 00 00 !(!(...*!(...... | 120 4C 4F 57 52 43 41 53 45-54 58 54 20 18 28 97 2A LOWRCASETXT .(.* | 130 21 28 21 28 00 00 98 2A-21 28 02 00 06 00 00 00 !(!(...*!(...... | | After renaming lowrcase.txt back to UPPRCASE.TXT, the first structure | was restored. That is good that yet another deleted name doesn't result! | There is one byte (location 12C) that appears to determine whether a | filename is all uppercase (value = 0x00) or all lowercase (value = | 0x18). To test this hypothesis I used Debug to change the value of | this byte from 00 to 0x18. XP then displayed the filename as | upprcase.txt, which I believe confirms my observation. So it seems | that this byte means something to XP but is ignored by Win9x and DOS. Yep! Very good! But it does put the correct case in all LFNs, (right?). | In summary I believe that XP will write both an SFN and LFN if the | filename is not in 8.3 format, or if the filename is MiXeD CaSe 8.3. | Otherwise it will write an SFN with a special byte that indicates | whether the filename is ALL CAPS or all lowercase. Uhuh. Very good! | - Franc Zabkar | -- | Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email. | On Tue, 23 Oct 2007 20:37:00 +1000, Franc Zabkar | <fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> put finger to keyboard and composed: | |>There is one byte (location 12C) that appears to determine whether a |>filename is all uppercase (value = 0x00) or all lowercase (value = |>0x18). To test this hypothesis I used Debug to change the value of |>this byte from 00 to 0x18. XP then displayed the filename as |>upprcase.txt, which I believe confirms my observation. So it seems |>that this byte means something to XP but is ignored by Win9x and DOS. |> |>In summary I believe that XP will write both an SFN and LFN if the |>filename is not in 8.3 format, or if the filename is MiXeD CaSe 8.3. |>Otherwise it will write an SFN with a special byte that indicates |>whether the filename is ALL CAPS or all lowercase. | | After some more thought it occurred to me that the difference between | 0x18 and 0x00 is in two bits, and that 2 bits can code for 4 states. | Additional experimentation reveals that the "special" byte is coded as | follows: | | 0x00 --> FILENAME.EXT | 0x18 --> filename.ext | 0x10 --> FILENAME.ext | 0x08 --> filename.EXT Yow! Why?? There was never any such thing even in DOS-- that the name could be a different case than the extension! | If the OP is watching, then a workaround for his/her problem would be | to rename the files on the XP system as follows ... | | ren *.htm *.Htm | ren *.txt *.Txt | ren *.gif *.Gif | | ... and then on the W98 system restore their original names ... | | ren *.Htm *.htm | ren *.Txt *.txt | ren *.Gif *.gif Is it necessary to rename them first in XP? And why are you renaming just the extensions? I'd have though just renaming upper to lower-case in 98 would create the LFN. And didn't a say all was well after doing that? | BTW, here is Microsoft's FAT32 File System Specification: | http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/system/platform/firmware/fatgen.mspx | | The "special" byte is documented as follows: | | "Reserved for use by Windows NT. Set value to 0 when a file is created | and never modify or look at it after that." | | - Franc Zabkar | -- | Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email. Thanks or Good Luck, There may be humor in this post, and, Naturally, you will not sue, Should things get worse after this, PCR pcrrcp@netzero.net
Guest Franc Zabkar Posted October 24, 2007 Posted October 24, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units On Wed, 24 Oct 2007 02:11:32 +0200, a <a@libero.it> put finger to keyboard and composed: >On Wed, 24 Oct 2007 06:08:45 +1000, Franc Zabkar ><fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> wrote: > >>If the OP is watching, then a workaround for his/her problem would be >>to rename the files on the XP system as follows ... >> >> ren *.htm *.Htm >> ren *.txt *.Txt >> ren *.gif *.Gif >> >>... and then on the W98 system restore their original names ... >> >> ren *.Htm *.htm >> ren *.Txt *.txt >> ren *.Gif *.gif > > >i'm here (i'm a man) > >but I don't understant why now we are facing extensions >also >I prefer to rename file only once (from W98) >(I don't want rename anything indeed...) Win98 sees all 8.3 short filenames as uppercase, even if they were created with lowercase. To work around this limitation, you need to force XP to add a long filename directory entry for each 8.3 file. The only easy way I can see to do that (using built-in tools) is to create a filename with mixed case at the XP end and then convert it to lowercase at the W98 end. Otherwise, there is the 4DOS method I alluded to elsewhere. 4DOS.com is a freeware equivalent for command.com with many additional features. - Franc Zabkar -- Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
Guest Franc Zabkar Posted October 24, 2007 Posted October 24, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units On Tue, 23 Oct 2007 21:59:10 -0400, "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> put finger to keyboard and composed: >---- Original Message ---- >From: "Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> >This is what XP did for "Mix_CaSe.TxT"...?... > >| 240 E5 4D 00 69 00 78 00 5F-00 43 00 0F 00 F5 61 00 .M.i.x._.C....a. >| 250 53 00 65 00 2E 00 54 00-78 00 00 00 54 00 00 00 S.e...T.x...T... >| 260 E5 49 58 5F 43 41 53 45-54 58 54 20 00 75 CE 16 .IX_CASETXT .u.. >| 270 21 28 21 28 00 00 CF 16-21 28 00 00 00 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... >| 280 41 4D 00 69 00 78 00 5F-00 43 00 0F 00 F5 61 00 AM.i.x._.C....a. >| 290 53 00 65 00 2E 00 54 00-78 00 00 00 54 00 00 00 S.e...T.x...T... >| 2A0 4D 49 58 5F 43 41 53 45-54 58 54 20 00 75 CE 16 MIX_CASETXT .u.. >| 2B0 21 28 21 28 00 00 D0 16-21 28 05 00 04 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... >| ... > >How does Win98 display it right from that? I guess the 1st four lines >are the "deleted" file, & the next four are a LFN & a SFN (which I'd >have thought should be reversed in order, though-- the SFN 1st). looks >like Win98 is getting it from the LFN, which was part of my own original >theory-- that all would be well once a LFN was created. >In your earlier >doings, it seemed Win98 (Explorer & DOS) was able to pick up lower-case >names from the SFN itself-- but, in that case, there was no LFN to >choose from. I don't think I ever wrote that, nor do my data, or Microsoft's documentation, support it. >| There is one byte (location 12C) that appears to determine whether a >| filename is all uppercase (value = 0x00) or all lowercase (value = >| 0x18). To test this hypothesis I used Debug to change the value of >| this byte from 00 to 0x18. XP then displayed the filename as >| upprcase.txt, which I believe confirms my observation. So it seems >| that this byte means something to XP but is ignored by Win9x and DOS. > >Yep! Very good! But it does put the correct case in all LFNs, (right?). The special byte does not appear to be used when LFNs are generated. In the mixed case example above, this byte is 00. >| After some more thought it occurred to me that the difference between >| 0x18 and 0x00 is in two bits, and that 2 bits can code for 4 states. >| Additional experimentation reveals that the "special" byte is coded as >| follows: >| >| 0x00 --> FILENAME.EXT >| 0x18 --> filename.ext >| 0x10 --> FILENAME.ext >| 0x08 --> filename.EXT > >Yow! Why?? There was never any such thing even in DOS-- that the name >could be a different case than the extension! My Seagate SeaTools diskette has a file which displays in XP as RMA.txt and in W98 as RMA.TXT. >| If the OP is watching, then a workaround for his/her problem would be >| to rename the files on the XP system as follows ... >| >| ren *.htm *.Htm >| ren *.txt *.Txt >| ren *.gif *.Gif >| >| ... and then on the W98 system restore their original names ... >| >| ren *.Htm *.htm >| ren *.Txt *.txt >| ren *.Gif *.gif > >Is it necessary to rename them first in XP? And why are you renaming >just the extensions? I'd have though just renaming upper to lower-case >in 98 would create the LFN. And didn't a say all was well after doing >that? See my response to the OP. My workaround avoids having to manually rename each and every file. I can't think of any other way to automate the process without resorting to a third party tool such as 4DOS. You may like to read the post by teebo in the "File size/Number of file limits" thread. He/she seems to be having the same problem as the OP. - Franc Zabkar -- Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
Guest PCR Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 Re: UPPERCASE always from other units Franc Zabkar wrote: | On Tue, 23 Oct 2007 21:59:10 -0400, "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> put | finger to keyboard and composed: | |>---- Original Message ---- |>From: "Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> | |>This is what XP did for "Mix_CaSe.TxT"...?... |> 240 E5 4D 00 69 00 78 00 5F-00 43 00 0F 00 F5 61 00 .M.i.x._.C....a. 250 53 00 65 00 2E 00 54 00-78 00 00 00 54 00 00 00 S.e...T.x...T... 260 E5 49 58 5F 43 41 53 45-54 58 54 20 00 75 CE 16 .IX_CASETXT .u.. 270 21 28 21 28 00 00 CF 16-21 28 00 00 00 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... 280 41 4D 00 69 00 78 00 5F-00 43 00 0F 00 F5 61 00 AM.i.x._.C....a. 290 53 00 65 00 2E 00 54 00-78 00 00 00 54 00 00 00 S.e...T.x...T... 2A0 4D 49 58 5F 43 41 53 45-54 58 54 20 00 75 CE 16 MIX_CASETXT .u.. 2B0 21 28 21 28 00 00 D0 16-21 28 05 00 04 00 00 00 !(!(....!(...... |> |>How does Win98 display it right from that? I guess the 1st four lines |>are the "deleted" file, & the next four are a LFN & a SFN (which I'd |>have thought should be reversed in order, though-- the SFN 1st). looks |>like Win98 is getting it from the LFN, which was part of my own |>original theory-- that all would be well once a LFN was created. | |>In your earlier |>doings, it seemed Win98 (Explorer & DOS) was able to pick up |>lower-case names from the SFN itself-- but, in that case, there was |>no LFN to choose from. | | I don't think I ever wrote that, nor do my data, or Microsoft's | documentation, support it. ?!HUH!? DIDN'T you use Debug to put lower-case letters into a SFN & state Win98's Explorer showed it correctly...!?!... news:ku5jh31224rn6tcjchv405t811n97dg091@4ax.com news:4g7lh3ht28cte6ji7srbu4g3ar43hfpjbn@4ax.com Oh, my God! I SAID you shouldn't do more that 16 iterations on that XP-machine! Looks like XP-irradiation induced memory loss & dementia to me! |>| There is one byte (location 12C) that appears to determine whether a |>| filename is all uppercase (value = 0x00) or all lowercase (value = |>| 0x18). To test this hypothesis I used Debug to change the value of |>| this byte from 00 to 0x18. XP then displayed the filename as |>| upprcase.txt, which I believe confirms my observation. So it seems |>| that this byte means something to XP but is ignored by Win9x and |>| DOS. |> |>Yep! Very good! But it does put the correct case in all LFNs, |>(right?). | | The special byte does not appear to be used when LFNs are generated. | In the mixed case example above, this byte is 00. Uhuh. I see. |>| After some more thought it occurred to me that the difference |>| between 0x18 and 0x00 is in two bits, and that 2 bits can code for |>| 4 states. Additional experimentation reveals that the "special" |>| byte is coded as follows: |>| |>| 0x00 --> FILENAME.EXT |>| 0x18 --> filename.ext |>| 0x10 --> FILENAME.ext |>| 0x08 --> filename.EXT |> |>Yow! Why?? There was never any such thing even in DOS-- that the name |>could be a different case than the extension! | | My Seagate SeaTools diskette has a file which displays in XP as | RMA.txt and in W98 as RMA.TXT. Right. SO... what on earth is XP trying to be compatible with, by doing this nutty bit thing separately on the name & on the extension? Although you seem to have forgotten your own momentous discovery-- I'm still fairly certain you did discover that both DOS & Win98's Explorer were fine (at least for display purposes) with actual lower-case letters in the SFN in the first place! (I still think Win98 won't actually itself put lower-case letters into a SFN.) |>| If the OP is watching, then a workaround for his/her problem would |>| be to rename the files on the XP system as follows ... |>| |>| ren *.htm *.Htm |>| ren *.txt *.Txt |>| ren *.gif *.Gif |>| |>| ... and then on the W98 system restore their original names ... |>| |>| ren *.Htm *.htm |>| ren *.Txt *.txt |>| ren *.Gif *.gif |> |>Is it necessary to rename them first in XP? And why are you renaming |>just the extensions? I'd have though just renaming upper to lower-case |>in 98 would create the LFN. And didn't a say all was well after doing |>that? | | See my response to the OP. My workaround avoids having to manually | rename each and every file. I can't think of any other way to automate | the process without resorting to a third party tool such as 4DOS. I saw. Still-- you are renaming them in XP & then in 98. Wouldn't it be sufficient to just rename them in 98 to get a LFN generated & with the proper lower-case letters in it? | You may like to read the post by teebo in the "File size/Number of | file limits" thread. He/she seems to be having the same problem as the | OP. I'll look for it. Thanks. | - Franc Zabkar | -- | Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email. -- Thanks or Good Luck, There may be humor in this post, and, Naturally, you will not sue, Should things get worse after this, PCR pcrrcp@netzero.net
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