Guest Don Phillipson Posted October 26, 2007 Posted October 26, 2007 Advice would be welcomed about what to do and in which order. 1. Win98SE PC hung (rare event here, especially with only a couple of apps loaded) so rebooted via front panel hot reboot button. 2. BIOS then reported no 2nd hard drive (Primary slave). It reported both CD drives as Atapi CD-Rom when (I think) it normally identifies them by brand and type (on CD-ROM, other DVD RW) 3. Boot process was very slow. DOS CHKDSK took 4.5 min. overall (on HDD #1, 5 logical drives total 80 Gb, 75 pct. full). 4. After Win98 loaded HDD #2 (drive H) was absent, Fix It Utilies Scandiisk would not load at all, MS CHKDSK found and repaired errors in c:/windows/sysbckup and c:/Corel. 5. Standard reboot took 2 min. overall (was formerly about 45 sec.) 6. Linux (Xandros Debian) also boots OK, perhaps a bit slower than usual (I have not timed this lately) and sees no HDD #2. Possibilities: A. CMOS battery is dying (3 years old). B. Bad power supply to HDD #2. (There are several spares in the case, at least one tested defective in an earlier configuration.) B2. Bad data cable to HDD #2. C. HDD #1 is damaged, possibly in boot sector. I should welcome advice if anyone sees a familiar pattern here. I do not (yet.) Don P Carlsbad Springs.
Guest Brian A. Posted October 26, 2007 Posted October 26, 2007 Re: Lost second hard drive "Don Phillipson" <d.phillipsonSPAMBLOCK@ncf.ca> wrote in message news:eEhhGXAGIHA.3360@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... > Advice would be welcomed about what to do and > in which order. > 1. Win98SE PC hung (rare event here, especially > with only a couple of apps loaded) so rebooted > via front panel hot reboot button. > 2. BIOS then reported no 2nd hard drive > (Primary slave). It reported both CD drives > as Atapi CD-Rom when (I think) it normally > identifies them by brand and type (on CD-ROM, > other DVD RW) > 3. Boot process was very slow. DOS CHKDSK > took 4.5 min. overall (on HDD #1, 5 logical > drives total 80 Gb, 75 pct. full). > 4. After Win98 loaded HDD #2 (drive H) was > absent, Fix It Utilies Scandiisk would not > load at all, MS CHKDSK found and repaired > errors in c:/windows/sysbckup and c:/Corel. > 5. Standard reboot took 2 min. overall (was > formerly about 45 sec.) > 6. Linux (Xandros Debian) also boots OK, perhaps > a bit slower than usual (I have not timed this > lately) and sees no HDD #2. > > Possibilities: > A. CMOS battery is dying (3 years old). If the BIOS doesn't see the 2nd hd, the OS isn't installed on it and you can boot the machine, then the CMOS battery is not the issue with that drive. > B. Bad power supply to HDD #2. (There are several > spares in the case, at least one tested > defective in an earlier configuration.) Swap the molex connectors around to see if the drive gets power or test the connectors with a volt meter. > B2. Bad data cable to HDD #2. Swap out the data cable with a known good one to see if it's good or bad. > C. HDD #1 is damaged, possibly in boot sector. The boot sector wouldn't have any effect on the BIOS not seeing the 2nd drive. > > I should welcome advice if anyone sees a familiar > pattern here. I do not (yet.) You could try to manually set the 2nd drives parameters in the bios and see if it gets recognized, although IMHO it's a long shot. Test the drive in a different PC and see if it is recognized, if not it may be toast. -- Brian A. Sesko { MS MVP_Shell/User } Conflicts start where information lacks. http://basconotw.mvps.org/ Suggested posting do's/don'ts: http://www.dts-l.org/goodpost.htm How to ask a question: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375
Guest Don Phillipson Posted October 27, 2007 Posted October 27, 2007 Re: Lost second hard drive "Don Phillipson" <d.phillipsonSPAMBLOCK@ncf.ca> wrote in message > news:eEhhGXAGIHA.3360@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... > > Advice would be welcomed about what to do and > > in which order. > > 1. Win98SE PC hung (rare event here, especially > > with only a couple of apps loaded) so rebooted > > via front panel hot reboot button. > > 2. BIOS then reported no 2nd hard drive > > (Primary slave). It reported both CD drives > > as Atapi CD-Rom when (I think) it normally > > identifies them by brand and type (on CD-ROM, > > other DVD RW) > > 3. Boot process was very slow. DOS CHKDSK > > > > Possibilities: > > A. CMOS battery is dying (3 years old). "Brian A." <gonefish'n@afarawaylake> wrote in message news:e9dYUoAGIHA.4752@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... > If the BIOS doesn't see the 2nd hd, the OS isn't installed on it and you can boot > the machine, then the CMOS battery is not the issue with that drive. > > > B. Bad power supply to HDD #2. (There are several > > spares in the case, at least one tested > > defective in an earlier configuration.) > > Swap the molex connectors around to see if the drive gets power or test the > connectors with a volt meter. > > > B2. Bad data cable to HDD #2. > > Swap out the data cable with a known good one to see if it's good or bad. > > > C. HDD #1 is damaged, possibly in boot sector. > > The boot sector wouldn't have any effect on the BIOS not seeing the 2nd drive. Thanks for food for thought. We also now have 4th possibility: D. Overheating inside the case? because yesterday I switched off overnight. (This PC is normally kept always on, with a reboot every couple of days.) This morning it started perfectly i.e. -- BIOS identified all drives by brand and serial no -- Win98 loaded fast as usual (via Xandros boot selector menu) -- HDD #2 is there OK (and DOS Scandisk ran before Windows started, i.e. remembered its need to do so after yesterday's system hang.) So PC operation appears OK but gave me an inconvenient fright. I agree it is good policy to reinstal the OS every year or two, not done her because this CPU runs at 2.8 GHz i.e. encounters during installation the NDIS glitch that prevents rebooting (not fixed by MS NDISFIX). Once in 10 or 12 attempts OS installation completes OK, as first in August 2004, but I have not the patience to risk such interruptions another time. -- Don Phillipson Carlsbad Springs (Ottawa, Canada)
Guest Brian A. Posted October 27, 2007 Posted October 27, 2007 Re: Lost second hard drive "Don Phillipson" <d.phillipsonSPAMBLOCK@rogers.com> wrote in message news:uL$5p5JGIHA.1212@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... > "Don Phillipson" <d.phillipsonSPAMBLOCK@ncf.ca> wrote in message >> news:eEhhGXAGIHA.3360@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... >> > Advice would be welcomed about what to do and >> > in which order. >> > 1. Win98SE PC hung (rare event here, especially >> > with only a couple of apps loaded) so rebooted >> > via front panel hot reboot button. >> > 2. BIOS then reported no 2nd hard drive >> > (Primary slave). It reported both CD drives >> > as Atapi CD-Rom when (I think) it normally >> > identifies them by brand and type (on CD-ROM, >> > other DVD RW) >> > 3. Boot process was very slow. DOS CHKDSK >> > >> > Possibilities: >> > A. CMOS battery is dying (3 years old). > > "Brian A." <gonefish'n@afarawaylake> wrote in message > news:e9dYUoAGIHA.4752@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... > >> If the BIOS doesn't see the 2nd hd, the OS isn't installed on it and you > can boot >> the machine, then the CMOS battery is not the issue with that drive. >> >> > B. Bad power supply to HDD #2. (There are several >> > spares in the case, at least one tested >> > defective in an earlier configuration.) >> >> Swap the molex connectors around to see if the drive gets power or test > the >> connectors with a volt meter. >> >> > B2. Bad data cable to HDD #2. >> >> Swap out the data cable with a known good one to see if it's good or > bad. >> >> > C. HDD #1 is damaged, possibly in boot sector. >> >> The boot sector wouldn't have any effect on the BIOS not seeing the 2nd > drive. > > Thanks for food for thought. We also now have 4th possibility: > D. Overheating inside the case? > because yesterday I switched off overnight. (This PC > is normally kept always on, with a reboot every couple > of days.) This morning it started perfectly i.e. > -- BIOS identified all drives by brand and serial no > -- Win98 loaded fast as usual (via Xandros boot selector menu) > -- HDD #2 is there OK (and DOS Scandisk ran before Windows > started, i.e. remembered its need to do so after yesterday's > system hang.) It wouldn't be a bad idea to pull the cover off the box and check the components inside for any excessive heat. If your careful and have enough room to get a hand in without much difficulty, you can do a simple touch test for starters without shutting down although I don't recommend it still being powered up. While your at it you might want to check all of the connections to make sure they are properly seated and/or secure. > > So PC operation appears OK but gave me an inconvenient > fright. I agree it is good policy to reinstal the OS every > year or two, not done her because this CPU runs at 2.8 GHz > i.e. encounters during installation the NDIS glitch that > prevents rebooting (not fixed by MS NDISFIX). Once in > 10 or 12 attempts OS installation completes OK, as first > in August 2004, but I have not the patience to risk such > interruptions another time. You should run an integrity check on the HD also in the event it may just be going South, if it happens again it may not only be a fright. I'm not one who follows that policy so many others believe in. I believe in staying on top of it with good housekeeping and maintenence to prevent over clutter. I too, know all to well what type of battle one can go through with the higher CPU's. Had a good one once with a 2.4 GHz and 98SE, and that was only part of the battle as it didn't want to play nice with the 2 GB of RAM either. -- Brian A. Sesko { MS MVP_Shell/User } Conflicts start where information lacks. http://basconotw.mvps.org/ Suggested posting do's/don'ts: http://www.dts-l.org/goodpost.htm How to ask a question: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375
Guest PCR Posted October 30, 2007 Posted October 30, 2007 Re: Lost second hard drive Don Phillipson wrote: | "Don Phillipson" <d.phillipsonSPAMBLOCK@ncf.ca> wrote in message |> news:eEhhGXAGIHA.3360@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... |> > Advice would be welcomed about what to do and |> > in which order. |> > 1. Win98SE PC hung (rare event here, especially |> > with only a couple of apps loaded) so rebooted |> > via front panel hot reboot button. |> > 2. BIOS then reported no 2nd hard drive |> > (Primary slave). It reported both CD drives |> > as Atapi CD-Rom when (I think) it normally |> > identifies them by brand and type (on CD-ROM, |> > other DVD RW) |> > 3. Boot process was very slow. DOS CHKDSK |> > |> > Possibilities: |> > A. CMOS battery is dying (3 years old). | | "Brian A." <gonefish'n@afarawaylake> wrote in message | news:e9dYUoAGIHA.4752@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... | |> If the BIOS doesn't see the 2nd hd, the OS isn't installed on it |> and you can boot the machine, then the CMOS battery is not the issue |> with that drive. |> |> > B. Bad power supply to HDD #2. (There are several |> > spares in the case, at least one tested |> > defective in an earlier configuration.) |> |> Swap the molex connectors around to see if the drive gets power or |> test the connectors with a volt meter. |> |> > B2. Bad data cable to HDD #2. |> |> Swap out the data cable with a known good one to see if it's good |> or bad. |> |> > C. HDD #1 is damaged, possibly in boot sector. |> |> The boot sector wouldn't have any effect on the BIOS not seeing |> the 2nd drive. | | Thanks for food for thought. We also now have 4th possibility: | D. Overheating inside the case? | because yesterday I switched off overnight. (This PC | is normally kept always on, with a reboot every couple | of days.) This morning it started perfectly i.e. | -- BIOS identified all drives by brand and serial no | -- Win98 loaded fast as usual (via Xandros boot selector menu) | -- HDD #2 is there OK (and DOS Scandisk ran before Windows | started, i.e. remembered its need to do so after yesterday's | system hang.) | | So PC operation appears OK but gave me an inconvenient | fright. I agree it is good policy to reinstal the OS every | year or two, not done her because this CPU runs at 2.8 GHz | i.e. encounters during installation the NDIS glitch that | prevents rebooting (not fixed by MS NDISFIX). Once in | 10 or 12 attempts OS installation completes OK, as first | in August 2004, but I have not the patience to risk such | interruptions another time. I am glad you have recovered. I must agree with Brian A. that you should take this as a sign that the actual day of destruction may not be too far off, though! After all, didn't they begin singing about it in the 60's!? BETTER practice shutting the computer off when not in use, &/or find another way to prevent an overheating! Also, make a full system backup, even with that... http://www.xxcopy.com/ Yabumoto's Detailed Procedure Copy (Free) ....that you often speak so highly of! (But I use... http://www.bootitng.com/ 's BootIt NG, has a variety of backup capabilities & works with all OS: Copy partition(s) to HDD, or Image to HDD or to CD or DVD. Create, move, shrink or expand partitions without data loss. Multi-boot too. To install & use beyond 30 days, $34.95.) | -- | Don Phillipson | Carlsbad Springs | (Ottawa, Canada) -- Thanks or Good Luck, There may be humor in this post, and, Naturally, you will not sue, Should things get worse after this, PCR pcrrcp@netzero.net
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