Burning CD's is a HUGE HASSLE

November 26, 2007

What ever happened to the good old days where all that was needed was

a simple floppy disk, and files could be dragged and dropped from

Windows, or use the "copy command" from dos.

After not even owning a CD player for years, I just bought an external

Iomega ZipCD player and recorder, connected to my USB port. After a

little hassle getting the drivers installed, it works fine, and I was

able to install a few CD's that have been sitting on the shelf for the

last several years.

On the other hand, I have never burned a CD or DVD or anything. This

drive came with Iomega Hot Burn Pro. I have played with it, but have

not yet purchased any blanks. One thing I am not sure whether to get

the Write once or Multi-write ones. Worse yet, which are which. In

the store they had R and RW. What do these letters mean? I thought

that R meant READ and RW meant READ-WRITE. But what good is a blank

CD that is only readable? The Walmart clerk did not know what I was

talking about (typical Walmart idiot), so I left the store not buying

any discs because I did not know what to buy.

Then, when I finally do get the disks, what do I do next?

The software has the following options to select.

Music Disc

Data Disc

MP3/WMA Disc

Disc Copy

CD Label

MP3's are music, so why is there both a "music disc" and a "MP3/WMA"

option?

I am sure the Data Disc is for backups and saving files off the hard

drive. And I know that CD Label makes labels (which my laser printer

would unlikely be able to make.

Then I started to select a bunch of MP3 files on my harddrive and it

told me that they will not all fit. Well, DUH..... Why does it not

tell me where to stop, assuming I will need several discs?

Do I need to manually copy the files to a special directory until I

know I have no more than 700 megs (or is it 650, since several

websites do not agree and list 650 on some and 700 on other sites for

the max capacity).

Then it says that MP3's can not be played on a standard CD player on a

stereo. What's the point of putting them on a CD if they wont play

(other than as a backup).

On to the Data Disc.

Am I going to have to manually select files till I reach the 650 or

700 meg limit? I dont see any option to have it just tell me to

insert another disc when one is full.

I spent half a day reading help files and websites, and this seems to

be the most complicated thing any computer can do. Like I said, what

ever happened to the good old days of floppies. Just copy the files

and the job is done. It looks like with CD's there are hours if not

days of preparation required before making each and every CD.

Now I know why I never wanted to own one of these cd burners.

I'm seriously thinking that although it will cost more, I may be

better off just buying a pile of those memory sticks for backing up my

computer, and forgetting the CD burning. At least I got a CD player

now.

By the way, if I ever do get this thing to work, how can I label them

with a pen or something like that? I dont have the printer to make

labels and it all seems like too much hassle anyhow. But they do need

some soft of label, even just numbering them would help. I have at

least a dozen CDs that other people made for them, and none have

labels, so I got to install them one by one to see what is on them.

Either I'm too old for this, or I just dont understand any of it.

By the way I'm runing 98SE.

Jim

November 26, 2007

Re: Burning CD's is a HUGE HASSLE

jameswalker7@invalid.com wrote:

> What ever happened to the good old days where all that was needed was

> a simple floppy disk, and files could be dragged and dropped from

> Windows, or use the "copy command" from dos.

Those days are LONG gone.

> After not even owning a CD player for years, I just bought an external

> Iomega ZipCD player and recorder, connected to my USB port. After a

> little hassle getting the drivers installed, it works fine, and I was

> able to install a few CD's that have been sitting on the shelf for the

> last several years.

>

> On the other hand, I have never burned a CD or DVD or anything. This

> drive came with Iomega Hot Burn Pro. I have played with it, but have

> not yet purchased any blanks. One thing I am not sure whether to get

> the Write once or Multi-write ones. Worse yet, which are which. In

> the store they had R and RW. What do these letters mean? I thought

> that R meant READ and RW meant READ-WRITE. But what good is a blank

> CD that is only readable? The Walmart clerk did not know what I was

> talking about (typical Walmart idiot), so I left the store not buying

> any discs because I did not know what to buy.

>

> Then, when I finally do get the disks, what do I do next?

>

> The software has the following options to select.

> Music Disc

> Data Disc

> MP3/WMA Disc

> Disc Copy

> CD Label

>

> MP3's are music, so why is there both a "music disc" and a "MP3/WMA"

> option?

Just two different formats. Keep researching it.

> I am sure the Data Disc is for backups and saving files off the hard

> drive. And I know that CD Label makes labels (which my laser printer

> would unlikely be able to make.

>

> Then I started to select a bunch of MP3 files on my harddrive and it

> told me that they will not all fit. Well, DUH..... Why does it not

> tell me where to stop, assuming I will need several discs?

>

> Do I need to manually copy the files to a special directory until I

> know I have no more than 700 megs (or is it 650, since several

> websites do not agree and list 650 on some and 700 on other sites for

> the max capacity).

>

> Then it says that MP3's can not be played on a standard CD player on a

> stereo. What's the point of putting them on a CD if they wont play

> (other than as a backup).

>

> I spent half a day reading help files and websites, and this seems to

> be the most complicated thing any computer can do.

A half day isn't really long enough to get into this stuff with all the

questions you have. It will take more research than that.

Also, you might try the (more appropriate_ windows multimedia newsgroups,

when you get to a specific question or two.

November 26, 2007

Re: Burning CD's is a HUGE HASSLE

<jameswalker7@invalid.com> wrote in message

news:fagkk3hfkk5ok9h7cvrjno8ad5rb909sdk@4ax.com...

| What ever happened to the good old days where all that was needed was

| a simple floppy disk, and files could be dragged and dropped from

| Windows, or use the "copy command" from dos.

|

| After not even owning a CD player for years, I just bought an external

| Iomega ZipCD player and recorder, connected to my USB port. After a

| little hassle getting the drivers installed, it works fine, and I was

| able to install a few CD's that have been sitting on the shelf for the

| last several years.

So at least that was useful, eh..

|

| On the other hand, I have never burned a CD or DVD or anything. This

| drive came with Iomega Hot Burn Pro. I have played with it, but have

| not yet purchased any blanks. One thing I am not sure whether to get

| the Write once or Multi-write ones. Worse yet, which are which. In

| the store they had R and RW. What do these letters mean? I thought

| that R meant READ and RW meant READ-WRITE. But what good is a blank

| CD that is only readable? The Walmart clerk did not know what I was

| talking about (typical Walmart idiot), so I left the store not buying

| any discs because I did not know what to buy.

CDR - write once

CDRW - write more than once - deletable/re-writable

Most people use CDR, due to the present low cost.

|

| Then, when I finally do get the disks, what do I do next?

|

| The software has the following options to select.

| Music Disc

| Data Disc

| MP3/WMA Disc

| Disc Copy

| CD Label

|

| MP3's are music, so why is there both a "music disc" and a "MP3/WMA"

| option?

Different sound formats, different storage techniques ...

|

| I am sure the Data Disc is for backups and saving files off the hard

| drive. And I know that CD Label makes labels (which my laser printer

| would unlikely be able to make.

Actually it probably would. The Label Maker program would be controlling

the printer..

|

| Then I started to select a bunch of MP3 files on my harddrive and it

| told me that they will not all fit. Well, DUH..... Why does it not

| tell me where to stop, assuming I will need several discs?

It should have if you were using the burner program... you weren't trying

this in Explorer were you? That type of copying would generally take a

packet writer/driver..

|

| Do I need to manually copy the files to a special directory until I

| know I have no more than 700 megs (or is it 650, since several

| websites do not agree and list 650 on some and 700 on other sites for

| the max capacity).

Not sure about your particular program, but again, it should have something

in the BURNING program which indicates how many and what files, and their

total amount.

650 is the *norm*, overburning can allow more than that for data CDs,

leadin and leadout, and directory entries all take up some space..

Music CD burning is based upon minutes, though that coverts to size at

approximately 700 to 800. There is some overhead involved depending upon the

format used, so that's part of the variable...

|

| Then it says that MP3's can not be played on a standard CD player on a

| stereo. What's the point of putting them on a CD if they wont play

| (other than as a backup).

Some DVD/CDROM home players support MP3 as do some car stereo systems, and

some home stereos. However, they general state such support somewhere [label

or manual]. The key word was *standard*, though in today's world MP3s are

pretty standard, so most players generally have that support ...

|

| On to the Data Disc.

| Am I going to have to manually select files till I reach the 650 or

| 700 meg limit? I dont see any option to have it just tell me to

| insert another disc when one is full.

Manual backups, or just burning a few files will require you to limit the

total. You can burn just a few or burn a full disk, but each will be limited

to the blank's capacity. Again, the software program should have a bar or

some other indication showing the amount presently *qued* for burning.

If the software includes a BACKUP program, then it will likely ask for

another disk when full.

|

| I spent half a day reading help files and websites, and this seems to

| be the most complicated thing any computer can do. Like I said, what

| ever happened to the good old days of floppies. Just copy the files

| and the job is done. It looks like with CD's there are hours if not

| days of preparation required before making each and every CD.

Nah, just seems that way,,, try to remember the first time you used a

floppy,, how many times did you screw-up...

CDR disks are relatively inexpensive, so purchase some and play around till

you get the feel for the software and how its done.

|

| Now I know why I never wanted to own one of these cd burners.

|

| I'm seriously thinking that although it will cost more, I may be

| better off just buying a pile of those memory sticks for backing up my

| computer, and forgetting the CD burning. At least I got a CD player

| now.

Not a good idea,, as with any device based upon a chip, some degradation

may occur over time. They're good for temporary storage, but not recommended

for long term. You're not likely to be able to continually supply an

electro-magnetic free environment in your own home. CDROM's [or DVD style]

can also decay to some extent over long periods, and certainly can be

damaged, but for the cost per disk they can't presently be beat for long

term occassional use permanent storage.

|

| By the way, if I ever do get this thing to work, how can I label them

| with a pen or something like that? I dont have the printer to make

| labels and it all seems like too much hassle anyhow. But they do need

| some soft of label, even just numbering them would help. I have at

| least a dozen CDs that other people made for them, and none have

| labels, so I got to install them one by one to see what is on them.

You can use a regular "magic" marker or paint pen to label them [on the

label side]. Make sure you do NOT scratch the surface trying to use a pencil

or pen...

To view the disks: Just put the CD in the drive and look at it from

Explorer...

|

| Either I'm too old for this, or I just dont understand any of it.

|

| By the way I'm runing 98SE.

|

| Jim

|

Hey, we all went through the learning curve,,, you should have been here

when CDROM devices first came out, not fun or cheap at all ...

--

MEB

http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com

________

November 26, 2007

Re: Burning CD's is a HUGE HASSLE

On Sun, 25 Nov 2007 22:29:08 -0700, "Bill in Co."

<not_really_here@earthlink.net> wrote:

>jameswalker7@invalid.com wrote:

>> What ever happened to the good old days where all that was needed was

>> a simple floppy disk, and files could be dragged and dropped from

>> Windows, or use the "copy command" from dos.

>

>Those days are LONG gone.

>

>> After not even owning a CD player for years, I just bought an external

>> Iomega ZipCD player and recorder, connected to my USB port. After a

>> little hassle getting the drivers installed, it works fine, and I was

>> able to install a few CD's that have been sitting on the shelf for the

>> last several years.

>>

>> On the other hand, I have never burned a CD or DVD or anything. This

>> drive came with Iomega Hot Burn Pro. I have played with it, but have

>> not yet purchased any blanks. One thing I am not sure whether to get

>> the Write once or Multi-write ones. Worse yet, which are which. In

>> the store they had R and RW. What do these letters mean? I thought

>> that R meant READ and RW meant READ-WRITE. But what good is a blank

>> CD that is only readable? The Walmart clerk did not know what I was

>> talking about (typical Walmart idiot), so I left the store not buying

>> any discs because I did not know what to buy.

>>

>> Then, when I finally do get the disks, what do I do next?

>>

>> The software has the following options to select.

>> Music Disc

>> Data Disc

>> MP3/WMA Disc

>> Disc Copy

>> CD Label

>>

>> MP3's are music, so why is there both a "music disc" and a "MP3/WMA"

>> option?

>

>Just two different formats. Keep researching it.

>

>> I am sure the Data Disc is for backups and saving files off the hard

>> drive. And I know that CD Label makes labels (which my laser printer

>> would unlikely be able to make.

>>

>> Then I started to select a bunch of MP3 files on my harddrive and it

>> told me that they will not all fit. Well, DUH..... Why does it not

>> tell me where to stop, assuming I will need several discs?

>>

>> Do I need to manually copy the files to a special directory until I

>> know I have no more than 700 megs (or is it 650, since several

>> websites do not agree and list 650 on some and 700 on other sites for

>> the max capacity).

>>

>> Then it says that MP3's can not be played on a standard CD player on a

>> stereo. What's the point of putting them on a CD if they wont play

>> (other than as a backup).

>>

>> I spent half a day reading help files and websites, and this seems to

>> be the most complicated thing any computer can do.

>

>A half day isn't really long enough to get into this stuff with all the

>questions you have. It will take more research than that.

>

>Also, you might try the (more appropriate_ windows multimedia newsgroups,

>when you get to a specific question or two.

>

Thank You

You just answered my question by not answering anything. I can see

now this is far too complicated to answer, and thus means it's too

complicated for someone as old as me. I already wasted too much time

on this nonsense.

Just like everything these days, the mindset of the young generation

is to make everything as complicated, costly, and difficult as

possible. I was raised with the "KISS" theory (Keep It Simple

Stupid). I'll just use memory sticks to backup and forget the CD

burning. At least I got a CD player now.

Those memory sticks are one of the few advances for computers in the

last 10 years that are worth anything. I'll stick with Win98 and Dos

programs and leave the rest of the world suffer with all the bloated

garbage they sell these days. In my opinion, the older the software

the better it is.

November 26, 2007

Re: Burning CD's is a HUGE HASSLE

"Bill in Co." <not_really_here@earthlink.net> wrote in

news:#jVOG1#LIHA.4272@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl:

> jameswalker7@invalid.com wrote:

>> What ever happened to the good old days where all that was

>> needed was a simple floppy disk, and files could be

>> dragged and dropped from Windows, or use the "copy

>> command" from dos.

>

> Those days are LONG gone.

Maybe for most people, but I would NEVER own a computer without

a floppy drive.

And the list of people buying external USB floppy drives for 10

times what an internal one costs is growing...

November 26, 2007

Re: Burning CD's is a HUGE HASSLE

jameswalker7@invalid.com wrote in

news:fqskk3lk94gi45e6uia2tqrlo4l31jqo9u@4ax.com:

<SNIP>

> Just like everything these days, the mindset of the young

> generation is to make everything as complicated, costly,

> and difficult as possible. I was raised with the "KISS"

> theory (Keep It Simple Stupid). I'll just use memory

> sticks to backup and forget the CD burning. At least I got

> a CD player now.

>

> Those memory sticks are one of the few advances for

> computers in the last 10 years that are worth anything.

> I'll stick with Win98 and Dos programs and leave the rest

> of the world suffer with all the bloated garbage they sell

> these days. In my opinion, the older the software the

> better it is.

I'll be honest, I didn't read ALL of your OP, because it was

quite long, but I know exactly what you're talking about and I

agree with you, and I feel your pain.

Here's what you do:

Go to:

http://www.cdrfaq.org

and download the whole thing as a zip file (this option is near

the start of the page), and unzip it into a nice new directory

on your machine.

Read about what seems most baffling to start with. Read more if

you want. It has everything but VERY well organized.

Don't bother with stuff like multisession, "Rainier",

proprietary software (like the one that came with your drive)

etc. Goes against what we both believe.

Since you had enough money to buy an external CD burner, I'm

sure you can spend 35 bucks to get the best software there is,

from http://www.goldenhawk.com

Uninstall the Iomega stuff and forget everything about it.

Buy TDK CD-R's in spindle packs of 50 or 100 for write once, buy

the most expensive you can find, made-in-Japan if possible, CD-

RW's for "write, erase, write again a bunch of times". "They"

claim up to a 1000 times but about 100-200 is most I've gotten

IIRC.

Generally CD-RW's are a waste of time since they cost

considerably more than CD-R's (which cost about a quarter) and

are less reliable. I just use CD-RW's to transfer stuff from one

computer to another, and when a disc dies, I just get a new one.

I've gone through about 5 in 3 years.

Always make an ISO file on a defragmented partition and then

burn that.

Burn at lower speeds. 4x, 8x, MAYBE 12x. What's the rush?

Good luck.

November 26, 2007

Re: Burning CD's is a HUGE HASSLE

With all due respects to MEB's very helpful post, I am adding a

few comments since I know you won't understand a few of the

things he mentions, plus I got a new small burst of energy from

somewhere...

"MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in

news:OjtH23$LIHA.5160@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl:

<SNIP>

>| On the other hand, I have never burned a CD or DVD or

>| anything. This drive came with Iomega Hot Burn Pro. I

>| have played with it, but have not yet purchased any

>| blanks. One thing I am not sure whether to get the Write

>| once or Multi-write ones. Worse yet, which are which. In

>| the store they had R and RW. What do these letters mean?

>| I thought that R meant READ and RW meant READ-WRITE. But

>| what good is a blank CD that is only readable? The

>| Walmart clerk did not know what I was talking about

>| (typical Walmart idiot), so I left the store not buying

>| any discs because I did not know what to buy.

>

> CDR - write once

> CDRW - write more than once - deletable/re-writable

>

> Most people use CDR, due to the present low cost.

>| Then, when I finally do get the disks, what do I do next?

>|

>| The software has the following options to select.

>| Music Disc

>| Data Disc

>| MP3/WMA Disc

>| Disc Copy

>| CD Label

>|

>| MP3's are music, so why is there both a "music disc" and a

>| "MP3/WMA" option?

>

> Different sound formats, different storage techniques ...

"Music Disc" is a largely meaningless (or at least multi-

interpretable) term which the Iomega software uses, which is one

of the many reasons I suggested you dump it and forget

everything about it. All you need is the drivers for the

machine, which you have already installed. You can use ANY

burning software. Go with my suggestion (funny I should say

that, huh?).

Music, photos, text, it's all DATA.

cdrfaq!!!

>| I am sure the Data Disc is for backups and saving files

>| off the hard drive. And I know that CD Label makes labels

>| (which my laser printer would unlikely be able to make.

>

> Actually it probably would. The Label Maker program would

> be controlling

> the printer..

As I believe cdrfaq mentions, NEVER apply ANY labels to CD-R's

UNLESS the blanks are the "print-on" kind (with a layer of -

usually white - paint on them), which is not worth bothering

with. Write a few descriptive words using a Sanford Sharpie (not

the thin kind!!!, the regular one!) gently. You can print the

contents as an insert or just a page to put in the

case/envelope.

[if you want to know WHY, take a useless (you'll get a few until

you get the hang of this, but they're ONLY a quarter) CD-R (NOT

a real Compact Disc - different animal entirely) and scratch the

printed side with a nail or razor blade and see what happens.]

>| Then I started to select a bunch of MP3 files on my

>| harddrive and it told me that they will not all fit.

>| Well, DUH..... Why does it not tell me where to stop,

>| assuming I will need several discs?

The goldenhawk software tells you EXACTLY how much space you

have left, and whether you should be using an 80 min CD or

whether a 74 is enough. There are 74 min and 80 min discs (they

use minutes since it's a term most people can comprehend) and

they are 650MB and 700MB respectively. 700MB will actually store

about 715,000,000 bytes... Remember - cdrfaq!

> It should have if you were using the burner program... you

> weren't trying

> this in Explorer were you? That type of copying would

> generally take a packet writer/driver..

Don't even bother trying to understand/use the packet writing

technology. Just perceive the CD-R as a write-everything-at-once

technology, as opposed to a floppy disk.

>| Do I need to manually copy the files to a special

>| directory until I know I have no more than 700 megs (or is

>| it 650, since several websites do not agree and list 650

>| on some and 700 on other sites for the max capacity).

cdrfaq

>| Then it says that MP3's can not be played on a standard CD

>| player on a stereo. What's the point of putting them on a

>| CD if they wont play (other than as a backup).

>

> Some DVD/CDROM home players support MP3 as do some car

> stereo systems, and

> some home stereos. However, they general state such support

> somewhere [label or manual]. The key word was *standard*,

> though in today's world MP3s are pretty standard, so most

> players generally have that support ...

Pretty much every DVD player made in the last few years, and

many car CD players and walkman-style players and blasters will

play mp3's. Some will "play" WMA and jpg photos as well.

SOME may not play the highest mp3 bitrate (320) rips, but no one

REALLY needs to use the highest rate. Go with "192 true stereo"

for your mp3's and don't worry about the other options. Stay

away from WMA.

<SNIP>

>| I'm seriously thinking that although it will cost more, I

>| may be better off just buying a pile of those memory

>| sticks for backing up my computer, and forgetting the CD

>| burning. At least I got a CD player now.

>

> Not a good idea,, as with any device based upon a chip,

> some degradation

> may occur over time. They're good for temporary storage,

> but not recommended for long term. You're not likely to be

> able to continually supply an electro-magnetic free

> environment in your own home. CDROM's [or DVD style] can

> also decay to some extent over long periods, and certainly

> can be damaged, but for the cost per disk they can't

> presently be beat for long term occassional use permanent

> storage.

Amen.

>| By the way, if I ever do get this thing to work, how can I

>| label them with a pen or something like that? I dont have

>| the printer to make labels and it all seems like too much

>| hassle anyhow. But they do need some soft of label, even

>| just numbering them would help. I have at least a dozen

>| CDs that other people made for them, and none have labels,

>| so I got to install them one by one to see what is on

>| them.

>

> You can use a regular "magic" marker or paint pen to label

> them [on the

> label side]. Make sure you do NOT scratch the surface

> trying to use a pencil or pen...

See above.

> To view the disks: Just put the CD in the drive and look at

> it from Explorer...

You MAY need to eject the disc from the drive after burning it

to properly see it. I don't know why this is, but if you try to

look at it and see gibberish, don't panic. Eject, insert, try

again. It will take a few moments for the disc to spin up to

speed and read the directory.

>| Either I'm too old for this, or I just dont understand any

>| of it.

>|

>| By the way I'm runing 98SE.

So am I (on my other computer, a 2GHz) and I will NEVER run

anything more recent.

THIS machine is 95B, 166MHz :-)

> Hey, we all went through the learning curve,,, you should

> have been here when CDROM devices first came out, not fun or

cheap > at all ...

I remember when at work we got the first 1x speed HP for what, a

thousand dollars or something, and the smartest guy was the one

who had to learn the Adaptec software to burn stuff on Quantegy

(formerly Ampex) CD-R's... I wish I could remember how much the

blanks cost!

November 26, 2007

Re: Burning CD's is a HUGE HASSLE

Your frustration is clouding your common sense.

The good old days are still with us - you can install a floppy drive in the

machine and drag and drop files to it or use the copy command from DOS just

like you always did.. Nothing has changed, except perhaps that you are now

finding that the floppy isn't quite big enough for you.

Did you check what the documentation supplied with the drive said about the

correct blank disk to purchase? You have many more choices than just R or

RW, and you will need to consult the manual. And if you need advice from a

sales assistant, don't shop at Walmart.

I don't know how you expected the software to tell you when to stop

selecting files when you did not have a blank disk inserted in the drive - I

think it would be very magic software that knew what type of disk you

intended to buy. I suspect that if you buy a blank disk and insert it in

the drive you may find there's a wizard that will start by telling you how

much space you have available, and then guide you through the steps

depending on what it is your are trying to copy to the disk - at least

that's how other brands of CD writing software work (and if your software

doesn't do that for you, perhaps you purchased the wrong product).

Take a deep breath, do a little bit of reading, find a sales assistant in a

store that knows what they are talking about, get some blank disks, and

start experimenting. And while doing all that, keep in mind the degree of

puzzlement you experienced when your first turned your own computer on many

years ago, and just how much your knowledge has grown since that day.

--

Jeff Richards

MS MVP (Windows - Shell/User)