Guest Deus0Factus0Sum@gmail.com Posted December 7, 2007 Posted December 7, 2007 Hello everyone, It's been a very long time since I've been on Usenet, so please forgive any netiquette faux pas... I have what might be a bit of a tricky format of a Win98 machine... It's P200MMX with two HDs. The master drive is the older and slower of the two, and contains the system files; the slave is the newer and faster, and has windows installed on it. I'd like to format both drives, click the newer faster one onto 'master' and install windows (98) onto it in full (i.e. a normal install, with system files and the program on the this one drive). I'd like to switch the older and slower HD to slave and leave it as just an internal backup, as storage only. So my question is, what should I do, and I guess at least as importantly, in what order should I do it? I'm worried about formatting the wrong drive first, and then being 'stuck' without control of the machine to finish the format/reinstall. As you can see I really don't know a lot about this kind of thing, and although I've tried to research the different aspects of this problem separately, the fact that what I'm trying to do is a little convoluted isn't helping. OK, I've searched this group as well as I can, but apologies if this has been answered before. I'll check this group as often as I can (twice a week at least) and give extra details/clarification as they're needed. Thanking you in advance, Wawrzyniec.
Guest GreenieLeBrun Posted December 7, 2007 Posted December 7, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format Deus0Factus0Sum@gmail.com wrote: > Hello everyone, > > It's been a very long time since I've been on Usenet, so please > forgive any netiquette faux pas... > > I have what might be a bit of a tricky format of a Win98 machine... > > It's P200MMX with two HDs. The master drive is the older and slower of > the two, and contains the system files; the slave is the newer and > faster, and has windows installed on it. > > I'd like to format both drives, click the newer faster one onto > 'master' and install windows (98) onto it in full (i.e. a normal > install, with system files and the program on the this one drive). I'd > like to switch the older and slower HD to slave and leave it as just > an internal backup, as storage only. > > So my question is, what should I do, and I guess at least as > importantly, in what order should I do it? I'm worried about > formatting the wrong drive first, and then being 'stuck' without > control of the machine to finish the format/reinstall. > > As you can see I really don't know a lot about this kind of thing, and > although I've tried to research the different aspects of this problem > separately, the fact that what I'm trying to do is a little convoluted > isn't helping. > > OK, I've searched this group as well as I can, but apologies if this > has been answered before. > > I'll check this group as often as I can (twice a week at least) and > give extra details/clarification as they're needed. > > Thanking you in advance, > > Wawrzyniec. Not too tricky. FIRST save all your data to an external repositry and make sure you can read it, formatting the drives will destroy ALL the material on the drives. Swap the jumpers on the two drives so that the faster disk is the master and the slower slave. Boot your machine with a Win 98 boot disk (http://www.bootdisk.com). Type FDISK then delete and recreate the required partion/s on each drive, reboot the machine from the floppy. Type Format c: /u, once C: is formatted do the same for D:. Reboot the machine from the floppy, place the win98 CD in the CD drive, type X: (where X: is the letter of your CD drive (probably E: in your case)) then Enter, next type CD win98 and hie enter, next type SETUP and hit Enter and you are on your way. Once installed you will probaly need to instal motherboard, sound, video etc. drives. Then you software and printer drives etc.
Guest pjp Posted December 7, 2007 Posted December 7, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format If retaining whatever's already on the hard disks is not an issue then it's pretty straightforward. Before starting ... Insure you have the product registration key required to do the reinstall. Create an Emergency Boot Floppy, far right tab under Add/Remove Programs in control panel under 98SE. Insure it works, e.g. use it to boot the pc (may require changing boot order in BIOS) and also insure you can see files on a cd after booting with the floppy, e.g. choose CD Rom support when starting pc. Note - boot floppy creates a ram drive which pushes drive letter for CD drive down one spot, e.g. if CD was E under Windows it's F when using boot floppy at DOS prompt. Insure you have device specific drivers you might need for your hardware and that they've been copied onto floppy or burned to a cd for later use, e.g. modem, network, video etc. drivers. Shut down and change master/slave jumpers on hard disk. Boot using floppy. Check (change) in FDISK that the "new" master hard disk is marked Active (else it won't work to boot pc). Format both drives, e.g. FORMAT C and FORMAT D. There's no real need to erase and recreate partitions. Run "SYS C:" to make primary hard disk bootable, e.g. has system files required to boot. Note - not neccessary but I like to insure disk will boot and removes need for floppy little earlier in sequence.. To save time later make a new folder on the newly formatted C drive and then copy the Win98 folder off the install cd. e.g. example commands follow while at the DOS prompt (probably A:\>), ignore comments after each line C: (change to the C drive) MD WIN98 (create a WIN98 folder) CD WIN98 (change into that folder) COPY F:\WIN98\*.* (C & D are hard disks, E is ram drive boot floppy creates so F is cd drive) You now have the install files all sitting on your hard disk in a WIN98 folder. Reboot pc without floppy in (why did SYS C: in earlier step). Once pc is back to C:\> prompt change into the WIN98 folder (cd win98) and run SETUP. Nice thing about copying folder from cd to hard disk is never have annoyance of requiring Windows CD when installing drivers etc. sometime in the future. Think that's it. <Deus0Factus0Sum@gmail.com> wrote in message news:96db6602-fff1-4664-a480-fb0daee6c3ef@e25g2000prg.googlegroups.com... > Hello everyone, > > It's been a very long time since I've been on Usenet, so please > forgive any netiquette faux pas... > > I have what might be a bit of a tricky format of a Win98 machine... > > It's P200MMX with two HDs. The master drive is the older and slower of > the two, and contains the system files; the slave is the newer and > faster, and has windows installed on it. > > I'd like to format both drives, click the newer faster one onto > 'master' and install windows (98) onto it in full (i.e. a normal > install, with system files and the program on the this one drive). I'd > like to switch the older and slower HD to slave and leave it as just > an internal backup, as storage only. > > So my question is, what should I do, and I guess at least as > importantly, in what order should I do it? I'm worried about > formatting the wrong drive first, and then being 'stuck' without > control of the machine to finish the format/reinstall. > > As you can see I really don't know a lot about this kind of thing, and > although I've tried to research the different aspects of this problem > separately, the fact that what I'm trying to do is a little convoluted > isn't helping. > > OK, I've searched this group as well as I can, but apologies if this > has been answered before. > > I'll check this group as often as I can (twice a week at least) and > give extra details/clarification as they're needed. > > Thanking you in advance, > > Wawrzyniec.
Guest philo Posted December 7, 2007 Posted December 7, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format <Deus0Factus0Sum@gmail.com> wrote in message news:96db6602-fff1-4664-a480-fb0daee6c3ef@e25g2000prg.googlegroups.com... > Hello everyone, > > It's been a very long time since I've been on Usenet, so please > forgive any netiquette faux pas... > > I have what might be a bit of a tricky format of a Win98 machine... > > It's P200MMX with two HDs. The master drive is the older and slower of > the two, and contains the system files; the slave is the newer and > faster, and has windows installed on it. > > I'd like to format both drives, click the newer faster one onto > 'master' and install windows (98) onto it in full (i.e. a normal > install, with system files and the program on the this one drive). I'd > like to switch the older and slower HD to slave and leave it as just > an internal backup, as storage only. > > So my question is, what should I do, and I guess at least as > importantly, in what order should I do it? I'm worried about > formatting the wrong drive first, and then being 'stuck' without > control of the machine to finish the format/reinstall. > > As you can see I really don't know a lot about this kind of thing, and > although I've tried to research the different aspects of this problem > separately, the fact that what I'm trying to do is a little convoluted > isn't helping. > > OK, I've searched this group as well as I can, but apologies if this > has been answered before. > > I'll check this group as often as I can (twice a week at least) and > give extra details/clarification as they're needed. > > Thanking you in advance, > > Wawrzyniec. Heck, I'd just format the faster drive then clone the system drive to it. xxcopy /clone should do the trick http://www.xxcopy.com/index.htm It should save a ton of time
Guest 98 Guy Posted December 7, 2007 Posted December 7, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format Deus0Factus0Sum@gmail.com wrote: > It's been a very long time since I've been on Usenet, so please > forgive any netiquette faux pas... Your netiquette will show once you start replying. Poor netiquette is when you top-post, or when you include the entire post that you're replying to instead of editing it to include only the specific content you're replying to. All of the 3 replies so far have shown poor netiquette. Observe how I am constructing this reply as an example of good netiquette. > It's P200MMX with two HDs. > I'd like to format both drives, click the newer faster one onto > 'master' and install windows (98) onto it in full (i.e. a normal > install, with system files and the program on the this one drive). If both drives are as old as your motherboard and CPU (ie circa 2000 or older) then you are advised to NOT keep using them. Your drives have reached the end of their useful life and will most likely fail within the next year. They probably have developed many bad sectors, and are probably very noisy (ie they probably emit a very noticable high-pitched tone that can affect your hearing over time - but that's probably already happened by now). Go out and purchase a new hard drive. Even if it's a 40 gb drive, you can partition and format it as a 32 gb drive (your motherboard probably isin't compatible with a drive larger than 32 gb). > OK, I've searched this group as well as I can, but apologies if > this has been answered before. Everybody that wants to alter the configuration of their old systems is in a slightly different situation, but it always boils down to a desire to re-use old hard drives, without considering that the hard drive is the one system component that can be replaced, and that it makes sense to replace it because they will fail, and replacing them can be very inexpensive.
Guest Don Phillipson Posted December 7, 2007 Posted December 7, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format <Deus0Factus0Sum@gmail.com> wrote in message news:96db6602-fff1-4664-a480-fb0daee6c3ef@e25g2000prg.googlegroups.com... > I'd like to format both drives, click the newer faster one onto > 'master' and install windows (98) onto it in full (i.e. a normal > install, with system files and the program on the this one drive). I'd > like to switch the older and slower HD to slave and leave it as just > an internal backup, as storage only. > > So my question is, what should I do, and I guess at least as > importantly, in what order should I do it? 1: Data: we assume you need save nothing, i.e. no data from the old drives including ProductKey or ProductID (numbers you must input during installation, described in #3.) 1b. Test your boot floppy beforehand, i.e. boot from the floppy and verify that it enables the CD drive(s) under MS-DOS (required to instal Win98.) If in doubt, download the correct boot floppy from http://www.bootdisk.com. This sends you a single EXE file which you execute to write the bootup files to a new blank formatted floppy. This may lack one or two convenient utilities e.g. CHKDSK or EDIT which you can add to the floppy. 2: Hardware. It does not matter how the two hard drives are connected (master/slave settings) so long as the OS finds only one Primary DOS partition (which will be your C: drive.) This is done via FDISK on your booting floppy i.e. -- Load FDISK and identify which of your two HDDs is the fast one. (Rename unambiguously if needed.) -- Load the fast HDD and remove all partitions (drives). -- Create one Primary DOS partition which will be your C: drive, of appropriate size (2 Gb to 10 Gb depending on drive space available and how you plan to instal.) -- Make one Extended DOS partition using up the rest of the drive space. You can make two or more logical drives in this Ext DOS partition if you prefer. (E.g. your Windows swap file (extended memory) should be on the faster HDD, but not in drive C: if there is any risk of C: filling up with data.) -- Load the slow HDD, remove all partitions, make all the drive space a single Ext DOS partition, and make 2 or more logical drives within it if you prefer. -- Reboot to execute all these changes to the hard drives. -- Each logical drive must be FORMATted before you can write data to it or instal the OS. 3: Operating System installation: read first reliable instructions at http://home.satx.rr.com/badour/html/w98_restore.html -- Don Phillipson Carlsbad Springs (Ottawa, Canada)
Guest Don Phillipson Posted December 7, 2007 Posted December 7, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format "98 Guy" <98@Guy.com> wrote in message news:475952DB.5AFA7FB4@Guy.com... > > It's P200MMX with two HDs. > > I'd like to format both drives, click the newer faster one onto > > 'master' and install windows (98) onto it in full (i.e. a normal > > install, with system files and the program on the this one drive). > > If both drives are as old as your motherboard and CPU (ie circa 2000 > or older) then you are advised to NOT keep using them. Your drives > have reached the end of their useful life and will most likely fail > within the next year. They probably have developed many bad sectors, The OP need not take this at face value. We have no reason to suppose drives that have not yet generated a single bad sector " probably have developed many bad sectors" and we need not guess. Reputable HDD manufacturers distribute free on their web sites diagnostic apps that will reliably indicate whether a drive is suitable for further use. > Go out and purchase a new hard drive. Even if it's a 40 gb drive, you > can partition and format it as a 32 gb drive (your motherboard > probably isin't compatible with a drive larger than 32 gb). Users with slower CPUs are better advised to divide drive space into several logical drives (e.g. max 10 Gb each), planning ahead where various types of data will be stored, e.g. C: drive 2 Gb for Windows only D: drive 10 Gb for /Program Files E: drive 10 Gb for /My Documents and all other data written by apps in D: (e.g. income tax, family photos etc.) F: drive for the Windows swap file (Extended Memory) and for periodical backup (e.g. XXCOPY clone of drive C:, e.g. cumulative backup of new or changed data from E:) Archives of this NG include occasional discussion along these lines. -- Don Phillipson Carlsbad Springs (Ottawa, Canada)
Guest MEB Posted December 7, 2007 Posted December 7, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Supposed Netiquette is a term spouted by parties who are ignorant of how the Internet works and how information is collected by the search engines. The only place it still applies are chat groups, or discussions which contain no technical materials which needs referenced. You generally find these statements by parties who love to talk theory; or attempt ot place themselves above others by pointing to supposed netiquette breach; or spend large amounts of time posting in dozens of News Groups and forums and wish to decrease their download times and increase rapid reading of posts; or of course the most obvious, those who do frequently chat [basically worthless material] and that's what they carry with them as the belief of how other discussions should be handled... when in reality, search engines don't care about this figment of old forum ideals, they find and place information based upon the actual materials contained within the individual pages [that's each posting for groups such as this] found. Remove that needed data, and what might have been a viable search results, turns into a "gotta read the entire thread to understand" worthless rambling in some thread which receives no attention, and fails to achieve the results because the title provides the same basic information that hundreds of thousands of other like discussions also contain. It might provide help for one individual or a single discussion, whereas, had the data been retained, it might have help thousands of others. There are also those who foster this fallacy so they can post numerous references to their own prior postings as if they are the premier authority [you are locallized to their presentations rather than where that material came from]. That is not stating one should not clip data in technical or informational discussions which is not being addressed or has already been answered if that is no longer being discussed, unless it is relevant to the continued discussion. As for where one posts, that depends upon what is presented. Such as this is a deliberate top post but keeps the thread below it for posterity and reference of why it was posted. Note the below reference to netiquette and some other inadequately prepared advise contained below which is a standard "consumerism" response. Re-use your hard drives if possible, but backup, and prepare for future failures. -- MEB http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com ________ "98 Guy" <98@Guy.com> wrote in message news:475952DB.5AFA7FB4@Guy.com... | Deus0Factus0Sum@gmail.com wrote: | | > It's been a very long time since I've been on Usenet, so please | > forgive any netiquette faux pas... | | Your netiquette will show once you start replying. Poor netiquette is | when you top-post, or when you include the entire post that you're | replying to instead of editing it to include only the specific content | you're replying to. | | All of the 3 replies so far have shown poor netiquette. | | Observe how I am constructing this reply as an example of good | netiquette. | | > It's P200MMX with two HDs. | > I'd like to format both drives, click the newer faster one onto | > 'master' and install windows (98) onto it in full (i.e. a normal | > install, with system files and the program on the this one drive). | | If both drives are as old as your motherboard and CPU (ie circa 2000 | or older) then you are advised to NOT keep using them. Your drives | have reached the end of their useful life and will most likely fail | within the next year. They probably have developed many bad sectors, | and are probably very noisy (ie they probably emit a very noticable | high-pitched tone that can affect your hearing over time - but that's | probably already happened by now). | | Go out and purchase a new hard drive. Even if it's a 40 gb drive, you | can partition and format it as a 32 gb drive (your motherboard | probably isin't compatible with a drive larger than 32 gb). | | > OK, I've searched this group as well as I can, but apologies if | > this has been answered before. | | Everybody that wants to alter the configuration of their old systems | is in a slightly different situation, but it always boils down to a | desire to re-use old hard drives, without considering that the hard | drive is the one system component that can be replaced, and that it | makes sense to replace it because they will fail, and replacing them | can be very inexpensive.
Guest Gary S. Terhune Posted December 7, 2007 Posted December 7, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format You don't want to do anything to the "old" drive except move it to the Slave position on the IDE cable, change the jumper(s), etc. WHEN you need to start up the old system, you'll have to switch it back to being the Master. Or, you can use a third-party boot manager. Also, I'd leave this drive disconnected until you've finished reinstalling Windows to the new drive. Prevents possibly confusing issues. You said the newer drive already has Windows installed. Is that correct? If so, then I'm confused. If not, then once you've moved that drive to being the Master, you treat it like any other drive and clean install Windows. Lots of ways to do that, including the way I described to another person a couple of days ago (subject: "Install Win98 SE".) But MAINLY, before you do ANYTHING, you want to make sure that any files you want to save are on the old drive, since it's the one you aren't going to wipe. -- Gary S. Terhune MS-MVP Shell/User http://www.grystmill.com <Deus0Factus0Sum@gmail.com> wrote in message news:96db6602-fff1-4664-a480-fb0daee6c3ef@e25g2000prg.googlegroups.com... > Hello everyone, > > It's been a very long time since I've been on Usenet, so please > forgive any netiquette faux pas... > > I have what might be a bit of a tricky format of a Win98 machine... > > It's P200MMX with two HDs. The master drive is the older and slower of > the two, and contains the system files; the slave is the newer and > faster, and has windows installed on it. > > I'd like to format both drives, click the newer faster one onto > 'master' and install windows (98) onto it in full (i.e. a normal > install, with system files and the program on the this one drive). I'd > like to switch the older and slower HD to slave and leave it as just > an internal backup, as storage only. > > So my question is, what should I do, and I guess at least as > importantly, in what order should I do it? I'm worried about > formatting the wrong drive first, and then being 'stuck' without > control of the machine to finish the format/reinstall. > > As you can see I really don't know a lot about this kind of thing, and > although I've tried to research the different aspects of this problem > separately, the fact that what I'm trying to do is a little convoluted > isn't helping. > > OK, I've searched this group as well as I can, but apologies if this > has been answered before. > > I'll check this group as often as I can (twice a week at least) and > give extra details/clarification as they're needed. > > Thanking you in advance, > > Wawrzyniec.
Guest 98 Guy Posted December 8, 2007 Posted December 8, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format Don Phillipson wrote: > > > It's P200MMX with two HDs. > > > > If both drives are as old as your motherboard and CPU (ie circa > > 2000 or older) then you are advised to NOT keep using them. > > Your drives have reached the end of their useful life and will > > most likely fail within the next year. > > They probably have developed many bad sectors, > > The OP need not take this at face value. Don and the OP are advised to do a little research of their own and discover the average and typical lifespans of hard drives of various vintages. > We have no reason to suppose drives that have not yet generated > a single bad sector The odds of such a supposition are against you. > Reputable HDD manufacturers distribute free on their web sites > diagnostic apps that will reliably indicate whether > a drive is suitable for further use. I don't dispute that, and I look forward to the OP performing such a test and posting the results back here. It not even necessary to use manufacturer-specific software for that purpose. I stand by my generic advice, which is that the OP obtain a new (or reasonably new) 20 or 40 gb drive, install 98 on it, and copy personal files from his ancient drives onto the new drive, and put the old drives in a shoe box in the closet. > Users with slower CPUs are better advised to divide drive > space into several logical drives (e.g. max 10 Gb each), I find such a strategy to be quaint - reminiscent of the pre-windows era where the creation of many logical drives had some utility.
Guest 98 Guy Posted December 8, 2007 Posted December 8, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Full-quoter MEB wrote: > Supposed Netiquette is a term spouted by parties who are ignorant > of how the Internet works Tell us how the Internet works Meb. > and how information is collected by the search engines. Ah, we're back to the old argument are we? That we musn't edit posts to make them more readable for the purpose and audience at hand - that instead we must preserve and full-quote entire threads for the sake of posterity. No matter that search engines (google groups being perhaps the only one) doesn't show quoted material by default. > The only place it still applies are chat groups, or discussions > which contain no technical materials which needs referenced. Usenet threads can be read in full on google. So why must every post contain an entire capsule of the thread up to that point? (rest of mindless and pointless drivel deleted)
Guest MEB Posted December 8, 2007 Posted December 8, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Yeah, so you're back to the same dimwitted display of your intellect as always... want to post in USENET, good go there and post... don't let the door hit you in the butt on the way out.. -- MEB http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com ________ "98 Guy" <98@Guy.com> wrote in message news:4759ED09.48867927@Guy.com... | Full-quoter MEB wrote: | | > Supposed Netiquette is a term spouted by parties who are ignorant | > of how the Internet works | | Tell us how the Internet works Meb. | | > and how information is collected by the search engines. | | Ah, we're back to the old argument are we? That we musn't edit posts | to make them more readable for the purpose and audience at hand - that | instead we must preserve and full-quote entire threads for the sake of | posterity. | | No matter that search engines (google groups being perhaps the only | one) doesn't show quoted material by default. | | > The only place it still applies are chat groups, or discussions | > which contain no technical materials which needs referenced. | | Usenet threads can be read in full on google. So why must every post | contain an entire capsule of the thread up to that point? | | (rest of mindless and pointless drivel deleted)
Guest MEB Posted December 8, 2007 Posted December 8, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies More absolute brilliance by 98 Guy, once again show the sheer depth of, ah, how vacant a mind can be... Let's see Google shares run around $714.00 [12-07-07] per, because Google knows how much that in formation and data means... Google FULLY shows ALL the message because that's one of the things that cause people to use the service... please point out and post the link to ANY USENET group or service which has garnered the same market share that Google has related to USENET viewing and USENET search results THAT DID NOT COME THROUGH GOOGLE ... While you're at it post any USENET service which has the same or more users compared to Google Groups, which is NOT available ON or through Google Groups which posts those full messages. Then explain why YOU think people searching through this group should be REQUIRED to read ENTIRE THREADS to find the information they seek. Now fully explain to the world why the heck you think why what you or any other USENET user spouting about Netiquette, means squat on this "help forum" or on Google, and why YOUR advise pursuant thereto should be followed in THIS forum or on Google.. do tell... I'm rather sure NO ONE on this planet is interested ... BTW: I quoted NONE of your garbage [this, once again, displays how willing you are to falsely state material fact in a vain attempt at some recognition] in either of these posts, so all those wonderful USENET groups who echo this, won't show ANYTHING you posted [per your statement] [note the lines above the sig, guess what that does out in USENET land and some News Readers, duh] BUT Google will hold the material for posterity. So contrary to your previous ignorant posting, top posting IS good netiqutte, particularly if the previous post held nothing of value. SO again, 98 Guy, do try to spend some time finding out what the real world is all about... that dream world of yours seems to be transparent in the light... -- MEB http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com ________ "98 Guy" <98@Guy.com> wrote in message news:4759ED09.48867927@Guy.com... | Full-quoter MEB wrote: | | > Supposed Netiquette is a term spouted by parties who are ignorant | > of how the Internet works | | Tell us how the Internet works Meb. | | > and how information is collected by the search engines. | | Ah, we're back to the old argument are we? That we musn't edit posts | to make them more readable for the purpose and audience at hand - that | instead we must preserve and full-quote entire threads for the sake of | posterity. | | No matter that search engines (google groups being perhaps the only | one) doesn't show quoted material by default. | | > The only place it still applies are chat groups, or discussions | > which contain no technical materials which needs referenced. | | Usenet threads can be read in full on google. So why must every post | contain an entire capsule of the thread up to that point? | | (rest of mindless and pointless drivel deleted)
Guest 98 Guy Posted December 8, 2007 Posted December 8, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Full-quoter MEB wrote: > ... want to post in USENET, good go there and post... You realize that you too are posting to USENET - or don't you? > don't let the door hit you in the butt on the way out.. The door broke when it hit your ass, but I guess you didn't feel it.
Guest MEB Posted December 8, 2007 Posted December 8, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies TSK,TSK,, shame on you. Apparently you REALLY don't know how this forum and the USENET works... {I apologize to Microsoft for using their server this one time for this purpose.} I created two posts... one specifically for USENET, and one for THIS server and forum [echoed on USENET]... what you posted DID NOT appear IN THIS FORUM [this server] due to its filter policy... you really need to clean up your language and remember THIS is a forum that might be used by children. Though judging by your mental capabilities: do your parents know what you are posting out here, and are they aware of your mental instability; and/or, do the people in that mental institution know; or is it parens patriae or guardian ad litem or some other custodial responsibilities in play, regardless, perhaps your medications need modified ... -- MEB http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com ________
Guest 98 Guy Posted December 8, 2007 Posted December 8, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies MEB wrote: > Apparently you REALLY don't know how this forum and the USENET > works... And as usual, you won't stick your neck out and explain it, for fear of being wrong (which you are in this case). > {I apologize to Microsoft for using their server this one time > for this purpose.} Owe Gaud. A nice, fake attempt at self deprecation. > I created two posts... one specifically for USENET, and one for > THIS server and forum [echoed on USENET]... Why do you insist on some sort of artificial distinction? MS carries the group, allows posting to it, and accepts posts propagated to it. Then it censors the **** out of it for local consumption. > Sorry, what you posted DID NOT appear IN THIS FORUM > [this server] due to its filter policy... Would you mind being more specific? Which post of mine? And if it was removed, how do you know? Do you read news using 2 different servers? If so - why? > you really need to clean up your language and remember THIS > is a forum that might be used by children. And you're setting a good example with your constant insults and put-downs? If my posts frustrate you, you could explain why. Instead you resort to juvenile mouthy insults. > Though judging by your mental capabilities: Like that. > are they aware of your mental instability; and that. > do the people in that mental institution know; You just don't stop. > perhaps your medications need modified ... I think many people here know you are a usenet troll MEB. You never cease at providing examples. Your next post will no doubt contain more. Should I tell Microsoft that you are using their server to post harassing messages to or about other users? Message-ID: <O35cb4cOIHA.5980@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl> NNTP-Posting-Host: AC88B121.ipt.aol.com 172.136.177.33 Path: TK2MSFTNGP01.phx.gbl TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2007 14:10:35 -0500 Do you think AOL will shield you from identification should Microsoft want to prosecute you for such use of their server? > {I apologize to Microsoft for using their server this one > time for this purpose.} I don't think such an admission would work Maurice Brahier. I'm going to bring this and other such posts to Microsoft's notice as an example of how you are violating the terms of service of their server, and the potential civil or criminal illegality of the content of your posts and how it makes Microsoft a party to them. Why don't you tell us what the laws are in Ohio when it comes to defamation, harassment, torment, slander and libel?
Guest MEB Posted December 8, 2007 Posted December 8, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies If you feel that is necessary, make your case, that will bring attention to your posts in which you admit to criminal activities. I will, however, apprise you that is not in your best interest. -- MEB http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com ________
Guest Sunny Posted December 9, 2007 Posted December 9, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:OaTj77UOIHA.1204@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... > Yeah, so you're back to the same dimwitted display of your intellect as > always... want to post in USENET, good go there and post... don't let > the > door hit you in the butt on the way out.. <snip> "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:O35cb4cOIHA.5980@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... <snip> > I created two posts... one specifically for USENET, and one for THIS > server > and forum [echoed on USENET]... what you posted DID NOT appear IN THIS > FORUM > [this server] due to its filter policy... you really need to clean up > your > language and remember THIS is a forum that might be used by children. > Though judging by your mental capabilities: do your parents know what > you > are posting out here, and are they aware of your mental instability; > and/or, > do the people in that mental institution know; or is it parens patriae > or > guardian ad litem or some other custodial responsibilities in play, > regardless, perhaps your medications need modified ... "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:e$2bnqVOIHA.2268@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... <snip> > SO again, 98 Guy, do try to spend some time finding out what the real > world > is all about... that dream world of yours seems to be transparent in the > light... It would appear, that you have posted on Usenet, despite your assertion that Microsoft Public news groups are not part of it. Any ISP News Server can carry Microsoft *public* groups, but they usually only add them, when customers request them. If you don't want to post to Usenet, then stop posting, as per your petty response to 98 Guy.
Guest 98 Guy Posted December 9, 2007 Posted December 9, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Maurice Brahier wrote: > If you feel that is necessary, make your case, that will bring > attention to your posts in which you admit to criminal activities. > I will, however, apprise you that is not in your best interest. Is there any particular reason you broke with your usual habbit and did not fully quote my post in your reply?
Guest MEB Posted December 9, 2007 Posted December 9, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies WHHHOOOOOOSSSSSSHHHHH, right over your head, I see that demonstration was lost upon you as well.. to bad... -- MEB http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com ________ "Sunny" <wombathouse@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message news:eQ3KBtgOIHA.5264@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... | | "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message | news:OaTj77UOIHA.1204@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... | > Yeah, so you're back to the same dimwitted display of your intellect as | > always... want to post in USENET, good go there and post... don't let | > the | > door hit you in the butt on the way out.. | <snip> | | "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message | news:O35cb4cOIHA.5980@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... | <snip> | > I created two posts... one specifically for USENET, and one for THIS | > server | > and forum [echoed on USENET]... what you posted DID NOT appear IN THIS | > FORUM | > [this server] due to its filter policy... you really need to clean up | > your | > language and remember THIS is a forum that might be used by children. | > Though judging by your mental capabilities: do your parents know what | > you | > are posting out here, and are they aware of your mental instability; | > and/or, | > do the people in that mental institution know; or is it parens patriae | > or | > guardian ad litem or some other custodial responsibilities in play, | > regardless, perhaps your medications need modified ... | | "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message | news:e$2bnqVOIHA.2268@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... | <snip> | > SO again, 98 Guy, do try to spend some time finding out what the real | > world | > is all about... that dream world of yours seems to be transparent in the | > light... | | It would appear, that you have posted on Usenet, despite your assertion | that Microsoft Public news groups are not part of it. Any ISP News Server | can carry Microsoft *public* groups, but they usually only add them, when | customers request them. If you don't want to post to Usenet, then stop | posting, as per your petty response to 98 Guy. | | | | | | |
Guest Sunny Posted December 9, 2007 Posted December 9, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:uGOxsAhOIHA.5140@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... > WHHHOOOOOOSSSSSSHHHHH, right over your head, I see that demonstration > was > lost upon you as well.. to bad... <snip> Must admit I still have difficulty with your : "I created two posts... one specifically for USENET, and one for THIS server" All posts to Microsoft.public news groups are available on Usenet, so how is it possible for you to "create" a post that won't appear? (It does not matter if the subscriber is using their ISP news server, or the Microsoft server to read posts) The whole World is not contained within the USA.
Guest Deus0Factus0Sum@gmail.com Posted December 9, 2007 Posted December 9, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies I could hardly believe the 21 replies waiting for me when I signed in just now... thank you, all of you. I have only a moment to reply, so I'll make this quick for now, and write properly tomorrow or the next day (indeed, I hope to finish this format/reinstall within the next two or three days). I'll only add to what has been said that I've run Norton Disk Doctor on both drives (within the last 6months, so I'll do so again ASAP) and it found no bad sectors on the newer drive, and I *think* none on the older. I'll keep what you've said in mind, 98 Guy, and I appreciate your comments, however I will probably keep both drives as long as they continue to come up clean on surface tests etc. The reason I'm not too worried about doing this (although I can't deny being loath to throw away components that still work, and are apparently reliable) leads to the second thing i wanted to add- I'm going to be using this computer purely for word-processing and printing. The master drive will be nearly empty, and the slave will only be used to back-up files. If I can find good (free) antivirus software for win98, then I'll reinstall a dial-up modem as well and use this machine to browse academic, text-heavy and graphics-lite sites. (I can see there is a lot on win98-supported antivirus software on usenet, so I'll research that when I have the time). OK, thank you once again, W.
Guest MEB Posted December 9, 2007 Posted December 9, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies "Sunny" <wombathouse@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message news:%23afo0uiOIHA.3556@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... | | "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message | news:uGOxsAhOIHA.5140@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... | > WHHHOOOOOOSSSSSSHHHHH, right over your head, I see that demonstration | > was | > lost upon you as well.. to bad... | <snip> | | Must admit I still have difficulty with your : | "I created two posts... one specifically for USENET, and one for THIS | server" | | All posts to Microsoft.public news groups are available on Usenet, so how | is it possible for you to "create" a post that won't appear? | | (It does not matter if the subscriber is using their ISP news server, or | the Microsoft server to read posts) | The whole World is not contained within the USA. | Okay, that poses a reasonable question so I'll answer. Both of those posts were posted UPON and through Microsoft's [actually the main host's server since Microsoft off-loaded much of its services to other servers under contract, though it may be back within Microsoft] server and forum, that's *HERE*, where I post, I do NOT post on or through USENET. This server, as you noted, is a *SEPARATE AND DISTINCT ENTITY* from USENET, and is no part of it. Not uniquely, even though your original post noted the differences, there was a break down between the understanding. Microsoft could have setup this service requiring parties who wish to post through it or to it, in the same form as Google and other services, ISPs and other, which REQUIRES one to have an account, however, Microsoft chose to provide this server and service to the public and for their use, and provided several ways to post in it, the web interface, newsreaders, USENET, and directly. Such is not done without constraint, Microsoft has instituted filters, and does modify them from time to time to hopefully ensure that inappropriate content does not appear. However, it remains MICROSOFT'S forum, not ANY other service or other that ECHOES IT. Any posts coming from external sources ARE filtered, the same as local postings are. Yes, you can QOUTE material from OUTSIDE sources which might make it through the filters, as you have shown, though the filter rules try to ensure these things don't happen. Note I used a mild term to use as the BAIT within that post should it be placed here from an external source, hopefully it is so benign that even children or their parents are not offended [perhaps even causing a good laugh]. Occasionally those changes cause havoc when some modification blocks material which does not need blocked. We occasionally have discussions HERE [this forum] concerning blocked posts and those modifications, or these are noted [generally without extensive comment] when someone complains they had to post several times for the item to appear [though that also happens when other server maintenance is done]. However, USENET, actually hundreds/thousands of INDIVIDUAL servers and services and other, loosely referred to as USENET, Google, and other News Services [generally private services] automatically pull FROM this server/host, and generally each individual service *WITH THEIR OWN DISTINCT POSTING RULES*. Don't miss that, there are thousands of *supposed Netiquette rules* across the planet. They may contain postings which will NEVER appear here upon Microsoft's server, the MASTER HOST, the controller of the forum. This master forum occasionally receives a *RE: {something}* which never appeared here [the master host] in the first place, which sometimes causes someone to respond with a *huh, what are you talking about*, because those that receive this forum directly do NOT receive the USENET drivel, UNLESS it passes the master host's filters. The demonstration, if you followed the posts, was produced to show this distinction, and to show how ignorant 98 Guy was concerning these aspects [as I posted]. The specifically created USENET post [actually just a regular post here on the master host] contained material which would NOT be posted d irectly within forum [it flicked in but was removed even before *I* could download it] though it was submitted through and upon THIS master server/host, but WOULD be pulled from the server automatically [before filtering] by those services which monitor postings here, which is generally referred to as USENET. You posted the entire *BAIT POST*, which I knew 98 Guy could not resist responding to, due to the apparent intense need for ego building, but does not appear here on the master host, at least not until you and 98 Guy posted it.. Look carefully at those responses,,,, not only does 98 Guy fail to grasp the issues, but posts absolutely ignorant threats, this is typical of the discussions with this party. Look at the material carefully [the message headers]... look at the content of the thread and the postings related, and it should have been rather obvious what it was, and what it proofed. Not only should this have demonstrated [and it does] the DISTINCT differences, but it also responded to the other completely ignorant postings 98 Guy had placed within this forum. Moreover, the continued postings by 98 Guy exposed the EXACT apparent indications of which I had placed. Once again this entity COMPLETELY fails to grasp the reality of the world and how all this on the Internet works EVEN WHEN DEMONSTRATED by the very person HE CLAIMS doesn't understand ... This should be enough to explain it, but if more is required, perhaps others can respond as I have lost interest [unless 98 Guy puts more dumb stuff here, though I may just ignore it], I have achieved what I set out to do... BTW: no one has responded to those unanswered questions I posted to expose other segments of this post on Netiquette fallacies. Any *takers* out there? -- MEB http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com ________
Guest Sunny Posted December 9, 2007 Posted December 9, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:uTlkk1pOIHA.3556@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... > "Sunny" <wombathouse@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message > news:%23afo0uiOIHA.3556@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... <snip> > | Must admit I still have difficulty with your : > | "I created two posts... one specifically for USENET, and one for THIS > | server" <snip> > Okay, that poses a reasonable question so I'll answer. > > Both of those posts were posted UPON and through Microsoft's [actually > the > main host's server since Microsoft off-loaded much of its services to > other > servers under contract, though it may be back within Microsoft] server > and > forum, that's *HERE*, where I post, I do NOT post on or through USENET. > > This server, as you noted, is a *SEPARATE AND DISTINCT ENTITY* from > USENET, > and is no part of it. Not uniquely, even though your original post noted > the > differences, there was a break down between the understanding. <snip> Thank you for your verbose reply, however, "Microsoft has created the Microsoft.public newsgroup hierarchy and made it available to anyone on the Usenet" http://www.microsoft.com/communities/guide/newsgroupfaq.mspx I have for years subscribed to Microsoft servers (Including one requiring a password access) and the fact that they have "filters" in place does not remove them from Usenet. ISPs around the World do not "Echo" Microsoft public news group postings, they simply download any of the available groups that they require. Any ISP, who chooses to make their NNTP server available to non paying customers, is in effect part of Usenet. It doesn't matter if anyone posts direct to the Microsoft "public" server using AOL or any other World wide ISP, they are in effect posting to Usenet.
Guest MEB Posted December 10, 2007 Posted December 10, 2007 Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies Re: Tricky Win98 Format - Netiquette falicies "Sunny" <wombathouse@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message news:ee1Cs4rOIHA.292@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... | | "MEB" <meb@not here@hotmail.com> wrote in message | news:uTlkk1pOIHA.3556@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... | > "Sunny" <wombathouse@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message | > news:%23afo0uiOIHA.3556@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... | <snip> | > | Must admit I still have difficulty with your : | > | "I created two posts... one specifically for USENET, and one for THIS | > | server" | <snip> | > Okay, that poses a reasonable question so I'll answer. | > | > Both of those posts were posted UPON and through Microsoft's [actually | > the | > main host's server since Microsoft off-loaded much of its services to | > other | > servers under contract, though it may be back within Microsoft] server | > and | > forum, that's *HERE*, where I post, I do NOT post on or through USENET. | > | > This server, as you noted, is a *SEPARATE AND DISTINCT ENTITY* from | > USENET, | > and is no part of it. Not uniquely, even though your original post noted | > the | > differences, there was a break down between the understanding. | <snip> | Thank you for your verbose reply, however, | "Microsoft has created the Microsoft.public newsgroup hierarchy and made | it available to anyone on the Usenet" | http://www.microsoft.com/communities/guide/newsgroupfaq.mspx The key words are "Microsoft has created" and "made it available" think carefully before you reply, I know its hard sometimes.. | | I have for years subscribed to Microsoft servers (Including one requiring | a password access) and the fact that they have "filters" in place does not | remove them from Usenet. | ISPs around the World do not "Echo" Microsoft public news group postings, | they simply download any of the available groups that they require. Did you really type that.. yep you did... so they MERELY download something which they have no direct control over and which they do not and did not create... | | Any ISP, who chooses to make their NNTP server available to non paying | customers, is in effect part of Usenet. | | It doesn't matter if anyone posts direct to the Microsoft "public" server | using AOL or any other World wide ISP, they are in effect posting to | Usenet. | So why did you also choose to point out AOL, I do not post via AOL.... get it yet... and that is a rather ridiculous argument,, really think about what you just typed to supposedly proof your issue, it holds no water whatsoever... I also have at times had some other access.. so what's the relevance to THIS situation and discussion. Anyway, I can see you will apparently never get the differences so should I why bother ... -- MEB http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com ________
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