Guest zeke7 Posted December 8, 2007 Posted December 8, 2007 Am consistently getting a corrupted C: drive on my desktop PC computer running Windows 2000 SP4 with latest updates, firewall/virus etc installed. At least 4 crashes / complete formats/reinstalls in as many weeks. Same standard hardware & software (other than the latest Windows Updates) as when it ran fine, for years; do have many new files for My Docs, however. Tried installing on different hard disks, do a slow NTFS format beforehand, etc. Recovery Console and Emergency Repair Disks have consistently been unsuccessful in salvaging the installations. A detailed description of SW/HW/processes would be overly long; the following is a summary in the hopes some of you recognize one of three conditions described below as being definitely related to the crashes. Typical incident is a couple of days or so after reloading all software and about 120gb data files (about 20,000 digicamera jpgs, numerous mp3s, etc, some with longish filenames), suddenly middle of doing something seemingly unrelated, pop-up windows appear saying "C: drive [or folder therein] is unreadable / corrupt. Run chkdsk." Have to reboot of course to run chkdsk, when it runs it finds thousands of orphan file records to delete and index entries to fix, then the disk is unbootable and lots of data and program / system files are missing; some are recovered by chkdsk. One time a "C:\$Mft is corrupt and unreadable" message precluded the crash. I think I have it narrowed down to 3 possible causes. Knowledgeable sorts out there, please review and advise on which one you think it might be. I'm going to avoid all three on my next reinstall, which I'm in the middle of, until I hopefully get a consensus from you: 1. Outlook 2002 (along with its required Office XP service packs) installed on a system otherwise running Office 2000 Premium. On at least one crash (the most recent), Outlook 2000 had been inadvertently installed coincidental with Outlook 2002. (I need v.2002 so that I can synch my Outlook contacts with my iPAQ PocketPC 2003 PDA). A problem initially starting that program after installation led to a corrupt web access profile error for which MS KB provided a fix. And during that latest crash, concurrent with the corrupt C: drive message boxes popping up were boxes asking for the Outlook 2002 installation CD, thoroughly irrelevant for what I was doing at the time. 2. Long filenames. I've found a few data files that have long names locked up in Windows 2000, unable to delete or rename them from Explorer and having to run arcane commands/switches from the Command window to get rid of them. These files include some mp3s, possibly some photos, and also some Windows Update files downloaded to disk from Microsoft Update Catalog (not Windows Update), which inexplicably appends a long string of alphanumeric characters to many of its update downloads, some of which have already long filenames. Restoration of data files from backup hard drives during re-installation initially entailed copying directly from drive to drive in Explorer, most recently using the Win2K Backup program. 3. Reorganizing the disorganized plethora of shortcuts in the Program shortcuts folders (C:\Documents and Settings\...\Start Menu\Programs) resulting from a reinstall so that all are in the \All Users\ folder under a handful of categorized parent folders. A little prior to one recent crash, the system locked up when I moved one such folder group there that it mistakenly thought were program files. And during the most recent crash yesterday, the folders were reorganized successfully a few hours earlier, but when the system crashed that was the first symptom noticed: copies of those shortcuts (MS Office ones) placed in the Quick Launch toolbar started losing their icon images; shortly thereafter the corrupt folder / C; drive messages started popping up (along with the Outlook 2002 install disk requests) and the system went down and out. That's it; already verbose. Obviously a major malfunction. Quick reactions from the experts out there please: any of these situations ring a bell for correlation with sudden NTFS disk corruption?
Guest Dave Patrick Posted December 8, 2007 Posted December 8, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K 1.) http://support.microsoft.com/kb/290301 http://support.microsoft.com/kb/239938 http://support.microsoft.com/kb/304465 2.) Sounds like some file system corruption. I'd download and run the manufacturer's diagnostic tools. Disk and drive controller. Test the RAM http://oca.microsoft.com/en/windiag.asp Also; http://support.microsoft.com/kb/303013 3.) The application install is responsible for placing the shortcuts. This really should cause any problems by moving them. -- Regards, Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup. Microsoft Certified Professional Microsoft MVP [Windows] http://www.microsoft.com/protect "zeke7" wrote: > Am consistently getting a corrupted C: drive on my desktop PC computer > running Windows 2000 SP4 with latest updates, firewall/virus etc > installed. > At least 4 crashes / complete formats/reinstalls in as many weeks. Same > standard hardware & software (other than the latest Windows Updates) as > when > it ran fine, for years; do have many new files for My Docs, however. Tried > installing on different hard disks, do a slow NTFS format beforehand, etc. > Recovery Console and Emergency Repair Disks have consistently been > unsuccessful in salvaging the installations. > > A detailed description of SW/HW/processes would be overly long; the > following is a summary in the hopes some of you recognize one of three > conditions described below as being definitely related to the crashes. > > Typical incident is a couple of days or so after reloading all software > and > about 120gb data files (about 20,000 digicamera jpgs, numerous mp3s, etc, > some with longish filenames), suddenly middle of doing something seemingly > unrelated, pop-up windows appear saying "C: drive [or folder therein] is > unreadable / corrupt. Run chkdsk." > > Have to reboot of course to run chkdsk, when it runs it finds thousands of > orphan file records to delete and index entries to fix, then the disk is > unbootable and lots of data and program / system files are missing; some > are > recovered by chkdsk. One time a "C:\$Mft is corrupt and unreadable" > message > precluded the crash. > > I think I have it narrowed down to 3 possible causes. Knowledgeable sorts > out there, please review and advise on which one you think it might be. > I'm > going to avoid all three on my next reinstall, which I'm in the middle of, > until I hopefully get a consensus from you: > > 1. Outlook 2002 (along with its required Office XP service packs) > installed > on a system otherwise running Office 2000 Premium. On at least one crash > (the > most recent), Outlook 2000 had been inadvertently installed coincidental > with > Outlook 2002. (I need v.2002 so that I can synch my Outlook contacts with > my > iPAQ PocketPC 2003 PDA). A problem initially starting that program after > installation led to a corrupt web access profile error for which MS KB > provided a fix. And during that latest crash, concurrent with the corrupt > C: > drive message boxes popping up were boxes asking for the Outlook 2002 > installation CD, thoroughly irrelevant for what I was doing at the time. > > 2. Long filenames. I've found a few data files that have long names locked > up in Windows 2000, unable to delete or rename them from Explorer and > having > to run arcane commands/switches from the Command window to get rid of > them. > These files include some mp3s, possibly some photos, and also some Windows > Update files downloaded to disk from Microsoft Update Catalog (not Windows > Update), which inexplicably appends a long string of alphanumeric > characters > to many of its update downloads, some of which have already long > filenames. > Restoration of data files from backup hard drives during re-installation > initially entailed copying directly from drive to drive in Explorer, most > recently using the Win2K Backup program. > > 3. Reorganizing the disorganized plethora of shortcuts in the Program > shortcuts folders (C:\Documents and Settings\...\Start Menu\Programs) > resulting from a reinstall so that all are in the \All Users\ folder under > a > handful of categorized parent folders. A little prior to one recent crash, > the system locked up when I moved one such folder group there that it > mistakenly thought were program files. And during the most recent crash > yesterday, the folders were reorganized successfully a few hours earlier, > but > when the system crashed that was the first symptom noticed: copies of > those > shortcuts (MS Office ones) placed in the Quick Launch toolbar started > losing > their icon images; shortly thereafter the corrupt folder / C; drive > messages > started popping up (along with the Outlook 2002 install disk requests) and > the system went down and out. > > That's it; already verbose. Obviously a major malfunction. Quick reactions > from the experts out there please: any of these situations ring a bell for > correlation with sudden NTFS disk corruption?
Guest The Kat Posted December 8, 2007 Posted December 8, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K On Fri, 7 Dec 2007 20:12:00 -0800, zeke7 <zeke7@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote: >Am consistently getting a corrupted C: drive on my desktop PC computer >running Windows 2000 SP4 with latest updates, firewall/virus etc installed. Chances are you have a bad motherboard, the IDE controller is causing the corruption. -- Lumber Cartel (tinlc) #2063. Spam this account at your own risk. This sig censored by the Office of Home, Land & Planet Insecurity... Remove XYZ to email me
Guest zeke7 Posted December 8, 2007 Posted December 8, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K Thanks Dave--these has got me doing a lot of detective work, zeroing in on the 137gb / 48-bit issue with initial W2K, issues I thought were sorted out for the user by SP4. Also seeing Intel Appl Accelerator is needed for my ASUS P4C800-E MB (Intel 875P / ICH5R chipset). "Dave Patrick" wrote: > 1.) > http://support.microsoft.com/kb/290301 > http://support.microsoft.com/kb/239938 > http://support.microsoft.com/kb/304465 > > 2.) > Sounds like some file system corruption. I'd download and run the > manufacturer's diagnostic tools. Disk and drive controller. > > Test the RAM > http://oca.microsoft.com/en/windiag.asp > > Also; > http://support.microsoft.com/kb/303013 > > > 3.) > The application install is responsible for placing the shortcuts. This > really should cause any problems by moving them. > > > -- > > Regards, > > Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup. > Microsoft Certified Professional > Microsoft MVP [Windows] > http://www.microsoft.com/protect > > "zeke7" wrote: > > Am consistently getting a corrupted C: drive on my desktop PC computer > > running Windows 2000 SP4 with latest updates, firewall/virus etc > > installed. > > At least 4 crashes / complete formats/reinstalls in as many weeks. Same > > standard hardware & software (other than the latest Windows Updates) as > > when > > it ran fine, for years; do have many new files for My Docs, however. Tried > > installing on different hard disks, do a slow NTFS format beforehand, etc. > > Recovery Console and Emergency Repair Disks have consistently been > > unsuccessful in salvaging the installations. > > > > A detailed description of SW/HW/processes would be overly long; the > > following is a summary in the hopes some of you recognize one of three > > conditions described below as being definitely related to the crashes. > > > > Typical incident is a couple of days or so after reloading all software > > and > > about 120gb data files (about 20,000 digicamera jpgs, numerous mp3s, etc, > > some with longish filenames), suddenly middle of doing something seemingly > > unrelated, pop-up windows appear saying "C: drive [or folder therein] is > > unreadable / corrupt. Run chkdsk." > > > > Have to reboot of course to run chkdsk, when it runs it finds thousands of > > orphan file records to delete and index entries to fix, then the disk is > > unbootable and lots of data and program / system files are missing; some > > are > > recovered by chkdsk. One time a "C:\$Mft is corrupt and unreadable" > > message > > precluded the crash. > > > > I think I have it narrowed down to 3 possible causes. Knowledgeable sorts > > out there, please review and advise on which one you think it might be. > > I'm > > going to avoid all three on my next reinstall, which I'm in the middle of, > > until I hopefully get a consensus from you: > > > > 1. Outlook 2002 (along with its required Office XP service packs) > > installed > > on a system otherwise running Office 2000 Premium. On at least one crash > > (the > > most recent), Outlook 2000 had been inadvertently installed coincidental > > with > > Outlook 2002. (I need v.2002 so that I can synch my Outlook contacts with > > my > > iPAQ PocketPC 2003 PDA). A problem initially starting that program after > > installation led to a corrupt web access profile error for which MS KB > > provided a fix. And during that latest crash, concurrent with the corrupt > > C: > > drive message boxes popping up were boxes asking for the Outlook 2002 > > installation CD, thoroughly irrelevant for what I was doing at the time. > > > > 2. Long filenames. I've found a few data files that have long names locked > > up in Windows 2000, unable to delete or rename them from Explorer and > > having > > to run arcane commands/switches from the Command window to get rid of > > them. > > These files include some mp3s, possibly some photos, and also some Windows > > Update files downloaded to disk from Microsoft Update Catalog (not Windows > > Update), which inexplicably appends a long string of alphanumeric > > characters > > to many of its update downloads, some of which have already long > > filenames. > > Restoration of data files from backup hard drives during re-installation > > initially entailed copying directly from drive to drive in Explorer, most > > recently using the Win2K Backup program. > > > > 3. Reorganizing the disorganized plethora of shortcuts in the Program > > shortcuts folders (C:\Documents and Settings\...\Start Menu\Programs) > > resulting from a reinstall so that all are in the \All Users\ folder under > > a > > handful of categorized parent folders. A little prior to one recent crash, > > the system locked up when I moved one such folder group there that it > > mistakenly thought were program files. And during the most recent crash > > yesterday, the folders were reorganized successfully a few hours earlier, > > but > > when the system crashed that was the first symptom noticed: copies of > > those > > shortcuts (MS Office ones) placed in the Quick Launch toolbar started > > losing > > their icon images; shortly thereafter the corrupt folder / C; drive > > messages > > started popping up (along with the Outlook 2002 install disk requests) and > > the system went down and out. > > > > That's it; already verbose. Obviously a major malfunction. Quick reactions > > from the experts out there please: any of these situations ring a bell for > > correlation with sudden NTFS disk corruption? > >
Guest zeke7 Posted December 8, 2007 Posted December 8, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K Ouch... not good news for me, but sounds quite feasible. I assume there's no software-type test for this to verify its flaky nature? "The Kat" wrote: > On Fri, 7 Dec 2007 20:12:00 -0800, zeke7 <zeke7@discussions.microsoft.com> > wrote: > > >Am consistently getting a corrupted C: drive on my desktop PC computer > >running Windows 2000 SP4 with latest updates, firewall/virus etc installed. > > Chances are you have a bad motherboard, > the IDE controller is causing the corruption. > > > > > -- > > Lumber Cartel (tinlc) #2063. Spam this account at your own risk. > > This sig censored by the Office of Home, Land & Planet Insecurity... > > Remove XYZ to email me >
Guest The Kat Posted December 8, 2007 Posted December 8, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K On Sat, 8 Dec 2007 11:58:01 -0800, zeke7 <zeke7@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote: >Ouch... not good news for me, but sounds quite feasible. I assume there's no >software-type test for this to verify its flaky nature? Other than eliminating other possible sources of the problem. I had that same problem some years ago. And DO NOT use the Intel app accelerator! I've heard of nothing but bad experiences with it. -- Lumber Cartel (tinlc) #2063. Spam this account at your own risk. This sig censored by the Office of Home, Land & Planet Insecurity... Remove XYZ to email me
Guest Dave Patrick Posted December 8, 2007 Posted December 8, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K That's what I suspected. In addition if your drive controller is not natively supported then you'll want to boot the Windows 2000 install CD-Rom. Then *F6* very early and very important (at setup is inspecting your system) in the setup to prevent drive controller detection, and select S to specify additional drivers. Then later you'll be prompted to insert the manufacturer supplied Windows 2000 driver for your drive controller in drive "A" -- Regards, Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup. Microsoft Certified Professional Microsoft MVP [Windows] http://www.microsoft.com/protect "zeke7" wrote: > Thanks Dave--these has got me doing a lot of detective work, zeroing in on > the 137gb / 48-bit issue with initial W2K, issues I thought were sorted > out > for the user by SP4. Also seeing Intel Appl Accelerator is needed for my > ASUS > P4C800-E MB (Intel 875P / ICH5R chipset).
Guest zeke7 Posted December 9, 2007 Posted December 9, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K KAt--I mistyped above, meant to to say "... see IF the Intel App Accelerator is needed"; I checked and it's not, only for older chipsets than what I have. I did find my BIOS was set to MIPS 1.1, I just switched it to 1.4; do you think that might have been related? I have a couple of IDE controller cards that came packaged with hard drives I bought; thinking one might be going out (I just use one), I swapped it with the other, checked for the latest manufacturer's drivers & BIOS, things still corrupted. Are you referring to a PCI controller card, or to the MB's IDE controller? Also checked the driver being used for my hard drives, it's an MS v5.0.2183.1 dated 1999. That seems a little old to accommodate the 137g, 48-bit limitation of yore; is there a newer MS driver out there for Win2K? (The drive's manufacturer states that they don't provide one, the OS drivers are fine). It occurred to me that this corruption problem has occurred only on larger drives; an old 80g drive with an old install of W2K on it has been working fine, so I just reformatted and am going to use it for my boot/OS drive to see if it remains stable. "The Kat" wrote: > On Sat, 8 Dec 2007 11:58:01 -0800, zeke7 <zeke7@discussions.microsoft.com> > wrote: > > >Ouch... not good news for me, but sounds quite feasible. I assume there's no > >software-type test for this to verify its flaky nature? > > Other than eliminating other possible sources of the problem. > > I had that same problem some years ago. > > And DO NOT use the Intel app accelerator! > I've heard of nothing but bad experiences with it. > > > > -- > > Lumber Cartel (tinlc) #2063. Spam this account at your own risk. > > This sig censored by the Office of Home, Land & Planet Insecurity... > > Remove XYZ to email me >
Guest zeke7 Posted December 9, 2007 Posted December 9, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K Dave--I always remove my PCI IDE controller card when installing W2K, just so it doesn't get confused; I wait until the OS is fully updated & operational before popping in the card and installing its driver with the Windows wizard. The /kb/303013 link you provided above led me to another one, /kb/331958/, (also written only for XP) that has me very suspicious: another nagging problem with my system is that the computer immediately reboots whenever running Shut Down (not 'Restart') from Windows, and Standby mode locks up the machine altogether (I have to hit the manual off switch to get it to stay off). The 331958 article implies the two issues may be related: "If you experience hard disk corruption, you may also experience other symptoms including problems starting, restarting, or shutting down Windows XP, problems running programs, or problems opening or saving documents." I tried the EnableBigLba regedt32 tweak described in /kb/303013, but it didn't fix the reboot problem. "Dave Patrick" wrote: > That's what I suspected. In addition if your drive controller is not > natively supported then you'll want to boot the Windows 2000 install CD-Rom. > Then *F6* very early and very important (at setup is inspecting your system) > in the setup to prevent drive controller detection, and select S to specify > additional drivers. Then later you'll be prompted to insert the manufacturer > supplied Windows 2000 driver for your drive controller in drive "A" > > > -- > > Regards, > > Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup. > Microsoft Certified Professional > Microsoft MVP [Windows] > http://www.microsoft.com/protect > > "zeke7" wrote: > > Thanks Dave--these has got me doing a lot of detective work, zeroing in on > > the 137gb / 48-bit issue with initial W2K, issues I thought were sorted > > out > > for the user by SP4. Also seeing Intel Appl Accelerator is needed for my > > ASUS > > P4C800-E MB (Intel 875P / ICH5R chipset). > >
Guest Dave Patrick Posted December 9, 2007 Posted December 9, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K "I always remove my PCI IDE controller card when installing" I don't know why one would do this. Install the controller driver via F6 during text mode portion of setup. Also read the notes here carefully. http://support.microsoft.com/kb/305098 -- Regards, Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup. Microsoft Certified Professional Microsoft MVP [Windows] http://www.microsoft.com/protect "zeke7" wrote: > Dave--I always remove my PCI IDE controller card when installing W2K, just > so > it doesn't get confused; I wait until the OS is fully updated & > operational > before popping in the card and installing its driver with the Windows > wizard. > > The /kb/303013 link you provided above led me to another one, > /kb/331958/, > (also written only for XP) that has me very suspicious: another nagging > problem with my system is that the computer immediately reboots whenever > running Shut Down (not 'Restart') from Windows, and Standby mode locks up > the > machine altogether (I have to hit the manual off switch to get it to stay > off). The 331958 article implies the two issues may be related: > > "If you experience hard disk corruption, you may also experience other > symptoms including problems starting, restarting, or shutting down Windows > XP, problems running programs, or problems opening or saving documents." > > I tried the EnableBigLba regedt32 tweak described in /kb/303013, but it > didn't fix the reboot problem.
Guest zeke7 Posted December 9, 2007 Posted December 9, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K I do this because the W2K install menu requires that drivers be on a 3.5-inch floppy, and I have it only on a CD, along with other install files. I can't access the CD drive from the F6 install menu, and without many spare 3.5-in disks at my disposal these daysit proves easier just to wait until I can use the CD. The kb/303013 article written for XP states that the ATAPI driver must be v5.1.2600.1135 or greater; with my W2K SP4 install, it's an earlier v.5.0.2195.6699 (good enough for W2Kaccording to kb/305098). If not, how can I download an updated version (kb/303013 indicates it's embedded in the XP SP1 install). "Dave Patrick" wrote: > "I always remove my PCI IDE controller card when installing" > > I don't know why one would do this. Install the controller driver via F6 > during text mode portion of setup. Also read the notes here carefully. > > http://support.microsoft.com/kb/305098 > > > > -- > > Regards, > > Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup. > Microsoft Certified Professional > Microsoft MVP [Windows] > http://www.microsoft.com/protect > > "zeke7" wrote: > > Dave--I always remove my PCI IDE controller card when installing W2K, just > > so > > it doesn't get confused; I wait until the OS is fully updated & > > operational > > before popping in the card and installing its driver with the Windows > > wizard. > > > > The /kb/303013 link you provided above led me to another one, > > /kb/331958/, > > (also written only for XP) that has me very suspicious: another nagging > > problem with my system is that the computer immediately reboots whenever > > running Shut Down (not 'Restart') from Windows, and Standby mode locks up > > the > > machine altogether (I have to hit the manual off switch to get it to stay > > off). The 331958 article implies the two issues may be related: > > > > "If you experience hard disk corruption, you may also experience other > > symptoms including problems starting, restarting, or shutting down Windows > > XP, problems running programs, or problems opening or saving documents." > > > > I tried the EnableBigLba regedt32 tweak described in /kb/303013, but it > > didn't fix the reboot problem. > >
Guest Andy Posted December 9, 2007 Posted December 9, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K On Fri, 7 Dec 2007 20:12:00 -0800, zeke7 <zeke7@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote: >Am consistently getting a corrupted C: drive on my desktop PC computer >running Windows 2000 SP4 with latest updates, firewall/virus etc installed. >At least 4 crashes / complete formats/reinstalls in as many weeks. Same >standard hardware & software (other than the latest Windows Updates) as when >it ran fine, for years; do have many new files for My Docs, however. Tried >installing on different hard disks, do a slow NTFS format beforehand, etc. >Recovery Console and Emergency Repair Disks have consistently been >unsuccessful in salvaging the installations. > >A detailed description of SW/HW/processes would be overly long; the >following is a summary in the hopes some of you recognize one of three >conditions described below as being definitely related to the crashes. After reading your other replies, I am still hazy as to what kind of disks you're using, what controller they're connected to, and how you're installing Windows 2000. One scenario that guarantees disk corruption is as follows: 1. start with a disk larger than 137GB in capacity 2. use software other than Windows 2000 setup to partition (to its full capacity) and format the disk 3. install Windows 2000, but fail to configure it to properly access past the 137GB point on the disk 4. start using the disk and filling it up; once Windows tries to access past the 137GB point, the lack of 48-bit LBA capability causes disk access to wrap around to the beginning of the disk, resulting in corruption. > >Typical incident is a couple of days or so after reloading all software and >about 120gb data files (about 20,000 digicamera jpgs, numerous mp3s, etc, >some with longish filenames), suddenly middle of doing something seemingly >unrelated, pop-up windows appear saying "C: drive [or folder therein] is >unreadable / corrupt. Run chkdsk." > >Have to reboot of course to run chkdsk, when it runs it finds thousands of >orphan file records to delete and index entries to fix, then the disk is >unbootable and lots of data and program / system files are missing; some are >recovered by chkdsk. One time a "C:\$Mft is corrupt and unreadable" message >precluded the crash. > >I think I have it narrowed down to 3 possible causes. Knowledgeable sorts >out there, please review and advise on which one you think it might be. I'm >going to avoid all three on my next reinstall, which I'm in the middle of, >until I hopefully get a consensus from you: > >1. Outlook 2002 (along with its required Office XP service packs) installed >on a system otherwise running Office 2000 Premium. On at least one crash (the >most recent), Outlook 2000 had been inadvertently installed coincidental with >Outlook 2002. (I need v.2002 so that I can synch my Outlook contacts with my >iPAQ PocketPC 2003 PDA). A problem initially starting that program after >installation led to a corrupt web access profile error for which MS KB >provided a fix. And during that latest crash, concurrent with the corrupt C: >drive message boxes popping up were boxes asking for the Outlook 2002 >installation CD, thoroughly irrelevant for what I was doing at the time. > >2. Long filenames. I've found a few data files that have long names locked >up in Windows 2000, unable to delete or rename them from Explorer and having >to run arcane commands/switches from the Command window to get rid of them. >These files include some mp3s, possibly some photos, and also some Windows >Update files downloaded to disk from Microsoft Update Catalog (not Windows >Update), which inexplicably appends a long string of alphanumeric characters >to many of its update downloads, some of which have already long filenames. >Restoration of data files from backup hard drives during re-installation >initially entailed copying directly from drive to drive in Explorer, most >recently using the Win2K Backup program. > >3. Reorganizing the disorganized plethora of shortcuts in the Program >shortcuts folders (C:\Documents and Settings\...\Start Menu\Programs) >resulting from a reinstall so that all are in the \All Users\ folder under a >handful of categorized parent folders. A little prior to one recent crash, >the system locked up when I moved one such folder group there that it >mistakenly thought were program files. And during the most recent crash >yesterday, the folders were reorganized successfully a few hours earlier, but >when the system crashed that was the first symptom noticed: copies of those >shortcuts (MS Office ones) placed in the Quick Launch toolbar started losing >their icon images; shortly thereafter the corrupt folder / C; drive messages >started popping up (along with the Outlook 2002 install disk requests) and >the system went down and out. > >That's it; already verbose. Obviously a major malfunction. Quick reactions >from the experts out there please: any of these situations ring a bell for >correlation with sudden NTFS disk corruption?
Guest zeke7 Posted December 9, 2007 Posted December 9, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K Andy: thanks for the input. Am using Western Digital Caviars, a 180 and 200gb; W2K crashed on both. Sometimes I have other ~200gb disks connected through a Promise UltraTX 100 IDE controller card. Motherboard is an ASUS P4C800-E. Regarding your points: 2. Always use Windows to format, a single partition. Sometimes I started the format from the Windows install disk, other times formatted the disk in Windows as a secondary drive while running Win2K from another disk. In all cases, used NTFS, the default sector size etc. 3. Intriguing: what do you mean by "fail to configure it to properly access > past the 137GB point on the disk"? Is there a configuration I need to run? I assumed that with SP4, this would be automated; is it not? Please advise. (In response to Dave's reply above, I just started doing the EnableBigLba regedt32 tweak described in /kb/303013; why isn't this included in the latest service pack or hotfix?) In the past, >137g disks have run fine on this machine and same OS. 4. This sounds like what's happened: it's after I populate the disk with my data files, which probably load it up past that limit. If that's the case, are you saying that the EnableBigLba tweak should fix this? "Andy" wrote: > On Fri, 7 Dec 2007 20:12:00 -0800, zeke7 > <zeke7@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote: > > >Am consistently getting a corrupted C: drive on my desktop PC computer > >running Windows 2000 SP4 with latest updates, firewall/virus etc installed. > >At least 4 crashes / complete formats/reinstalls in as many weeks. Same > >standard hardware & software (other than the latest Windows Updates) as when > >it ran fine, for years; do have many new files for My Docs, however. Tried > >installing on different hard disks, do a slow NTFS format beforehand, etc. > >Recovery Console and Emergency Repair Disks have consistently been > >unsuccessful in salvaging the installations. > > > >A detailed description of SW/HW/processes would be overly long; the > >following is a summary in the hopes some of you recognize one of three > >conditions described below as being definitely related to the crashes. > > After reading your other replies, I am still hazy as to what kind of > disks you're using, what controller they're connected to, and how > you're installing Windows 2000. > > One scenario that guarantees disk corruption is as follows: > 1. start with a disk larger than 137GB in capacity > 2. use software other than Windows 2000 setup to partition (to its > full capacity) and format the disk > 3. install Windows 2000, but fail to configure it to properly access > past the 137GB point on the disk > 4. start using the disk and filling it up; once Windows tries to > access past the 137GB point, the lack of 48-bit LBA capability causes > disk access to wrap around to the beginning of the disk, resulting in > corruption. > > > > >Typical incident is a couple of days or so after reloading all software and > >about 120gb data files (about 20,000 digicamera jpgs, numerous mp3s, etc, > >some with longish filenames), suddenly middle of doing something seemingly > >unrelated, pop-up windows appear saying "C: drive [or folder therein] is > >unreadable / corrupt. Run chkdsk." > > > >Have to reboot of course to run chkdsk, when it runs it finds thousands of > >orphan file records to delete and index entries to fix, then the disk is > >unbootable and lots of data and program / system files are missing; some are > >recovered by chkdsk. One time a "C:\$Mft is corrupt and unreadable" message > >precluded the crash. > > > >I think I have it narrowed down to 3 possible causes. Knowledgeable sorts > >out there, please review and advise on which one you think it might be. I'm > >going to avoid all three on my next reinstall, which I'm in the middle of, > >until I hopefully get a consensus from you: > > > >1. Outlook 2002 (along with its required Office XP service packs) installed > >on a system otherwise running Office 2000 Premium. On at least one crash (the > >most recent), Outlook 2000 had been inadvertently installed coincidental with > >Outlook 2002. (I need v.2002 so that I can synch my Outlook contacts with my > >iPAQ PocketPC 2003 PDA). A problem initially starting that program after > >installation led to a corrupt web access profile error for which MS KB > >provided a fix. And during that latest crash, concurrent with the corrupt C: > >drive message boxes popping up were boxes asking for the Outlook 2002 > >installation CD, thoroughly irrelevant for what I was doing at the time. > > > >2. Long filenames. I've found a few data files that have long names locked > >up in Windows 2000, unable to delete or rename them from Explorer and having > >to run arcane commands/switches from the Command window to get rid of them. > >These files include some mp3s, possibly some photos, and also some Windows > >Update files downloaded to disk from Microsoft Update Catalog (not Windows > >Update), which inexplicably appends a long string of alphanumeric characters > >to many of its update downloads, some of which have already long filenames. > >Restoration of data files from backup hard drives during re-installation > >initially entailed copying directly from drive to drive in Explorer, most > >recently using the Win2K Backup program. > > > >3. Reorganizing the disorganized plethora of shortcuts in the Program > >shortcuts folders (C:\Documents and Settings\...\Start Menu\Programs) > >resulting from a reinstall so that all are in the \All Users\ folder under a > >handful of categorized parent folders. A little prior to one recent crash, > >the system locked up when I moved one such folder group there that it > >mistakenly thought were program files. And during the most recent crash > >yesterday, the folders were reorganized successfully a few hours earlier, but > >when the system crashed that was the first symptom noticed: copies of those > >shortcuts (MS Office ones) placed in the Quick Launch toolbar started losing > >their icon images; shortly thereafter the corrupt folder / C; drive messages > >started popping up (along with the Outlook 2002 install disk requests) and > >the system went down and out. > > > >That's it; already verbose. Obviously a major malfunction. Quick reactions > >from the experts out there please: any of these situations ring a bell for > >correlation with sudden NTFS disk corruption? >
Guest Dave Patrick Posted December 9, 2007 Posted December 9, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K You can easily overcome this by attaching a floppy drive long enough to get through the install or look at doing an unattended installation. Given the problems I'd think you would be ready to overcome these problems. http://support.microsoft.com/kb/288344 Use the last article. I erroneously posted the XP article. http://support.microsoft.com/kb/305098 -- Regards, Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup. Microsoft Certified Professional Microsoft MVP [Windows] http://www.microsoft.com/protect "zeke7" wrote: >I do this because the W2K install menu requires that drivers be on a >3.5-inch > floppy, and I have it only on a CD, along with other install files. I > can't > access the CD drive from the F6 install menu, and without many spare > 3.5-in > disks at my disposal these daysit proves easier just to wait until I can > use > the CD. > > The kb/303013 article written for XP states that the ATAPI driver must be > v5.1.2600.1135 or greater; with my W2K SP4 install, it's an earlier > v.5.0.2195.6699 (good enough for W2Kaccording to kb/305098). If not, how > can > I download an updated version (kb/303013 indicates it's embedded in the XP > SP1 install).
Guest Dave Patrick Posted December 9, 2007 Posted December 9, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K This is why I asked you to read the document carefully. Operating systems that do not have 48-bit LBA support enabled by default (such as Microsoft Windows 98, Microsoft Windows Millennium Edition (Me), or Windows 2000) that are installed on a partition that spans beyond the 28-bit LBA boundary (137GB) will experience data corruption or data loss. The installation of operating systems that do not have 48-bit LBA support enabled by default (such as Windows 98, Windows Me, or Windows 2000) on a partition that is beyond the 28-bit LBA boundary (137 GB) is unsuccessful and leaves behind a temporary installation folder. -- Regards, Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup. Microsoft Certified Professional Microsoft MVP [Windows] http://www.microsoft.com/protect "zeke7" wrote: > Andy: thanks for the input. Am using Western Digital Caviars, a 180 and > 200gb; W2K crashed on both. Sometimes I have other ~200gb disks connected > through a Promise UltraTX 100 IDE controller card. Motherboard is an ASUS > P4C800-E. > > Regarding your points: > > 2. Always use Windows to format, a single partition. Sometimes I started > the > format from the Windows install disk, other times formatted the disk in > Windows as a secondary drive while running Win2K from another disk. In all > cases, used NTFS, the default sector size etc. > > 3. Intriguing: what do you mean by "fail to configure it to properly > access >> past the 137GB point on the disk"? Is there a configuration I need to >> run? I assumed that with SP4, this would be automated; is it not? Please >> advise. > > (In response to Dave's reply above, I just started doing the EnableBigLba > regedt32 tweak described in /kb/303013; why isn't this included in the > latest > service pack or hotfix?) In the past, >137g disks have run fine on this > machine and same OS. > > 4. This sounds like what's happened: it's after I populate the disk with > my > data files, which probably load it up past that limit. If that's the case, > are you saying that the EnableBigLba tweak should fix this?
Guest The Kat Posted December 9, 2007 Posted December 9, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K On Sat, 8 Dec 2007 19:04:01 -0800, zeke7 <zeke7@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote: >KAt--I mistyped above, meant to to say "... see IF the Intel App Accelerator >is needed"; I checked and it's not, only for older chipsets than what I have. That's good. Have you considered your power supply? That can also be a problem, if it is just beginning to go bad, AND if it's just 'dirty' power. -- Lumber Cartel (tinlc) #2063. Spam this account at your own risk. This sig censored by the Office of Home, Land & Planet Insecurity... Remove XYZ to email me
Guest zeke7 Posted December 10, 2007 Posted December 10, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K On Dec 9, 4:13 am, "Dave Patrick" <DSPatr...@nospam.gmail.com> wrote: > This is why I asked you to read the document carefully. > > Operating systems that do not have 48-bit LBA support enabled by default > (such as Microsoft Windows 98, Microsoft Windows Millennium Edition (Me), or > Windows 2000) that are installed on a partition that spans beyond the 28-bit > LBA boundary (137GB) will experience data corruption or data loss. > > The installation of operating systems that do not have 48-bit LBA support > enabled by default (such as Windows 98, Windows Me, or Windows 2000) on a > partition that is beyond the 28-bit LBA boundary (137 GB) is unsuccessful > and leaves behind a temporary installation folder. > > -- > > Regards, > > Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup. > Microsoft Certified Professional > Microsoft MVP [Windows]http://www.microsoft.com/protect > > "zeke7" wrote: > > Andy: thanks for the input. Am using Western Digital Caviars, a 180 and > > 200gb; W2K crashed on both. Sometimes I have other ~200gb disks connected > > through a Promise UltraTX 100 IDE controller card. Motherboard is an ASUS > > P4C800-E. > > > Regarding your points: > > > 2. Always use Windows to format, a single partition. Sometimes I started > > the > > format from the Windows install disk, other times formatted the disk in > > Windows as a secondary drive while running Win2K from another disk. In all > > cases, used NTFS, the default sector size etc. > > > 3. Intriguing: what do you mean by "fail to configure it to properly > > access > >> past the 137GB point on the disk"? Is there a configuration I need to > >> run? I assumed that with SP4, this would be automated; is it not? Please > >> advise. > > > (In response to Dave's reply above, I just started doing the EnableBigLba > > regedt32 tweak described in /kb/303013; why isn't this included in the > > latest > > service pack or hotfix?) In the past, >137g disks have run fine on this > > machine and same OS. > > > 4. This sounds like what's happened: it's after I populate the disk with > > my > > data files, which probably load it up past that limit. If that's the case, > > are you saying that the EnableBigLba tweak should fix this? Dave: have received lots of good input from various folks on this post; would like to reach a conclusion here: I believe this 48-bit LBA issue you've identified is the core problem I've experienced. Do you concur? If I perform the EnableBigLba regfix on a 200g disk with Win2K installed but not yet loaded with files past 137gb, are you confident this will stabilize the system regarding the problems I experienced when I do load it past 137gb? (A careful read of 305098 seems to imply this.) This is the first I've heard of this regfix. Though the issue may seem second-nature to Windows experts, it's not exactly intuitive from an end-user perspective to anticipate and seek out an answer to a problem they don't even know exists. Given the prevalence of >137gb hard drives for many years now, I'm flabbergasted why this regfix hasn't been incorporated in a Hotfix or SP release; I thought this kind of problem is what those releases are supposed to address.
Guest Dave Patrick Posted December 10, 2007 Posted December 10, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K Yes, I suspect it's the primary problem. The controller driver may be another. I think you'll want to install to a partition smaller than ~137 gB in size and temp connect a floppy drive so you can add the correct controller driver via F6 during text mode portion of setup. -- Regards, Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup. Microsoft Certified Professional Microsoft MVP [Windows] http://www.microsoft.com/protect "zeke7" wrote: > Dave: have received lots of good input from various folks on this > post; would like to reach a conclusion here: > > I believe this 48-bit LBA issue you've identified is the core problem > I've experienced. Do you concur? > > If I perform the EnableBigLba regfix on a 200g disk with Win2K > installed but not yet loaded with files past 137gb, are you confident > this will stabilize the system regarding the problems I experienced > when I do load it past 137gb? (A careful read of 305098 seems to imply > this.) > > This is the first I've heard of this regfix. Though the issue may seem > second-nature to Windows experts, it's not exactly intuitive from an > end-user perspective to anticipate and seek out an answer to a problem > they don't even know exists. Given the prevalence of >137gb hard > drives for many years now, I'm flabbergasted why this regfix hasn't > been incorporated in a Hotfix or SP release; I thought this kind of > problem is what those releases are supposed to address.
Guest zeke7 Posted December 10, 2007 Posted December 10, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K On Dec 9, 4:11 pm, "Dave Patrick" <DSPatr...@nospam.gmail.com> wrote: > Yes, I suspect it's the primary problem. The controller driver may be > another. I think you'll want to install to a partition smaller than ~137 gB > in size and temp connect a floppy drive so you can add the correct > controller driver via F6 during text mode portion of setup. > > -- > > Regards, > > Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup. > Microsoft Certified Professional > Microsoft MVP [Windows]http://www.microsoft.com/protect > > "zeke7" wrote: > > Dave: have received lots of good input from various folks on this > > post; would like to reach a conclusion here: > > > I believe this 48-bit LBA issue you've identified is the core problem > > I've experienced. Do you concur? > > > If I perform the EnableBigLba regfix on a 200g disk with Win2K > > installed but not yet loaded with files past 137gb, are you confident > > this will stabilize the system regarding the problems I experienced > > when I do load it past 137gb? (A careful read of 305098 seems to imply > > this.) > > > This is the first I've heard of this regfix. Though the issue may seem > > second-nature to Windows experts, it's not exactly intuitive from an > > end-user perspective to anticipate and seek out an answer to a problem > > they don't even know exists. Given the prevalence of >137gb hard > > drives for many years now, I'm flabbergasted why this regfix hasn't > > been incorporated in a Hotfix or SP release; I thought this kind of > > problem is what those releases are supposed to address. Dave--Thanks much for your advice and endurance ; ). [i'm not seeing some of your latest posts here going through the MS- TechNet website, but do see them using Google Groups; I wonder why?] BTW, another reason I pull the Promise controller card during installation is to save cumulative time given the numerous reboots required by the 75+ Windows 2K updates and other software installs, so each bootup can zip right into the MB BIOS and then launch Windows without having to wait for the controller card's BIOS initial, somewhat slow drive-detection process before reaching the MB BIOS. Each boot is a good bit speedier. Easy enough to pop in the card and install it later once Windows and other software are installed. (I did contact Promise for direction on which BIOS and driver to use for my card.)
Guest Dave Patrick Posted December 10, 2007 Posted December 10, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K Try connecting directly to news.microsoft.com http://www.microsoft.com/dynamics/community/joindiscussion.mspx Have these ones on hand prior to the install. Be sure to apply SP4 and these two below to your new install before connecting to any network. Internet included. (sasser, msblast) http://download.microsoft.com/download/E/6/A/E6A04295-D2A8-40D0-A0C5-241BFECD095E/W2KSP4_EN.EXE http://www.microsoft.com/technet/security/bulletin/MS03-043.mspx http://www.microsoft.com/technet/security/bulletin/MS03-049.mspx Then Rollup 1 for Microsoft Windows 2000 Service Pack 4 http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?amp;displaylang=en&familyid=B54730CF-8850-4531-B52B-BF28B324C662&displaylang=en -- Regards, Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup. Microsoft Certified Professional Microsoft MVP [Windows] http://www.microsoft.com/protect "zeke7" wrote: > Dave--Thanks much for your advice and endurance ; ). > > [i'm not seeing some of your latest posts here going through the MS- > TechNet website, but do see them using Google Groups; I wonder why?] > > BTW, another reason I pull the Promise controller card during > installation is to save cumulative time given the numerous reboots > required by the 75+ Windows 2K updates and other software installs, so > each bootup can zip right into the MB BIOS and then launch Windows > without having to wait for the controller card's BIOS initial, > somewhat slow drive-detection process before reaching the MB BIOS. > Each boot is a good bit speedier. Easy enough to pop in the card and > install it later once Windows and other software are installed. (I did > contact Promise for direction on which BIOS and driver to use for my > card.)
Guest Andy Posted December 10, 2007 Posted December 10, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K On Sat, 8 Dec 2007 23:04:00 -0800, zeke7 <zeke7@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote: >Andy: thanks for the input. Am using Western Digital Caviars, a 180 and >200gb; W2K crashed on both. Sometimes I have other ~200gb disks connected >through a Promise UltraTX 100 IDE controller card. Motherboard is an ASUS >P4C800-E. Funny coincidence, the first two large drives I purchased were Western Digital 200GB and 180GB drives in early 2003. > >Regarding your points: > >2. Always use Windows to format, a single partition. Sometimes I started the >format from the Windows install disk, other times formatted the disk in >Windows as a secondary drive while running Win2K from another disk. In all >cases, used NTFS, the default sector size etc. Windows 2000 setup is limited to 28-bit LBA (for the chipset interface), so if you use Windows 2000 setup to partition a disk connected to the motherboard ICH5R interface, the largest partition that can be created is 131,000 MB. > >3. Intriguing: what do you mean by "fail to configure it to properly access >> past the 137GB point on the disk"? Is there a configuration I need to run? I assumed that with SP4, this would be automated; is it not? Please advise. For Windows 2000, SP3 or SP4 plus EnableBigLBA = 1 in the registry. For Windows XP, SP1 or SP2. > >(In response to Dave's reply above, I just started doing the EnableBigLba >regedt32 tweak described in /kb/303013; why isn't this included in the latest >service pack or hotfix?) In the past, >137g disks have run fine on this >machine and same OS. With the disks fully loaded with data? > >4. This sounds like what's happened: it's after I populate the disk with my >data files, which probably load it up past that limit. If that's the case, >are you saying that the EnableBigLba tweak should fix this? Yes. EnableBigLBA is only needed and only works for large disks connected to the motherboard south bridge (ICH5R) interface. If you want to see its effect, connect a large, UNPARTITIONED disk to the ICH5R interface. Run Disk Management with EnableBigLBA = 1, and check the capacity of the drive. Repeat with EnableBigLBA = 0, and the capacity of the drive will be limited to 128GB. If the large disk is connected to an interface other than the motherboard chipset interface, then the Windows driver for that interface solely determines whether or not there is a 137GB limitation. > >"Andy" wrote: > >> On Fri, 7 Dec 2007 20:12:00 -0800, zeke7 >> <zeke7@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote: >> >> >Am consistently getting a corrupted C: drive on my desktop PC computer >> >running Windows 2000 SP4 with latest updates, firewall/virus etc installed. >> >At least 4 crashes / complete formats/reinstalls in as many weeks. Same >> >standard hardware & software (other than the latest Windows Updates) as when >> >it ran fine, for years; do have many new files for My Docs, however. Tried >> >installing on different hard disks, do a slow NTFS format beforehand, etc. >> >Recovery Console and Emergency Repair Disks have consistently been >> >unsuccessful in salvaging the installations. >> > >> >A detailed description of SW/HW/processes would be overly long; the >> >following is a summary in the hopes some of you recognize one of three >> >conditions described below as being definitely related to the crashes. >> >> After reading your other replies, I am still hazy as to what kind of >> disks you're using, what controller they're connected to, and how >> you're installing Windows 2000. >> >> One scenario that guarantees disk corruption is as follows: >> 1. start with a disk larger than 137GB in capacity >> 2. use software other than Windows 2000 setup to partition (to its >> full capacity) and format the disk >> 3. install Windows 2000, but fail to configure it to properly access >> past the 137GB point on the disk >> 4. start using the disk and filling it up; once Windows tries to >> access past the 137GB point, the lack of 48-bit LBA capability causes >> disk access to wrap around to the beginning of the disk, resulting in >> corruption. >> >> > >> >Typical incident is a couple of days or so after reloading all software and >> >about 120gb data files (about 20,000 digicamera jpgs, numerous mp3s, etc, >> >some with longish filenames), suddenly middle of doing something seemingly >> >unrelated, pop-up windows appear saying "C: drive [or folder therein] is >> >unreadable / corrupt. Run chkdsk." >> > >> >Have to reboot of course to run chkdsk, when it runs it finds thousands of >> >orphan file records to delete and index entries to fix, then the disk is >> >unbootable and lots of data and program / system files are missing; some are >> >recovered by chkdsk. One time a "C:\$Mft is corrupt and unreadable" message >> >precluded the crash. >> > >> >I think I have it narrowed down to 3 possible causes. Knowledgeable sorts >> >out there, please review and advise on which one you think it might be. I'm >> >going to avoid all three on my next reinstall, which I'm in the middle of, >> >until I hopefully get a consensus from you: >> > >> >1. Outlook 2002 (along with its required Office XP service packs) installed >> >on a system otherwise running Office 2000 Premium. On at least one crash (the >> >most recent), Outlook 2000 had been inadvertently installed coincidental with >> >Outlook 2002. (I need v.2002 so that I can synch my Outlook contacts with my >> >iPAQ PocketPC 2003 PDA). A problem initially starting that program after >> >installation led to a corrupt web access profile error for which MS KB >> >provided a fix. And during that latest crash, concurrent with the corrupt C: >> >drive message boxes popping up were boxes asking for the Outlook 2002 >> >installation CD, thoroughly irrelevant for what I was doing at the time. >> > >> >2. Long filenames. I've found a few data files that have long names locked >> >up in Windows 2000, unable to delete or rename them from Explorer and having >> >to run arcane commands/switches from the Command window to get rid of them. >> >These files include some mp3s, possibly some photos, and also some Windows >> >Update files downloaded to disk from Microsoft Update Catalog (not Windows >> >Update), which inexplicably appends a long string of alphanumeric characters >> >to many of its update downloads, some of which have already long filenames. >> >Restoration of data files from backup hard drives during re-installation >> >initially entailed copying directly from drive to drive in Explorer, most >> >recently using the Win2K Backup program. >> > >> >3. Reorganizing the disorganized plethora of shortcuts in the Program >> >shortcuts folders (C:\Documents and Settings\...\Start Menu\Programs) >> >resulting from a reinstall so that all are in the \All Users\ folder under a >> >handful of categorized parent folders. A little prior to one recent crash, >> >the system locked up when I moved one such folder group there that it >> >mistakenly thought were program files. And during the most recent crash >> >yesterday, the folders were reorganized successfully a few hours earlier, but >> >when the system crashed that was the first symptom noticed: copies of those >> >shortcuts (MS Office ones) placed in the Quick Launch toolbar started losing >> >their icon images; shortly thereafter the corrupt folder / C; drive messages >> >started popping up (along with the Outlook 2002 install disk requests) and >> >the system went down and out. >> > >> >That's it; already verbose. Obviously a major malfunction. Quick reactions >> >from the experts out there please: any of these situations ring a bell for >> >correlation with sudden NTFS disk corruption? >>
Guest zeke7 Posted December 10, 2007 Posted December 10, 2007 Re: 4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K On Dec 9, 10:21 pm, Andy <1...@2.3> wrote: > On Sat, 8 Dec 2007 23:04:00 -0800,zeke7 > > <ze...@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote: > >Andy: thanks for the input. Am using Western Digital Caviars, a 180 and > >200gb; W2K crashed on both. Sometimes I have other ~200gb disks connected > >through a Promise UltraTX 100 IDE controller card. Motherboard is an ASUS > >P4C800-E. > > Funny coincidence, the first two large drives I purchased were Western > Digital 200GB and 180GB drives in early 2003. > > > > >Regarding your points: > > >2. Always use Windows to format, a single partition. Sometimes I started the > >format from the Windows install disk, other times formatted the disk in > >Windows as a secondary drive while running Win2K from another disk. In all > >cases, used NTFS, the default sector size etc. > > Windows 2000 setup is limited to 28-bit LBA (for the chipset > interface), so if you use Windows 2000 setup to partition a disk > connected to the motherboard ICH5R interface, the largest partition > that can be created is 131,000 MB. > > > > >3. Intriguing: what do you mean by "fail to configure it to properly access > >> past the 137GB point on the disk"? Is there a configuration I need to run? I assumed that with SP4, this would be automated; is it not? Please advise. > > For Windows 2000, SP3 or SP4 plus EnableBigLBA = 1 in the registry. > For Windows XP, SP1 or SP2. > > > > >(In response to Dave's reply above, I just started doing the EnableBigLba > >regedt32 tweak described in /kb/303013; why isn't this included in the latest > >service pack or hotfix?) In the past, >137g disks have run fine on this > >machine and same OS. > > With the disks fully loaded with data? > > > > >4. This sounds like what's happened: it's after I populate the disk with my > >data files, which probably load it up past that limit. If that's the case, > >are you saying that the EnableBigLba tweak should fix this? > > Yes. > > EnableBigLBA is only needed and only works for large disks connected > to the motherboard south bridge (ICH5R) interface. If you want to see > its effect, connect a large, UNPARTITIONED disk to the ICH5R > interface. Run Disk Management with EnableBigLBA = 1, and check the > capacity of the drive. Repeat with EnableBigLBA = 0, and the capacity > of the drive will be limited to 128GB. > > If the large disk is connected to an interface other than the > motherboard chipset interface, then the Windows driver for that > interface solely determines whether or not there is a 137GB > limitation. > > > > >"Andy" wrote: > > >> On Fri, 7 Dec 2007 20:12:00 -0800,zeke7 > >> <ze...@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote: > > >> >Am consistently getting a corrupted C: drive on my desktop PC computer > >> >running Windows 2000 SP4 with latest updates, firewall/virus etc installed. > >> >At least 4 crashes / complete formats/reinstalls in as many weeks. Same > >> >standard hardware & software (other than the latest Windows Updates) as when > >> >it ran fine, for years; do have many new files for My Docs, however. Tried > >> >installing on different hard disks, do a slow NTFS format beforehand, etc. > >> >Recovery Console and Emergency Repair Disks have consistently been > >> >unsuccessful in salvaging the installations. > > >> >A detailed description of SW/HW/processes would be overly long; the > >> >following is a summary in the hopes some of you recognize one of three > >> >conditions described below as being definitely related to the crashes. > > >> After reading your other replies, I am still hazy as to what kind of > >> disks you're using, what controller they're connected to, and how > >> you're installing Windows 2000. > > >> One scenario that guarantees disk corruption is as follows: > >> 1. start with a disk larger than 137GB in capacity > >> 2. use software other than Windows 2000 setup to partition (to its > >> full capacity) and format the disk > >> 3. install Windows 2000, but fail to configure it to properly access > >> past the 137GB point on the disk > >> 4. start using the disk and filling it up; once Windows tries to > >> access past the 137GB point, the lack of 48-bit LBA capability causes > >> disk access to wrap around to the beginning of the disk, resulting in > >> corruption. > > >> >Typical incident is a couple of days or so after reloading all software and > >> >about 120gb data files (about 20,000 digicamera jpgs, numerous mp3s, etc, > >> >some with longish filenames), suddenly middle of doing something seemingly > >> >unrelated, pop-up windows appear saying "C: drive [or folder therein] is > >> >unreadable / corrupt. Run chkdsk." > > >> >Have to reboot of course to run chkdsk, when it runs it finds thousands of > >> >orphan file records to delete and index entries to fix, then the disk is > >> >unbootable and lots of data and program / system files are missing; some are > >> >recovered by chkdsk. One time a "C:\$Mft is corrupt and unreadable" message > >> >precluded the crash. > > >> >I think I have it narrowed down to 3 possible causes. Knowledgeable sorts > >> >out there, please review and advise on which one you think it might be. I'm > >> >going to avoid all three on my next reinstall, which I'm in the middle of, > >> >until I hopefully get a consensus from you: > > >> >1. Outlook 2002 (along with its required Office XP service packs) installed > >> >on a system otherwise running Office 2000 Premium. On at least one crash (the > >> >most recent), Outlook 2000 had been inadvertently installed coincidental with > >> >Outlook 2002. (I need v.2002 so that I can synch my Outlook contacts with my > >> >iPAQ PocketPC 2003 PDA). A problem initially starting that program after > >> >installation led to a corrupt web access profile error for which MS KB > >> >provided a fix. And during that latest crash, concurrent with the corrupt C: > >> >drive message boxes popping up were boxes asking for the Outlook 2002 > >> >installation CD, thoroughly irrelevant for what I was doing at the time. > > >> >2. Long filenames. I've found a few data files that have long names locked > >> >up in Windows 2000, unable to delete or rename them from Explorer and having > >> >to run arcane commands/switches from the Command window to get rid of them. > >> >These files include some mp3s, possibly some photos, and also some Windows > >> >Update files downloaded to disk from Microsoft Update Catalog (not Windows > >> >Update), which inexplicably appends a long string of alphanumeric characters > >> >to many of its update downloads, some of which have already long filenames. > >> >Restoration of data files from backup hard drives during re-installation > >> >initially entailed copying directly from drive to drive in Explorer, most > >> >recently using the Win2K Backup program. > > >> >3. Reorganizing the disorganized plethora of shortcuts in the Program > >> >shortcuts folders (C:\Documents and Settings\...\Start Menu\Programs) > >> >resulting from a reinstall so that all are in the \All Users\ folder under a > >> >handful of categorized parent folders. A little prior to one recent crash, > >> >the system locked up when I moved one such folder group there that it > >> >mistakenly thought were program files. And during the most recent crash > >> >yesterday, the folders were reorganized successfully a few hours earlier, but > >> >when the system crashed that was the first symptom noticed: copies of those > >> >shortcuts (MS Office ones) placed in the Quick Launch toolbar started losing > >> >their icon images; shortly thereafter the corrupt folder / C; drive messages > >> >started popping up (along with the Outlook 2002 install disk requests) and > >> >the system went down and out. > > >> >That's it; already verbose. Obviously a major malfunction. Quick reactions > >> >from the experts out there please: any of these situations ring a bell for > >> >correlation with sudden NTFS disk corruption? Thanks for that, Andy. With your and Dave's input, I'm breathing a good bit easier now. Couldn't the EnableBigLBA reg-tweak have been incorporated into a SP or Hotfix? It seems harmless enough for users who don't need it, but invaluable for the ones who do. BTW, I usually have formatted the disks (single-partition) while running W2K SP4 on another disk, using Explorer's Format menu (no partition options in there), not liking what I saw with the W2K install disk reporting a 137gb drive. The large disks loaded with data that ran fine previously may well have been connected only through an IDE controller card (this is an old machine I pulled out of storage after being on the road for 3 years, so recall is a bit vague).
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